'New Colletts from Old'

[K14]

On the battery boxes, I see that on the new Hornbys, they are suspended by two pillars at the front, and what looks like a moulding at the rear, which may be a 'design clever' Hornby idea for strength.  Apart from whether this is prototypical, i have wondered whether the designs varied over the years.  The Comet ones differ from the Hornby and other makes, regarding the fastenings of the covers (for instance).

 

Perhaps K14 and others may have information on this.

 

Any thought on that subject please?

Howard, I think they did.  Frogmore Confederacy offer two different etches, pre and post 1935 I think.

 

Chris

The boxes themselves seem to be standard - 53-3/4" wide by 24-1/4" tall by 14" deep, but the suspension brackets change pattern from a pair of rectangular plain bars 3-3/4" x 3/4" that wrap around the ends of the box to bars of the same section but with a stiffening portion  1-1/2" wide extending around the bottom edge of each bracket. It looks like this is what the Frogmore etches represent.

 

The main door & the subsidiary 'topping up' door are secured by either simple L-shaped friction catches, or a rather more fancy flat catch with a turned handle.

 

One other thing to note, is that Brake vehicles with battery boxes near a bogie seem to have all been fitted with an 18" wide spark guard. 111, 1184, 5787 and 7371 all have this feature, but none of the 'non-brake' coaches have them despite the boxes being in near identical positions.

 

Photos...

 

'Old' style box under full brake 111 (also showing spark guard to the left):—

 

 

Later pattern under 7371 with 'fancy' catch:—

 

 

Same but with plain catch:—

 

 

Spark guard as fitted to 7371:—

 

 

I'm working on a drawing of all this, will post a PDF of it when finished.

 

Pete.

[St Enodoc]

The boxes themselves seem to be standard - 53-3/4" wide by 24-1/4" tall by 14" deep, but the suspension brackets change pattern from a pair of rectangular plain bars 3-3/4" x 3/4" that wrap around the ends of the box to bars of the same section but with a stiffening portion  1-1/2" wide extending around the bottom edge of each bracket. It looks like this is what the Frogmore etches represent.

 

The main door & the subsidiary 'topping up' door are secured by either simple L-shaped friction catches, or a rather more fancy flat catch with a turned handle.

 

One other thing to note, is that Brake vehicles with battery boxes near a bogie seem to have all been fitted with an 18" wide spark guard. 111, 1184, 5787 and 7371 all have this feature, but none of the 'non-brake' coaches have them despite the boxes being in near identical positions.

 

Photos...

 

'Old' style box under full brake 111 (also showing spark guard to the left):—

 

111-BB.jpg

 

Later pattern under 7371 with 'fancy' catch:—

 

BB08.jpg

 

Same but with plain catch:—

 

BB09.jpg

 

Spark guard as fitted to 7371:—

 

Spark-Guard-7371.jpg

 

I'm working on a drawing of all this, will post a PDF of it when finished.

 

Pete.

Pete, is the spark guard at the handbrake end?

[K14]

Pete, is the spark guard at the handbrake end?

 

They're fitted at the outer ends of both boxes. The last photo in my post shows the box furthest from the brake compartment on 7371 - under the corridor, roughly around the second 3rd class compartment.

 

P.

[St Enodoc]

They're fitted at the outer ends of both boxes. The last photo in my post shows the box furthest from the brake compartment on 7371 - under the corridor, roughly around the second 3rd class compartment.

 

P.

Thanks Pete. I was just wondering if they were there to protect the boxes from sparks if a handbrake was left on - obviously not.

[Penrhos1920]

Lofty what designs can you reasonably make from the Hornby railroad coaches? What have you made so far?

[HowardGWR]

They're fitted at the outer ends of both boxes. The last photo in my post shows the box furthest from the brake compartment on 7371 - under the corridor, roughly around the second 3rd class compartment.

 

P.

Some interesting 'weathering' challenges for modellers there Pete!  That was all very helpful indeed.

[lofty1966]

Lofty what designs can you reasonably make from the Hornby railroad coaches? What have you made so far?

It really depends on how mad you wanna go.

I spiced up about 10 Railroad Composites a couple of D95 Brakes and two H33 restaurants before I started really attacking cut-n-shuts

 

I have so far completed a D94 left and right hand (I have another L/H awaiting painting with corrected guards area)

D95 L/H (not worth doing now as Hornby's new range is excellent)

E128

H25 restaurant (essentially an H33 with flat ends)

In construction

H29 restaurant with 6 wheel bogies

H26 restaurant with 9ft Bogies

E111 flat ended 70ft

C44 70ft with one bow end and one flat

E109 70ft bow ended

D83 70ft Flat end Brake

D84 70ft with one bow end and one flat

A18 ex articulated stock

Later stock below bring up the issue of recessed grab handles

A L/H and R/H E146 (though not sure L/H should exist. Russell's shows a pic saying "built as R/H" which I took that L/H were also produced)

 

 

I am looking at possibly doing E148

And chewing over an H39/40 combo

 

With the 70ft stock I think you can also do

D82

D90

C45

C46

Those on here with way more knowledge than I possess can probably add to the list .

 

A lot depends on how comfortable you are with cutting multiple sections.

My D83 has eight sections spliced down one side alone.

Choosing where too cut roof sections has been a big learning curve too (I recommend next to the ribs. Easier to hide the join!)

Edited January 15, 2017 by lofty1966

[chrisf]

Beware of the E148.  It has a different body profile which is as near as dammit vertical above the waist.

 

Chris

[Prometheus]

I'm currently doing a K38 with Comet sides.

 

Tony

[lofty1966]

Beware of the E148. It has a different body profile which is as near as dammit vertical above the waist.

 

Chris

Pretty much what the Railroads are anyway.

[Horsetan]

It really depends on how mad you wanna go.....

 

There's a lot to be said for going mad.

[lofty1966]

Suddenly those truss bars earlier seem quite appealing.

Steps....urgh

[HowardGWR]

What materials for the steps are you using Lofty1966?  Folded brass /ns?

 

 

As a footnote, some coaches apparently have the bottom left step reversed (support above not below)..  I don't know which though.  Anyone have the answer please? 

Edited January 22, 2017 by HowardGWR

[lofty1966]

What materials for the steps are you using L? Folded brass /ns?

As a footnote, some coaches apparently have the bottom left step reversed (support above not below).. I don't know which though. Anyone have the answer please?

1.5 mm "angle iron" plasticard micro strip from evergreen.

I know on some the bottom left steps are reversed because of the lamp iron.

Edited January 22, 2017 by lofty1966

[Coach bogie]

Anyone looking for discounted 'New' Colletts. Rails have split the Bristolian set and is selling off the 3 coaches for £89.50 - less than £30 each.

 

https://railsofsheffield.com/rake-of-3-the-bristolian-gwr-chocolate-cream-collett-coaches-r3401coaches-Hornby-JJJA32849.aspx?utm_source=Mailing+List&utm_campaign=6f165e64e7-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2017_01_22&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_74d01bc2ed-6f165e64e7-5280005

 

Mike Wiltshire

Edited January 22, 2017 by Coach bogie

[kandc_au]

Lofty,

Where did you source the footstep detail for the ends please?

I'm buggered if I can find any details anywhere, for the accurate placement of the steps for any of the pass vehicles.

From some pics some don't have them on both sides either from what I can see.

 

Khris

[Prometheus]

I'd very much appreciate some assistance with this query please - thanks.

 

I'm about to paint the Comet sides for a K38 'Ocean Mails' coach. It will need to be lettered not to be out of synch with the last of the GWR liveries, the '42-'47 scheme. I cannot find a photograph anywhere of a K38 liveried in this way for that time-frame. Is anyone able to point me in the direction of one [or post one on here] ? Harris only seems to have a far-earlier illustration.

 

If the above is not possible, would the coach have been lettered with a 'GWR' and the double shield below the letters or 'GREAT double shield WESTERN' ?

 

Thanks in advance, again.

 

Tony

[81C]

Tony I would think war time it might have had just the roundel as not many if any coaches got painted in that period.

Heres a few to look at https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=ocean+mails+coach&espv=2&biw=1920&bih=950&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi-zM-z2drRAhWhI8AKHf3PCsMQ_AUIBygC

[Prometheus]

Thank you for the reply 81C - appreciated.

 

I always try to avoid Exley examples as their notion of correct lettering was sometimes just a little arbitrary. The GoldenAge Models version is probably the one that I'll run with as I've a feeling that livery was used a little again after the Roundel disappeared. Any views out there on that ?

 

Thanks you all.

 

Tony

[lofty1966]

Lofty,

Where did you source the footstep detail for the ends please?

I'm buggered if I can find any details anywhere, for the accurate placement of the steps for any of the pass vehicles.

From some pics some don't have them on both sides either from what I can see.

 

Khris

It is a bit of a guess to be honest and there maybe some 'artistic license '

In the end I took the placings from some MAJ kit ends as after careful inspection of photos with a lit magnifier , I still couldn't make out some detail on some coaches.

Russells Gt Western appdx Vol 1 shows a lot of end details but rarely both ends of the same coach dia.

So if they are wrong I apologize to the purists (but a purist shouldn't be playing with Railroad Collett's in the first place)

[nigel newling]

Collett van thirds did not have a rooftop water tank at the van end and, consequently, no end steps at that end either

[HowardGWR]

Collett van thirds did not have a rooftop water tank at the van end and, consequently, no end steps at that end either

Nor handrails from sides up to roof  -but yes to grip rails near lamp holder each side.  New Hornby D95 has those.

 

I am making progress with my two projects (nothing like as speedily as Lofty1966 sadly) but have endured many harassments with the second project (using Railroad sides with Comet ends and roof.)  The idea was to avoid having to paint and line, but the glueing job got so messy, that I now have to paint, after cleaning up, so the whole purpose has been defeated.  My advice is thus, don't go down this route, depending on what your personal modelling weakness is.

 

Here is the culprit baking the epoxy on the radiator.  Is that a good idea by the way?

 

Edited January 24, 2017 by HowardGWR

[Coach bogie]

Exception to the rule being the D122 artic brake thirds that was rebuilt to match D95 1925 stock style though of a slightly different length, missing a window in the van section and end steps at both ends.

 

Mike Wiltshire

[Horsetan]

....

Here is the culprit baking the epoxy on the radiator.  Is that a good idea by the way?

SDC12071.JPG

 

Will it warp?

[lofty1966]

Collett van thirds did not have a rooftop water tank at the van end and, consequently, no end steps at that end either

But the 70ft brakes have steps at both ends as far as I can make out

Edited January 25, 2017 by lofty1966