Best Standard Points

[28XX]

A very basic question. I need to buy the points for my fiddle / storage yard. Due to space constraints they will have to be 2nd radius (17 1/4") and therefore insulfrog. Of the many variations by different manufacturers made over the years, which do the TEAM think are the most reliable? Aesthetics is not an issue. Thanks in anticipation.

[DCB]

Peco.    

 

But unless you cut the 2nd radius point  around  the Peco streamline small Y points and small (2ft)m turnouts and esopecially the 3 way point take up less space than 2nd radius set track.  You can easily get 6 roads per foot width with streamline you will struggle for 5 with 2nd Radius.

[28XX]

Thanks David. I have got some 3 way points in the plan and 51mm track centres between storage roads. There is a complete circle of second radius in the middle which allows up and down trains to return whence they came or continue around the whole layout to reappear roundy-roundy style. The R2 points lie in the circle, as well as elsewhere.

[ejstubbs]

Per what David says, you won't get 51mm track centres between your fiddle yard storage roads using Setrack points without cutting them down - they're designed for 67m track centres.

 

If you need to incorporate fiddle yard points in your second radius circle I'd suggest you look at using the short Streamline points, and cutting 12° out of a 22.5° or 45° second radius curve to get back to the Setrack angles.  You'll probably need to adjust things with a few short sections of straight track as well, but it's easily do-able.  The diagram below gives and indication of how using short Streamline turnouts in conjunction with Setrack curves can be made to work - the blue circle is 8 x 45° second radius curves forming a circle:

 

[The Johnster]

My instinct would be Peco Setrack, but you will need to go Streamline if you want to use a 3-way.  In which direction is your space constrained, lengthways or across, or both!  I ask because it is important if your FY is to be used to 'crane shunt' (now there's a term that dates me!) locos from one end of a train to t'other, or get at vehicles, you need to leave space between roads for your fingers to get down in there and manipulate, not to mention use the coupling pole if you need one!  I have 4 FY roads at 2½" centres on a FY board 9" across, and might have squeezed in another 2 had it not been for this requirement and if I'd not minded them overlapping the edges a bit!

 

If your layout is a roundyroundy, then there is much less need for fingers to get inbetween the trains, and you can space your tracks more closely; if this is the case, then the narrow spacing afforded be Streamline geometry might be an advantage.

[Il Grifone]

How about building the fiddle yard as a traverser? This would save on expensive pointwork and enables all the available space to be used for storage.

 

For pointwork, I would go for Peco, if only for it's easy availability. (This is not to criticise - it is an excellent product.)

[The Johnster]

Trouble with traversers and sector plates is that they need width, behind and in front, and if 28xx is restricted for space in that way, a traverser may not be suitable.  I rejected the idea for my BLT for this reason.  If he/she is looking to save space lengthways and can accommodate the overrun of a traverser, it is ideal!

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

... There is a complete circle of second radius in the middle which allows up and down trains to return whence they came or continue around the whole layout to reappear roundy-roundy style. The R2 points lie in the circle, as well as elsewhere.

 I would seriously suggest avoiding the R2 point completely and redesigning if you want decent running reliability. It may mean you can do less in the space available, that's a compromise you have to assess for acceptability. I'd take running reliability over a lost but unreliable routing possibility any day, but as ever YMMV.

[DCB]

The return to the same storage road whether an up train or down is great in practice if you can make it work, but my effectively abandoned loft

layout which has this feature is a nightmare electrically. And has never been completed for this reason. It should have been automatic but it needed

so many relays it was completely beyond my budget.

However the ability to run any train out of sequence in either direction is a major time saver compared to fiddly fiddle yards or monster traversers

and should repay the effort needed to make it run reliably, maybe check rails or negative cant might help with long slow trains on 2nd Radius?

[The Johnster]

I'm making some assumptions here, that you are using tension lock couplers and do not intend to propel stock into your fiddle yard, even an auto train or dmu.  If you have locomotives drawing stock, not propelling or with power cars on each end, you should get away with R2 pointwork, but try to avoid having reverse curves over it.  DavidC is right; if your layout does not run reliably it is a failure on all levels; it is hard to make the decision to cut out or shorten a road and not be able to run something you want to, but scale and track geometry are cruel disciplines sometimes, particularly if you model large main line locomotives and long bogie stock!

 

I consider myself pushing matters as far as anyone should on my BLT, which has Peco Small Radius turnouts, 2 foot radius, and a fiddle yard in 2 parts, an original and a 'new yard' extension which took advantage of a re-arrangemnt of the bedroom it lives in; this is approached over a R3 radius double curve.  I would not dare to propel on it and my autos are stored in the 'old yard'!  There are no reverse curves over which stock is propelled anywhere on the layout, but I am still unable to use scale couplings because of lock buffering.

 

Many years ago, a very experienced modeller gave me the advise that you never have the space you thought you had when the track is finally laid, and it is best to err on the side of minimalism when you are planning.  I have always tried to design a bit of spare room into my layouts, and it always gets used up.