OO scale motorised semaphore signals.

[Jim]

Hi, I’m hoping that this is the best section to ask this.

I’m currently using Cobalt levers to operate my point motors. I’m operate them purely by passing contact analogue to keep things simple.

 

I’m now at the stage of fitting signals.

I want to operate them in a similar fashion, just by using the passing contact wiring cobalt levers.

Im assuming the signals will have a solenoid rather than a motor.

 

I would much appreciate some advice on what signal kits are available. I’ve looked up the Dapol ones but don’t know if they can be used by passing contact type operation.

 

cheers

jim. 

[Chris White]

C Parkstone's Railway and Dapol Signals DCC Concepts.

 

Personally I'd have thought you'd only want to connect to one of the passing contacts rather than splitting one of the Dapol wires to go to both. The Dapol signal toggles on each momentary switch closure so one pulse should be enough. I guess if the signal is in motion it ignores a second pulse?

 

Don't forget that because the Dapol signal simply toggles it could get out of correspondence with the lever position. This can of course be addressed by moving the lever part way just until the signal changes then returning it to its starting position.

[Jim]

20 hours ago, Chris White said:

C Parkstone's Railway and Dapol Signals DCC Concepts.

 

Personally I'd have thought you'd only want to connect to one of the passing contacts rather than splitting one of the Dapol wires to go to both. The Dapol signal toggles on each momentary switch closure so one pulse should be enough. I guess if the signal is in motion it ignores a second pulse?

 

Don't forget that because the Dapol signal simply toggles it could get out of correspondence with the lever position. This can of course be addressed by moving the lever part way just until the signal changes then returning it to its starting position.

Thanks for the advice.

cheers

jim

[Jim]

24 minutes ago, Jim said:

Thanks for the advice.

cheers

jim

If I operated the Dapol signals using the passing contacts on the cobalt levers, would I have to hold the lever over until the signal arm finished it’s movement? 

Jim

[mwrosebury2000]

I use passing contact switches on Dapol signals and I have fund that the trick is to throw the switch nice and slow. If it gets out of sync then I just throw it fast. I don't think it gives it enough time to energise if you do it quick.

Hope that helps.

 

Mark

[Jim]

On 01/06/2019 at 11:52, mwrosebury2000 said:

I use passing contact switches on Dapol signals and I have fund that the trick is to throw the switch nice and slow. If it gets out of sync then I just throw it fast. I don't think it gives it enough time to energise if you do it quick.

Hope that helps.

 

Mark

Many thanks.

I’ve ordered a Dapol stop signal and a Dcc concepts lever to experiment with.

 

Can the signal get its power from the DCC track bus?

If so, that would make wiring so much simpler, only having to run the yellow wires back to the lever frame.

cheers Jim 

Edited June 2, 2019 by Jim
Extra info

[Chris White]

23 hours ago, Jim said:

... Can the signal get its power from the DCC track bus? ...

As I understand it no. The Dapol signal requires an AC supply of not more than 14 volts or a DC supply of not more than 12 volts. You could derive a suitable DC supply from a DCC track bus but you'd need a special circuit to do so. DCC is a high speed pulsed waveform not normal AC and most standard rectifiers aren't fast enough to reliably convert it to DC.

[Jim]

34 minutes ago, Chris White said:

As I understand it no. The Dapol signal requires an AC supply of not more than 14 volts or a DC supply of not more than 12 volts. You could derive a suitable DC supply from a DCC track bus but you'd need a special circuit to do so. DCC is a high speed pulsed waveform not normal AC and most standard rectifiers aren't fast enough to reliably convert it to DC.

Many thanks.

I’ll order a Gaugemaster AC power pack. They’ve got two AC outputs so one can go to the CDU and points and the other to the signals. 

I’ll run a power bus for signals to make life simpler.

cheers Jim 

[phil-b259]

On 03/06/2019 at 12:22, Jim said:

Many thanks.

I’ll order a Gaugemaster AC power pack. They’ve got two AC outputs so one can go to the CDU and points and the other to the signals. 

I’ll run a power bus for signals to make life simpler.

cheers Jim 

 

Personaly I would be wary about going for an AC supply - when first released people had a lot of trouble with the built in rectifiers dieing and the signals becoming non operative as a consiquence (I had to send 4 back to Hattons as a result of this fault).

 

IIRC more recently released signals have amended instructions saying only a 12V DC supply should be used.

 

It would be better to use a 9 to 12V DC supply to avoid this problem - and it should be noted that the signals will work quite happily from a single 9V PP3 battery so depending on usage that may be an option.

[PeteWilliams]

Has anyone had any experience of operating Dapol signals on a 5v 1amp supply. 

 

I have tried using that voltage on a Tortoise point motor and it worked albeit slowly.

 

Many thanks

 

Pete

 

Edited March 22, 2023 by PeteWilliams

[brossard]

Pete, just saw this.  I spent time last week trying to figure out how to use a Cobalt-S lever with the Dapol signal.

 

See this:

 

I discovered, by measuring the output of the Train Tech accessory decoder, that the signal is happy with 9VDC.

 

HTH

 

John

[Dominion]

Hi Pete, probably yes for one type and maybe no for the other.

Let me clarify.

 

There are two very different types of drive for Dapol signals in 4mm.

The single signals have a small motor and screw type drive inside.

The junction and bracket signals are servo operated. They are the ones with a  large black box below baseboard level.

 

I have found the single signals worked quite happily on 6volts DC, with none of the burn out issue that people found earlier with the much higher voltages in the original Dapol instructions, since changed.

I suspect 5 VDC would also work with them.

There is an added advantage in that it makes the LED's dimmer.

 

The junction and bracket signals with a servo will also operate on lower voltage than the instructions if you want, but perhaps not as low as 5.

I agree with Brossard that they work well on the 9V output from the train tech unit designed for them.

However I tried adding some resistors of different values in line with the supply hoping they would still operate fine, but dim the LEDS like the single signals did.

However quite low resistance values prevented the servos from operating when trying to drop the 9V train tech voltage. I didn't measure it unfortunately but that is what makes me say maybe no at only 5 volts.

If a junction signal does work for you on 5 volts I would love to know.

Good luck.

Tom