Do Class 319/1 Seating Plans Exist?

[spsmiler]

Earlier today I asked one of the retailers at the Great Electric Tran Show in Milton Keynes if he had seats for Class 319/1 trains.

 

His reply was to ask how many 2+2 and how many 2+3 seats I require, plus whether the seats are for 'airline style' or 'back to back'.

 

To find this out I need access to a seating plan for Class 319/1 trains. 

 

Is such available. somewhere?

 

Thanks

[ISW]

11 hours ago, spsmiler said:

To find this out I need access to a seating plan for Class 319/1 trains. 

 

Is such available. somewhere?

There is one in the BR Vehicle Diagrams No.210 on the Barrowmore website (http://www.barrowmoremrg.co.uk/Prototype.html). I've extracted just the Class 319 pages in the attachment. Is this what you were looking for?

 

Ian

Vehicle Diagram Book No.210 - Class 319.pdf

[Wickham Green too]

Don't forget they need to be ironing-board-hard and mounted so the average passengers has his/her knees round his ears and his/her eyes are level with the bottom of the windows. 🥴

[bécasse]

The seating plans linked to by ISW aren't of a 319/1 which provided 1st class accommodation (with 2 + 2 seating IIRC) at one end of the unit. The seating, at least in 1st class, wasn't as comfortable as that in a 4CIG but was IMHO better than that in a 4VEP.

 

Although I must have travelled in 319/1s (and 319/0s and 319/2s) hundreds of times, I sadly can't now remember the details of the seating layout.

[ISW]

2 hours ago, bécasse said:

The seating plans linked to by ISW aren't of a 319/1 which provided 1st class accommodation (with 2 + 2 seating IIRC) at one end of the unit.

Yeah, I did notice that just after posting my message (the title does say 319/1!). Durrrrr.

 

I checked my 3 book versions of 'Traction Recognition' and none of them have a 319/1, just 319/0, 319/2, 319/3, & 319/4, so that was of no help at all. Sorry.

 

Now you've got me curious. So, I looked up 319/1 in Wikipedia and that made it clearer. All the 319/1s were converted to 319/3, and my books are all after the conversion.

 

Ian

[bécasse]

1 hour ago, ISW said:

 

I checked my 3 book versions of 'Traction Recognition' and none of them have a 319/1, just 319/0, 319/2, 319/3, & 319/4, so that was of no help at all. Sorry.

 

Now you've got me curious. So, I looked up 319/1 in Wikipedia and that made it clearer. All the 319/1s were converted to 319/3, and my books are all after the conversion.

I wonder what changes were made in the conversion from 319/1 to 319/3? If you have the seating diagram for it could you post it and it might jog my memory sufficiently, I think that I can remember what the 1st class arrangement in the 319/1s was (from vestibule doorway to cab doorway - one airline-style 2+2 row facing centre of unit then one 4+4 bay = 12 seats).

[spsmiler]

5 hours ago, ISW said:

There is one in the BR Vehicle Diagrams No.210 on the Barrowmore website (http://www.barrowmoremrg.co.uk/Prototype.html). I've extracted just the Class 319 pages in the attachment. Is this what you were looking for?

 

Ian

Vehicle Diagram Book No.210 - Class 319.pdf 175.99 kB · 7 downloads

 

Thank you very much.

 

Although not 319/1 (as already discussed) these plans are still very valuable.

 

From what Wikipedia says only one coach had the first class seats and working on the basis that the seating layout changes would have been minimal (ie: as cheap to implement as possible!) so this implies that the seating layout shown in those plans for the other three coaches is exactly correct for the Class 319/1 fleet.

 

I cannot be sure but also working on the basis that the end with the longitudinal seats was retained in this format (for luggage / postal / whatever) so then the train end which was converted to 1st class would have been the other end, with the 3 + 2 being converted to 2 + 2 and the rest remaining the same. Perhaps with the entire 1st class section having differently coloured seat fabric than the rest of the train.

 

Simon

[ISW]

28 minutes ago, spsmiler said:

I cannot be sure but also working on the basis that the end with the longitudinal seats was retained in this format (for luggage / postal / whatever) so then the train end which was converted to 1st class would have been the other end,

To quote from Rail Express August 2022 "An additional 26 Class 319s were built at York in 1990 for long
distance services where First Class accommodation was needed such as Bedford-Brighton. They were numbered 319161-186 and formed of four cars in DTCO-MSO-TSOL-DTSO formation with a First Class compartment located in the front of one driving trailer. Standard Class accommodation retained high 
density three-plus-two seating with Network SouthEast blue moquette. Interiors were lighter in colour with
pale blue and grey used throughout, together with Edward Pond murals on bulkhead panels."

 

Also "The Class 319/1 sub-class was easily recognised by its ‘express’ version of Network SouthEast livery  which saw light grey replace the dark grey of the original livery including the cab roof. The fairing below the  cab front was redesigned and the cab plug doors are of a different shape too. Brecknell Willis pantographs were fitted instead of the Stone Faiveley type used on Class 319/0s."

 

I don't know how much of the latter quote you'll wish to incorporate!

 

Ian

 

[ISW]

1 hour ago, bécasse said:

If you have the seating diagram for it could you post it and it might jog my memory sufficiently,

Sadly no. The best I could find was a comparison between the 319 sub-classes, that provides the total number of seats in each vehicle. However, of course, it misses the 319/1 sub-class!

 

Ian

[Flood]

From the following site:

https://www.networksoutheast.net/ac.html

 

 

 

 

 

HTH

[DY444]

It's a long time ago now but for a couple of years right after they were built, my train home from London Bridge was booked 2 x 319/1.  My vague recollection is that the 1st class was in two compartments behind the driving cab, one of 12 seats and one of 4.  The smaller compartment was odd as it had 2 seats facing each way.

[DY444]

6 minutes ago, Flood said:

From the following site:

https://www.networksoutheast.net/ac.html

 

 

 

 

 

HTH

 

Crossed in the post - yes that's it - the little compartment behind the cab was weird

[Not Captain Kernow]

That small compartment in 1st Class was the smoking section.

 

When converted from 319/1 to 319/3 the 1st class was removed, as were the tip up seats. The 3+2 sections all became 2+2, but the seats were all the standard class 319 seats that had been removed from the Connex Class 319/2 conversions. So although the 319/3 became 2+2 throughout the seats were still the same narrow seats as previously used, but it did give a wider aisle as a result.

[Wickham Green too]

Always seemed strange that the all-Standard 319/0 were converted to Standard/First and the Standard/First 319/1 were converted to all-Standard ...... made sense to someone, I guess !!?! 🙄

[spsmiler]

Thank you very much, everyone.

 

I now have the information I need.

 

Simon