Vac fitted/piped wagons

[cheesysmith]

I have a simple question. When BR started its mass vac fitting program in the 50s and 60s, how many of the older wagons would have been fitted or through piped? By this I mean non BR designs. I know things like the LNER steel 13t open was, but that was just a design that was repeated under BR and could be classed as a standard wagon. I also know that a lot of the old LMS opens also got fitted. Also, I know a lot of wagons originally built unfitted were retrofitted.

 

I see on his workbench that Justin has done a fitted version of the GWR 12t open wagon, a wagon only built in small numbers and of circa 1935 vintage. how did they decide what wagons got fitted?

 

Also, would older wagons like the LMS tube and plate wagons be retrofitted as through piped wagons?

[CloggyDog]

I do know that many of the Gunpowder Vans that the big 4 built unfitted were vacuum braked under BR (as well as building a further quantity themselves). In some cases this was a simple addition of vacuum brake gear, in others the W-irons were also replaced.

[The Johnster]

Ah, a simple question.  Why do they never have simple answers?

 

As a very general rule, pre-nationalisation opens and vans were vacuum fitted if they were of wartime or post war construction, and scrapped otherwise; these would include LMS and LNER sliding door vans with corrugated steel ends and their associated opens, SR uneven and even planked and plywood vans, many of which were built for the Ministry of Supply during the war and sold on to the other railways, and GW 'Parto' vans; of course, some of all of those types were already fitted and XP rated.  Few older vehicles survived beyond about 1963, when falling traffic and the Beeching effect meant a massive cull.  

 

Of stock with vacuum pipes, 'bags', hanging off the ends, fitted was more common than vacuum piped through, which was mostly brake vans and specialist vehicles with air brakes such as ferry vans or tanks, and some chemical tanks including some labelled 'OCTEL' which were still running in the mid 70s.  Other specialist vehicles such as gunpoweder vans, bogie bolster and bogie well, weltrol and so on were often older stock which survived because it tended to have lower mileage or, in the case of the gpvs, the metal bodies were in good condition.  Cattle vans, regularly cleaned and scrubbed, could be fairly elderly as well, but I do not remember any being unfitted in BR days.  A vac fitted wagon's vacuum pipe was painted red, while a through pipe on an unfitted wagon was painted white.  When marshalling a part fitted train with a fitted head, the last 4 axles of the head must be fitted and the brakes working before the train preparation slip is signed by the guard.

 

Oil and other tank wagons mostly lasted until the mid 60s when the vac braked 'A' and 'B' 60mph ones came out; these were another haven of unfitted and piped stock, being private owner.  I am not familiar with other regions' practice, but on the WR, the 6-wheel milk tanks which were pre-war GWR fitted stock lasted until the end of the milk traffic in the 80s.  There was a regular working of tar tank wagons which were unfitted from the Van tar plant in Caerphilly well into at least the mid 70s.  Ex GW bogie bolster were another long lived unfitted survival, and could run at 60mph!  You mention the Tube and Plate wagons; outside my field of expertise but I would work on the principle that they were replaced by BR versions except in the very early BR period.

 

The above is a general guide, not any sort of absolute definitive answer to your simple question, and examples will be available to disprove every point I have made above.  Service vehicles (Per Way, S & T, Civil Engineer's) could be proper museum pieces and minerals are a whole nother thing.

 

Small numbers of very early BR standard vans and opens were built unfitted as well, but did not last long before retrofitting with vac brakes; probably best to avoid them unless you want to stress the unusual...

[Fat Controller]

Factors in deciding which general merchandise vehicles to vacuum-fit seemed to include the vehicle's age and general condition, whether the solebar was wood or steel , and whether the wheelbase was 9' or 10'.

The only fitted Tubes I've seen were built as such, either the LNER type with full drop sides, or the BR type that was developed from an LMS unfitted type.

I never saw an ex-LMS Plate that had been fitted; however fitted LNER ones were quite common. I think some may have been built as such, but many had been converted, gaining LNER-style 8 shoe brakes, BR-style 'plate axleguards, Oleo buffers and roller bearings. The large numbers that I saw around Duport's Llanelli plant seemed to be equally divided between BR and LNER built fitted types.

There were three types of vehicle that often had the fittings for vacuum brakes but which only recieved it belatedly, if at all. These were the 16t minerals, the 27t ore tipplers with the lower body, and the Dia1/007 Pig Iron wagons.