GWR 4 or 6 wheel full brake coach

[Richard Mawer]

Does anyone know if there are any kits for OO gauge 4 or 6 wheel GWR full brake coaches? 1930’s layout.

 

Rich

Edited January 15, 2019 by Richard Mawer

[Miss Prism]

1930s is a bit late for 4- and 6-wheel PBVs.
 
For an earlier era, V1, V2, V5, V13. W1, W2.

[phil_sutters]

Conversion of Ratio 4-wheelers using etched sides seems to be the only way. https://www.dartcastings.co.uk/shire.php#OOGaugeEtchedSidestoConvertRatioCoaches  Odd backwaters like Wrington Vale seem to have found a use for 4-wheelers after they disappeared elsewhere.

Edited January 15, 2019 by phil_sutters

[Harlequin]

1930s is a bit late for 4- and 6-wheel PBVs.

 

For an earlier era, V1, V2, V5, V13. W1, W2.

Thank goodness for gwr.org.uk!

 

It's a shame there are so many NLA (No Longer Available) items in that list...

[DKGL]

Conversion of Ratio 4-wheelers using etched sides seems to be the only way. https://www.dartcastings.co.uk/shire.php#OOGaugeEtchedSidestoConvertRatioCoaches  Odd backwaters like Wrington Vale seem to have found a use for 4-wheelers after they disappeared elsewhere.

Had some spare Ratio sides from an earlier 009 project.

Cobbled together the attached. Not exactly correct.

[Richard Mawer]

Conversion of Ratio 4-wheelers using etched sides seems to be the only way. https://www.dartcastings.co.uk/shire.php#OOGaugeEtchedSidestoConvertRatioCoaches  Odd backwaters like Wrington Vale seem to have found a use for 4-wheelers after they disappeared elsewhere.

 

Thanks for this. That's a great way to go for me.

 

Rich

[Richard Mawer]

1930s is a bit late for 4- and 6-wheel PBVs.

 

For an earlier era, V1, V2, V5, V13. W1, W2.

 

Its not for mainline use. Its to trail behind a short rake of milk tanks on a very secondary line. The assumption being that it is a very old brake almost left lying around and pressed into use.

[Richard Mawer]

Thanks for all the help.

 

Rich

[Il Grifone]

A couple of Tri-ang brake ends left over from making all thirds can be stuck together on a Ratio underframe to make guards and parcels vans. The clerestorys need removal of course.

[Miss Prism]

Its not for mainline use. Its to trail behind a short rake of milk tanks on a very secondary line. The assumption being that it is a very old brake almost left lying around and pressed into use.

 

Milk tanks were heavy, and required serious braking capacity. They had their own of course, but brake vehicles running with them tended to be reasonably modern, and definitely 8-wheeled.

[tomparryharry]

May I suggest try London Road Models. They make an ex-Taff Vale full brake.

 

As Miss Prism has mentioned, they were mostly condemned, or to departmental work by the 1930's. The last two I ever saw was at Cross Inn, and Beddau. This was 1971, and both vehicles were on their very last legs.

 

Ian.

[phil_sutters]

A couple of Tri-ang brake ends left over from making all thirds can be stuck together on a Ratio underframe to make guards and parcels vans. The clerestorys need removal of course.

Here's one I made earlier - 50 years earlier! The axleguards are a Triang bogie cut in half and stuck on far too close to the ends. The footboards were from an Airfix brake van kit. I suspect that the guard's door and the ducket are probably the wrong way round. I see that the Triang clerestorys are to be reintroduced to the Hornby range, which should cut the ridiculously high second-hand price down.

Edited January 16, 2019 by phil_sutters

[Penrhos1920]

Does anyone know if there are any kits for OO gauge 4 or 6 wheel GWR full brake coaches? 1930’s layout.

Rich

Many milk train full brakes were converted from redundant 4 wheel saloons in the 1920s & 30s. Whilst I don't know for definite, it's possible that a G20 was converted. The G20 is available from Shirescenes as sides to put on a ratio kit. A photo of a converted saloon is here http://penrhos.me.uk/Mdiags.shtml#O29, and the original G20 is up the page.

[Nearholmer]

Were the saloons converted to brake-vans for milk trains or simply milk vans? I read it be the latter, but am an ignoramus wrt the GWR.

 

Incidentally, I think this picture shows a mainline milk tank train with a four-wheel brakevan, although it might be six-wheel http://www.warwickshirerailways.com/gwr/gwrsrh281.htm

 

The van on a fully fitted train isn’t there to provide brake force, it’s a place for the guard to ride, so whether it was four, six, or bogie would be about stability at the required operating speed, and space for any non-tank traffic being carried.

 

Which rather contradicts Miss Prism; I hope no offence is taken.

Edited January 16, 2019 by Nearholmer

[Prometheus]

This one was easy enough to construct: Ratio roof and under-frame adapted to accept a body made from parts from two Triang Clerestory Brakes.

 

 

Tony

[Miss Prism]

Were the saloons converted to brake-vans for milk trains or simply milk vans? I read it be the latter, but am an ignoramus wrt the GWR.

 

The G-diagram conversions are 'Milk & Fruit Van', 'Fruit & Parcels Van' and 'Parcels Van' (as given in the left-hand column of Richard's page). All very exotic. For all of these, any milk carrying was confined to churns. None of them would have got near trains of milk tanks.

[Nearholmer]

This thread covers much the same ground and includes link to photo of a diagram O13 4W milk train brake of 1930s vintage.

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/55840-full-brake-for-a-milk-train/

 

Direct link to the preserved O13 https://www.svrwiki.com/GWR_1399_Milk_Brake possibly a bit rare and posh for a branchline.

 

Thanks Miss P, you confirm my reading.

Edited January 16, 2019 by Nearholmer

[Il Grifone]

Here's my V5 from two Tri-ang clerestories on a Ratio underframe,

 

 

and a W1 parcels van pure Ratio.

 

 

They were done many years ago and have suffered some damage. The W1 still needs its crest. Both still need to be finished....

Edited January 17, 2019 by Il Grifone

[Richard Mawer]

Were the saloons converted to brake-vans for milk trains or simply milk vans? I read it be the latter, but am an ignoramus wrt the GWR.

Incidentally, I think this picture shows a mainline milk tank train with a four-wheel brakevan, although it might be six-wheel http://www.warwickshirerailways.com/gwr/gwrsrh281.htm

The van on a fully fitted train isn’t there to provide brake force, it’s a place for the guard to ride, so whether it was four, six, or bogie would be about stability at the required operating speed, and space for any non-tank traffic being carried.

Which rather contradicts Miss Prism; I hope no offence is taken.

That picture is almost identical to what I am running! 3 six wheel tanks and a passenger brake! Thanks

[Nearholmer]

In the other thread that I linked to, there is a link to yet another thread (!) containing a rather inconclusive discussion of what exact type of vehicle it might be. IIRC the "best bet" was an ex-Barry Railway 6W passenger brake, but the longer I stare at the picture, the more I think it is a 4W vehicle, but not being a GWR-o-phile I am at a loss as to exactly what type.

Edited January 17, 2019 by Nearholmer

[brianusa]

Maybe not a Mogul but close enough!

 

 

For GWR -0-philes and others.  Hornby four wheel milk tanks and Passenger Brake in the UP Refuge with a County.

 

Brian.

Edited January 19, 2019 by brianusa

[MrWolf]

My take on a milk train, as yet unfinished, cut and shut Triang / Ratio V5 PBV and a pair of second-hand K's 6 wheel siphons. Having read this article, I have been reminded to get them all up to scratch. In between a billion other jobs of course.