RMweb Gold John B Posted January 15, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 15, 2013 Outstanding stuff, most inspirational. Thanks Mark! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portchullin Tatty Posted January 15, 2013 Author Share Posted January 15, 2013 (edited) Thanks guys. It needs to be inspirational. I have at least three more big bracket signals to do - this is the smallest of them! This is jolly close to what the real thing ought to look like. This is at Inverness and the two main arms serve different main line platforms, so are of equal hieght. The left hand one of mine will serve a bay, so I decided it was the junior which meant that it was a tad lower. I also put the balance levers low down, as my signal will not be on a platform so there is no need to protect the public. But rather than deprive us of the whole picture............. The loco is one of Jones' Strath class; in their day they were the most powerful locos in the country. I have a nearly finished model of a Strath, but I have made it a bit narrow over the splashers to get all the coupling rods in in P4. It is awaiting a "hummm" moment to decide what to do with it! The photo was taken in the first few years of the last centrury. So mods, we can be confident that the photographer has been dead for more than 70 years! Edited January 15, 2013 by Portchullin Tatty 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Rannoch Moor Posted January 17, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 17, 2013 Looking at the photo above Mark, it looks like Lochgorm Works might have done the same thing...! I wish you luck and will have a Hmmm session next time I'm out for a trot on your behalf. I'll assume you've already considered the obvious like thinning crankpins or behind the splashers... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portchullin Tatty Posted January 24, 2013 Author Share Posted January 24, 2013 The signal is now finished but photos will have to wait until I can get it out in the daylight which I will not be able to do until the weekend. I will take it to the Southampton show as I am manning the Scalefour Society stand on the Saturday; feel free to pop by and see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Rannoch Moor Posted January 24, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 24, 2013 Look forward to seeing it and yourself there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portchullin Tatty Posted February 3, 2013 Author Share Posted February 3, 2013 I have managed to finished (for now anyway, see below) the bracket signal. So here are some pictures: One error I did manage to include in the build was to make the holes in the balance levers, the crank elbows and the signal arms a tad to big for the operating wire I used. I used 12 gauge guitar wire and the slop that this creates in a 0.5mm hole is rather too much. 0.5mm drills were the smallest I had when I built this so I have invested in a stack of 0.4mm and 0.3mm from drillsuk (on ebay). Next time I will try these really small drills because the thin operating wire does look the part. The effect of this is to allow the arms to slop too much and they will not be capable of being made to bounce properly. This signal will be in a cutting of the proposed layout, so I will have to replace the wire with something a bit thicker to overcome this. You live and learn! I am also having a bit of trouble with the MERG servo drivers; I may be cooking them with my power supply so this needs a bit of work too! 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Harper Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 Very nice Mark. Sandy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Rannoch Moor Posted February 3, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 3, 2013 Looking great Mark and good luck with the problem solving! Sorry to miss you last week - you were busy recruiting into the Society whenever I passed and I had to get back reasonably early. I have this marked though so I can crib your good ideas when my time comes. Back to Loch Treig (via the domestic chores!) and maybe a bit more work on the loco yard in Kilbrannan... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted February 3, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 3, 2013 Excuse me for asking but do you have any Highland Rly period pics showing the 'bow-tie' signal arms with an 'S' on them? I'm no expert on Highland signalling - as I'm no doubt about to prove - but it has for sometime been my understanding that 'S' was an addition in the LMS period to some if not all bow-tie arms on the Highland in order to conform with contemporaneous Rule Book references to shunting signals (not shunt ahead). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portchullin Tatty Posted February 3, 2013 Author Share Posted February 3, 2013 Yes, the S on the Highland's signals was a regular HR addition. i can't say with certainty whether all of the S's were applied in the HR era though. You are right that they were not used at all times by the Highland as there are a fair few shots that show the bow-tie without the S; but there are also shots that are definately in the Highland era that have the S on. The ones that are best to date from are where there are official or semi-official pictures at the opening of new lines; there is a view of the Lybster Jct at Wick in Highland Miscellany that looks to be pre-opening with the S on it (1903); as too are some pictures of Aviemore when the direct line was opened (1898) and also a really good one in Highland Album One of The Mound just after opening (1902). Interesting that you describe them as shunting signals. Many of them that are photographed would have been to control goods routes around a station but at least some would have performed the function that I would describe as "shunt ahead" - that of going out into a block section for the purposes of a shunt move even where the block section is not clear. It may be that we are trying to apply modern (ish!) terminology to not only a old situation but one where they were a long way from authority so terms got corrupted? Whilst the Highland in the pre-group era were really quite authoritarian from what I read, when grouping came along and definately by the post grouping era, they seemed to have their "own way of things!" Getting off the subject of signals, but an example of this was the application of the lined red LMS livery. Every other company on the LMS system applied it to the medium and larger passenger classes only - the ex Highland staff applied it to 0P's and a fair number of what were really mixed traffic engines. I think they may have held the same opinion as me, the unreleived and unlined green is a bit dull! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted February 3, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 3, 2013 (edited) Thanks Mark - interesting to learn that. As far as I know the 'S' would not have been applied to 'across the road' signals or those for backing movements (i.e the direct equivalent of a GWR Backing Signal) and several photos I have seen would seem to confirm that. I shall have to see if I've Ossie Nock's article on Highland Rly signals although I do know without looking that I haven't got all of his series on Pre-Grouping signals. The concept of a 'Shunt Ahead' signal certainly existed prior to 1914 although it might not necessarily have been called that and the GWR was using arms with an 'S' on for that purpose at that time although the GWR Regulation for shunting ahead on singe lines was done away with as unnecessary (instead all such shunts were treated as blocking back but a Shunt Ahead arm was still used to signal such movements at places where they took place regularly). Edited February 3, 2013 by The Stationmaster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portchullin Tatty Posted February 3, 2013 Author Share Posted February 3, 2013 I shall have to see if I've Ossie Nock's article on Highland Rly signals although I do know without looking that I haven't got all of his series on Pre-Grouping signals. Are you referring to the Model Engineer articles of circa 1941? I was kindly given a scan of this recently by an RMwebber and there is no mention of shunt signal details in this regretably. If you are referring to a different one, then I am all ears as I don't know of it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 Hi Mark, Super signal! Interesting that you have found yet another use for guitar strings. I would have guessed the operating wire (Q:does a guitar string become 'wire' when we cut it up for other purposes?!) to be even thinner than .012". Perhaps .016" would be better for the 'bounce' effect to work - they are a whole lot stiffer and yet still discrete enough not to spoil your lovely model. All the best, Colin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portchullin Tatty Posted February 4, 2013 Author Share Posted February 4, 2013 Hi Mark, Super signal! Interesting that you have found yet another use for guitar strings. I would have guessed the operating wire (Q:does a guitar string become 'wire' when we cut it up for other purposes?!) to be even thinner than .012". Perhaps .016" would be better for the 'bounce' effect to work - they are a whole lot stiffer and yet still discrete enough not to spoil your lovely model. All the best, Colin Hi Colin, that is indeed my thought too. I must make sure I visit a guitar shop soon! Can I find an excuse to go to Tottenham Ct Rd/Denmark St in the next few days............ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted February 4, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 4, 2013 Are you referring to the Model Engineer articles of circa 1941? I was kindly given a scan of this recently by an RMwebber and there is no mention of shunt signal details in this regretably. If you are referring to a different one, then I am all ears as I don't know of it! That's the one Mark - I don't know of any others although someone did a series about all sorts of Highland structures etc in the '50s and it might have included signals? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
micknich2003 Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 Model Railway News c1952 had several Highland Railway articles and drawings, but I don't recall signals. From memory there was Garve signalbox and a water tower, and both modelled by myself when about ten years old. Postcard cut up, folded glued together and them daubed over with Humbrol paint, we all have to start somewhere. Possibly, and if I had persivered, I would now be modelling the Highland and not the H&B/NER. I will look up my early bound volumes. Best Wishes, Mick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
micknich2003 Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 Just checked a quite in depth article on Garve, plenty of drawings and photo's but nothing at all on signals. Best Wishes, Mick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portchullin Tatty Posted March 12, 2013 Author Share Posted March 12, 2013 (edited) The latest completion off the workbench is a goods brake van. This is a diagram 39 version; which was the Highland's last brake van design (and there is some speculation that they were not delivered until after the start of the LMS era but if someone has a photograph in HR days, we would be all eyes!). These were quite modern by the Highland's standards and were the first ones for several decades to do away with the lookout on the top of the roof which was likely to be a retrograde step given all the twists and turns of the line. It was built from a Lochgorm kit; constructed mostly as intended. However, I elected to insert some sprung suspension using Bill Bedford sprung W irons, rather than the designers intention of compensation. I also found that the sides were a little tall, so these needed to be cut down a tad. Other than this, it is was pretty easy. Having bought some of the NBR Models etched builder's places, this became the first model of mine to be fitted with one - so a small first! Back at post 60, I confidently noted that I had come to a wheeze to get around the problem of some dreadful white metal castings provided by the kit by taking one from a Big Ben that I have in my kit stockpile. Well it serves me right for being smug but I have made a co*k up in that whilst one loco did take a chimney from a Big Ben that particular loco did not end up in the LMS red that I particularly wanted to portray. Grrrrrrrrrrr! This has therefore compelled me to turn out my own replacement chimney as I have not managed to find a proprietary replacement that looks the part. Most of this has been done, as below (the workmanship marks are much better in real life - it is only 9mm high!) but I do still need to anneal this and introduce the curve of the smokeboax on the flange. Edited March 12, 2013 by Portchullin Tatty 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Harper Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 I also found that the sides were a little tall, so these needed to be cut down a tad As you can imagine it was exacerbated in the 7mm version!! Cheers Mark Sandy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portchullin Tatty Posted March 12, 2013 Author Share Posted March 12, 2013 As you can imagine it was exacerbated in the 7mm version!! Aghh; at least I now know that I have not messed it up! Pete didn't mention it on his build so I was a little worried........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Harper Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 (edited) I think Pete used the same resolution as I did which was to fit a thin strap of brass at the top of the end and butting up against the underside of the roof. Looks like a metal strip when finished, Regards Sandy This photo was taken before my 'black' varnish was applied to give a darker shade to te red. Edited March 13, 2013 by Sandy Harper 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohmisterporter Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 I may be gripping the wrong end of the stick as usual but I thought it was said the sides were too tall and had to be cut down a little. So why the infill strip? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Harper Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 Hi Geoff The fill in strip, which can be seen on the brass photo, is to cover the space between the ends and the roof. I did not want to reduce the sides as it would have meant loosing part of the etched strapping. Make any more sense? Regards Sandy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohmisterporter Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 Yes thank you Sandy. Nice work as usual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portchullin Tatty Posted March 14, 2013 Author Share Posted March 14, 2013 Hi Geoff The fill in strip, which can be seen on the brass photo, is to cover the space between the ends and the roof. I did not want to reduce the sides as it would have meant loosing part of the etched strapping. Make any more sense? Regards Sandy I thought about this approach too; especially as there is a small bead below the roof proper. However, my roof was a tad too narrow to acheive this - it may be that the slightly more robustness of 7mm means you could do it whereas I can't. I did manage to keep the ironwork though as I agree it would have made a big difference if this went. Yours looks good by the way; I am doing mine in LMS livery as there is no photographic evidence that they were delivered in HR livery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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