Seep Motors Binding

[pnosferatu]

Hello,

 

This is my first post and I'm quite new to all of this so please forgive me if I'm being a bit thick!

 

I'm building a DCC Layout and am using both Hornby surface mounted motors as and when I need to but am mainly trying to use Seep Motors (specifically PM1's)

 

I am able to mount the surface motors with ease and have an alignment jig for the PM1's. I've only fitted one so far and whilst it will switch a Hornby point one way (left) every time, it will only throw it the other way (right) for about the first 3 times of trying, then it gets stuck in the middle but will go back to the left with ease.

 

I have it down to two ideas; 1. That it is mounted incorrectly or 2. That my soldering/wiring is not up to par (which is highly possible) and the power going to it isn't quite enough.

 

Could anyone give me any other ideas or give me suggestions on how to fix it? 

I plan on checking the wiring but would happily welcome anything else to try afterwards.

 

Cheers

[kevinlms]

You will find many questions on RMweb on this very topic.

 

Basically the main problem is that the SEEPs MUST be 100% aligned in the centre, to have any hope of reliable operation. That is make sure it's not off line or twisted. Perhaps you can push it slightly towards the right (since that is the end you're having trouble with).

Also what are you using as a power source?

[spikey]

IMO the trick with SEEPs is ...

 

1  Make the hole in the baseboard big enough.  I use 8mm but no harm in using 10.

2  On the underside of the baseboard, look up through the hole and draw a line (with a ruler) at least 50mm long parallel to the tiebar.

3  Offer up the point motor, having to hand a suitable bradawl, screwdriver and screw.  Ideally the screwdriver will be magnetic, and a suitable crosspoint self-tapper will be perched on its tip.

4  Align the unit along your line, then slide it along the line as necessary until it's centralised i.e. at each end of its travel, the pin is the same distance from the coil.

5 Without moving the unit longitudinally, move it at right angles to the line until the pin is vertical (ie at right angles to the baeeboard).

6 Poke screw hole, fit screw and tighten, then repeat for second screw.

 

It's easier if you leave the pin full length then cut it down after installation with a cutting disc on a Dremel, remembering to Hoover up well afterwards.

 

HTH a bit

Edited January 20, 2020 by spikey
clarity

[Pete the Elaner]

37 minutes ago, kevinlms said:

 

Also what are you using as a power source?

I connected up 5 on a friend's layout & we tested them before fitting a CDU. They made an attempt to move but none managed to throw a point.

After fitting a CDU, they all worked properly.

I have 30+ on my home layout some of which are operated through a diode matrix. My CDU struggles to power these & I am unwilling to fit another 1 or 2 CDUs in parallel because these may be too much for points which are thrown individually. I really wish I had chosen Peco motors because they are easier to drive.

[kevinlms]

2 minutes ago, Pete the Elaner said:

I connected up 5 on a friend's layout & we tested them before fitting a CDU. They made an attempt to move but none managed to throw a point.

After fitting a CDU, they all worked properly.

I have 30+ on my home layout some of which are operated through a diode matrix. My CDU struggles to power these & I am unwilling to fit another 1 or 2 CDUs in parallel because these may be too much for points which are thrown individually. I really wish I had chosen Peco motors because they are easier to drive.

Maybe Peco ones are better as in easier to use, but I think you'll get good results on your Seeps if you increase the input voltage slightly i.e. from say 12 Volts to 15 volts.

I don't think adding more CDU's in parallel will help.

[Pete the Elaner]

Just now, kevinlms said:

Maybe Peco ones are better as in easier to use, but I think you'll get good results on your Seeps if you increase the input voltage slightly i.e. from say 12 Volts to 15 volts.

I don't think adding more CDU's in parallel will help.

I had decided to go DCC for points, so each will be thrown individually.

This is partly because I am a little frustrated that they won't throw properly through the diode matrix, but also because we have decided to use DCC for points on the club layout, so I want the experience of setting it up on my own layout.

[Ray H]

Sorry to drift slightly off topic but can you add another capacitor in parallel with those already on the CDU. We've done that at the club and it did make a difference.

Edited January 20, 2020 by Ray H
speeling mistook

[Mick Bonwick]

Any problems that I have had with SEEP PM1s not changing the blades properly have been resolved by re-aligning the device. I use black tac to temporarily position the SEEP and then screw it in place once the thing works both ways. I have been using DCC Concepts decoders to drive the solenoids, each terminal of which has its own capacitor, according to the manufacturer. Although I bought several spare PM1s originally (in case of the failures that people warned me about) I have never had to replace one out of the 36 installed. Now I've said that I expect I'll have to retract the last sentence!

[Bernard Lamb]

As others have said alignment is critical.

However I have had the odd occasion where I thought I had set everything up OK and it would stick from time to time.

A very slight adjustment solved the problem.

I have even seen a case where slackening off the fixing screw at one end has done the trick.

They are a bit of a fiddle but just need a bit of perseverance.

You do need to fire them several times each way before you can be confidant that they will continue to work.

Bernard

 

[pnosferatu]

Thanks for your replies. I'm running them off a DR4018 decoder with a seperate power source. I think it is as people are saying alignment. I'll attempt to sort it today before i go to work if my kids (and wife) allow me to and report back. 

 

Many thanks