Modelling novice looking for advice on 5’ x 16” layout

[jonhinds]

Hi, first post here!

 

As the title suggests, I’m a total novice when it comes to railway modelling. My intention is to model a station scene in N gauge. The setting would be a fictional present-day commuter station in West Yorkshire, loosely modelled on Keighley, with a heritage railway terminus attached. However, given the dimensions available (5’ x 16” atop an IKEA Kallax unit) my original plan is looking a bit optimistic. The space also needs to incorporate a fiddle yard somehow, so it’s very tight indeed.

 

I’d like to have a semblance of realism to the station operations, and wondered if I could fit a truncated two platform terminus with perhaps a siding and/or small steam depot for the heritage side? What else would experienced modellers suggest to add interest and a hint of realism? If possible I’d like to divide station operations so the modern day and heritage sides are two distinct entities.

 

The modern line will be running Northern Rail class 150 and 153 DMUs, and the heritage line small to medium-ish locos (4F, Jinty, maybe a diesel 25) with a rake of two BR Mk1 coaches.

[Nearholmer]

The classic plan to meet your need is one called the 'Piano Line', having been devised in the 1960s by Revered Heath, to fit on top of his piano!

 

There is a very good thread on RMWeb called "time to tune the piano", with ideas and drawings showing how the original can be updated using modern track geometry. The thread does assume a 6ft, rather than 5ft long like the original, layout, but is well worth reading. https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/24517-time-to-tune-the-piano/&tab=comments#comment-247642

 

It doesn't incorporate all that you are looking for, but it does do most of it, including providing a FY, and it fits in the space, which I strongly suspect all that you desire won't!

 

 

Edited January 27, 2020 by Nearholmer

[jonhinds]

Thank you, this looks like just the ticket. Am I right in thinking the original Piano Line layout is in 4mm scale?

 

 

 

 

[Nearholmer]

It was, and only 5ft long - if you follow the various links in that thread, there is a photo of it on one of them.

 

One caution is that it used very tight radius points, something like current Peco set-track (17” radius) or possibly even tighter, which would look a bit odd with modern diesel units. Much of that thread is about trying to do it using Peco medium (36” radius), which looks better, but uses up space.
 

Personally, I would use Peco small radius (24”), and operate the passenger service with one and two car diesel units (or better still a nice 2-BIL), and use a diesel shunter for the goods.

 

Going back to steam, an auto train for passenger and an 0-6-0T for goods would work nicely.

 

Its a plan with many fans, because it is clever and versatile.

 

Crikey! Just realised you are in N ....... this becomes quite a spacious layout!

Have a look at this rambling thread of mine ...... it’s 00, but you’ve got the room to fit the track plan that I eventually got to into your space in N. 

 

Edited January 27, 2020 by Nearholmer

[DavidB-AU]

Here's a quick and dirty edit of the Piano Line which shows how it could be done in N with 5' x 16". This should fit the sort of trains you're planning.

 

 

The NR line could be automated using the Heathcote Electronics SA9.

 

Cheers

David

[DavidB-AU]

These are the sorts of design challenges I enjoy! It fits even better than I first thought. This is all Peco code 55, small radius points for the preserved line and medium for the NR line. The steam loco with the Mk 1s is a 4MT 2-6-4T to give an indication of space. There is enough length to use a class 25 or, at a pinch, a class 31. A 101 or similar first generation DMU is shown for comparison. The NR platforms would also fit a 3 car Pacer if you want to be evil to your model passengers.

 

 

I'd avoid the temptation to cram in more track. Sometimes less is more.

 

Cheers

David

[jonhinds]

Thanks folks, these are really helpful responses so far. Can’t wait to get started!

 

DavidB-AU, your ‘quick and dirty’ Piano Line edit looks ideal, and expanded version even better! Quite surprisingly it looks like I might be able to have my cake and eat it. Another newbie question: I’m guessing NR is Network Rail?
 

The SA9 looks like a great solution for the NR side. I’d eventually like to fit out the DMUs with DCC sound. Admittedly I know next to nothing about how DCC actually operates (and my electronics knowledge is zippo), so would it be possible to have a system whereby the lights, sounds etc. are triggered in tandem with the SA9’s automated shuttle operation?

 

A 3 car Pacer endlessly shuttling back and forth definitely sounds like some sort of biblical purgatory! Although I do feel strangely wistful now they’ve been mostly withdrawn from the local network.

[DavidB-AU]

If you're planning to go the DCC route eventually, I'd avoid the analog DC automated shuttle. JMRI Layout Automation would be able to do this and you can eventually script more complex operations than a simple shuttle. This would actually be a good testbed for learning layout automation.

 

NR = Network Rail, National Rail, Northern Rail. Take your pick. 

 

Cheers

David

Edited January 28, 2020 by DavidB-AU

[Nearholmer]

David BAU's excellent plan can be refined to allow, i think, four coach trains on the preserved side, certainly three coach.

 

I don't do CAD layout design, so here is a pencil sketch!

 

 

You can play about with the exact orientation of things, how you work the scenic-break etc, on the baseboard with bits of track.

 

The key is to use the proper piano geometry, by putting the point to the FY bang on the layout centre-line. If you do this, it maximises viable train-length.

Edited January 28, 2020 by Nearholmer

[DavidB-AU]

4 coaches of Mk 1 length is probably just a bit too long for comfortable operation but 3 is certainly possible while the train is still seen to make a journey. I haven't done the full layout but that orientation looks very nice! It's still spiritually the Piano Line.

 

 

 

 

[jonhinds]

Good to see it's possible to have a loco & 3x Mk 1 rake on the HR line. Your combined efforts have really surpassed what I thought was possible, even in 2mm.

 

I'm now wondering about fiddle yard operation (learning as I go!). I'm guessing that the steam era turntable would be implied to exist in the FY, given that it's the only place to make 180 degree turns on such a small layout, e.g. using cassettes. Struggling to get my head around this a bit, especially as my knowledge of real steam-era terminus operations is scant.

 

I'll be making a 'research' trip along the Keighley and Worth Valley Railway in March to get some modelling and operational inspiration. It's a minor detail, but I'm chuffed to own an exact loco from the KWVR in miniature (4F 43924).

[DavidB-AU]

The fiddle "yard" on the Piano Line is just a single track. You need to use the 0-5-0 shunter or you could use a loco lift/cassette to avoid handling the stock. 

 

Most preserved lines don't turn locos during a running day and steam locos will run tender/bunker first for half the day. The railway may only have one turntable and it may be somewhere in the middle of the line.

 

Cheers

David

[jonhinds]

Thanks David.