Where do my signals go?

[Piemanlarger]

I need some advise as to where my layout "should" have signals?

It is my plan to have a home signal at point (A) and ground signals at ( B) & (C)

 

Briefly. 

Auto train comes in off one of the single lines, eg.high.

Token given to box. Procedes to platform /station.

 

Goods train comes in off low, token to box and runs into lane "c" 

 

For the passenger train to depart, there will be a Dapol (working with luck) signal to start trains from the station. Signal will be roughly at point (A). Train departs to low level collects token from box as passing.

 

Goods loco in lane "c" now uncouples,  light engine onto the level crossing and runs into middle road to (B) which is a ground signal ( non working).

Loco proceeds onto double slip and backs onto Toad in road "c".

Unouples toad and via double slip, shunts it back through road (B) onto level crossing.  Uncouples and runs back down road (B) and via double slip backs wagons in road (C) onto Toad,  coupling up. Then pulls forward in Road "c" to point (C) which is another non working ground signal..

Ground signal is now controlling when it can depart to high level picking up token on passing box.

 

Or should the ground signal (C) be working semiphore signal?

Hope not as got two ground signals and one woring Dapol home signal!

 

Milk train.

In via either high or low, into platform road.

Runs around train via middle road and onto back of train,  shunts it into "milk dock."

Waits for milk to be unloaded or loaded.

Uncouples brake and shunts that to level crossing.

Picks up milk wagons, out from milk dock siding into station, then backs onto brake van. Pulls forward into platform road  to point (A) the Dapol signal and awaits that to clear before departing.

 

 

So how much of my plan is wrong?

Is it that far out that at exhibition I'm going to be constantly pulled up by the signal police?

 

Thank you for any input.

 

 

 

 

 

[RailWest]

For a start, it would be useful to know please (a) what period and (b) what (original pre-grouping) railway company ?

 

Assuming a fairly comprehensive amount of signalling, then for a start you will need a Home signal at the approach to the double slip from the high-level line, and another one similarly on the low-level line. Roughly at (A) there would need to be a bracket signal with 2 dolls, with an arm on each, to be the Starting signals for trains leaving the platform and going to either route at the double-slip.

 

There needs to be trap points at (B) and (C) to protect the running line form anything coming out of the siding, with (at least) one ground signal at each trap. There also need to be trap + ground-signal on the Milk Dock siding, facing trains coming out from the dock, plus a shunt reading from the platform into the dock or the siding with the level-crossing, and another reading out from that siding towards the platform.

 

What's the purpose of the level-crossing apparently almost at the end of a siding?

Edited March 30, 2020 by RailWest

[Piemanlarger]

2 hours ago, RailWest said:

For a start, it would be useful to know please (a) what period and (b) what (original pre-grouping) railway company ?

 

Assuming a fairly comprehensive amount of signalling, then for a start you will need a Home signal at the approach to the double slip from the high-level line, and another one similarly on the low-level line. Roughly at (A) there would need to be a bracket signal with 2 dolls, with an arm on each, to be the Starting signals for trains leaving the platform and going to either route at the double-slip.

 

There needs to be trap points at (B) and (C) to protect the running line form anything coming out of the siding, with (at least) one ground signal at each trap. There also need to be trap + ground-signal on the Milk Dock siding, facing trains coming out from the dock, plus a shunt reading from the platform into the dock or the siding with the level-crossing, and another reading out from that siding towards the platform.

 

What's the purpose of the lvele-crossing apparently almost at the end of a siding?

 

 

Gwr 1928 to 38 roughly.

 

I thought the approach to the station would need signals,  but thought I could get away with saying it's the other side of the tunnel ( off board) and thus a train can't enter the layout unless it's already been given the signal to do so. Layout is only 16 ft long and o guage so I don't have a lot of space to play with / in.

Is it feasible to say trains entering would already have off board permission ?

 

Bracket signal from the platform I expected.  But I'll have to wait until Dapol make one unfortunately. 

 

I can put a trap point at (C) but may struggle at (B).  I'll have to take a look. I have one L/ha nd trap point here. 

Trap and ground I think I can add to milk dock siding

 

The level crossing is a late change of plan. I've now decided the only road to the station comes from the front of the layout and thus vehicles ( there is only 1 unloading at the milk dock) has to cross there.

As apposed to a road leading off in the backscene.

The gates will be modelled open to loco movent at all times as apposed to working gates.

 

 

Thank you for your help, much appreciated 

Edited March 30, 2020 by Piemanlarger

[RailWest]

Having your Home signals some distance away on the far side of a tunnel would be most unlikely.

 

You will also need a shunt signal of some form at each Down Home (or a bit nearer to the double-slip) to control movements into the (C) siding and probably another one at the toe of the point leading into loop (B).

 

And just to finish it all off.....   probably an Up Advanced Starting on each of the two exit lines with Shunt Ahead subsidiary arms to allow shunt movements into your (imaginary) tunnel ! 

[Piemanlarger]

Ok thank you.

 

I think initially the police are going to be taking me away lol.

But hopefully eventually I'll get there and bail !

[DCB]

A couple of thoughts, the Milk will usually bring empty tanks and take fulls away.  It won't wait for the tanks to be filled, It's a long process filling tanks. This applies to almost all sorts of goods in steam days.

The track plan is a bit unlikely, The only place I can think of  where two single track branches diverge just outside a terminus is Cinderford  Forest of Dean, sort of GWR / S&Y joint, and that's not too different though there is a lot more distance and two points not a double slip.    

Catch points it's all very well fussing about traps on sidings but I would have thought you would  need something more dramatic like a sand drag for that line down from the upper level if you operate goods trains given the end of the line is so close.  

I suspect the goods from the upper level would not be allowed into the section down to your station with a passenger about. Probably have to wait until passenger was clear before venturing down.  But its more a track plan issue than signalling.

 

[RailWest]

>>>he only place I can think of  where two single track branches diverge just outside a terminus is Cinderford  Forest of Dean, sort of GWR / S&Y joint, and that's not too different though there is a lot more distance and two points not a double slip. ......

 

Also Bodmin (General) and Exmouth, although of course the latter was a much larger station with effectively a scissors crossover at the station throat.