Amtrak Introduces Airo

[mdvle]

Amtrak is branding their new Siemens trains as Airo

https://www.amtrak.com/amtrak-airo

 

 

https://www.railwayage.com/passenger/intercity/first-look-amtrak-airo/

 

[wombatofludham]

Good job they are Siemens.  If they had been from Ansaldo they would have had to name them "Aero" because they would have been full of holes (see the Ansaldo "Fyra" train debacle).

Seriously though they do look to be very smart, I often watch "Virtual Railfan" and have noticed the services out of Quincy now have Siemens coaches in their formation.

I wonder if the double deck sleepers will get replaced at some point?  I believe they are being refurbished at the moment which suggests they might be around for a while yet.

[mdvle]

7 minutes ago, wombatofludham said:

Seriously though they do look to be very smart, I often watch "Virtual Railfan" and have noticed the services out of Quincy now have Siemens coaches in their formation.

 

Yep, though not owned by Amtrak - the trains are operated by Amtrak but the equipment purchased by Illinois as part of a multi-state equipment purchase.

 

(for anyone not aware some of the services Amtrak operates are at least partially funded by the relevant State and in some cases the State also provides the equipment).

 

7 minutes ago, wombatofludham said:

I wonder if the double deck sleepers will get replaced at some point?  I believe they are being refurbished at the moment which suggests they might be around for a while yet.

 

My understanding is Amtrak would like to but it all comes down to available capital funding - and replacing the Amfleets is the current priority.

[icn]

Of only tangential relevance: I see that these are also going to operate the Cascades. Apparently the original Talgo trainsets have already been retired and scrapped, which completely surprised me - but the two newer Talgos are still around and might be kept longer term. The story around the scrapping of the original Talgos is a bit odd - apparently they aren't compliant with newer safety standards that came into force shortly after they were built... but I suspect that the even older Amtrak stock that has been kept is also not compliant with modern standards either? I have to admit I don't entirely understand the system over there.

 

Anyway, more to this topic: I thought it was interesting that they've chosen a new design for the front - a little closer to the Vectron - as opposed to reusing what they had used for Via rail or Brightline... but then I realised it seems to be designed to match the existing Charger locos.

[mdvle]

On 18/12/2022 at 11:08, icn said:

Of only tangential relevance: I see that these are also going to operate the Cascades. Apparently the original Talgo trainsets have already been retired and scrapped, which completely surprised me - but the two newer Talgos are still around and might be kept longer term. The story around the scrapping of the original Talgos is a bit odd - apparently they aren't compliant with newer safety standards that came into force shortly after they were built... but I suspect that the even older Amtrak stock that has been kept is also not compliant with modern standards either? I have to admit I don't entirely understand the system over there.

 

The Talgo Series VI cars did not adequately protect the passengers during the 2017 crash leading the NTSB request their removal from service - see 30 to 37 in the Findings section of this document - https://www.ntsb.gov/news/events/Documents/Dupont-Abstract.pdf

 

 

[icn]

9 hours ago, mdvle said:

 

The Talgo Series VI cars did not adequately protect the passengers during the 2017 crash leading the NTSB request their removal from service - see 30 to 37 in the Findings section of this document - https://www.ntsb.gov/news/events/Documents/Dupont-Abstract.pdf

 

 

Thanks! That's interesting, but still left me confused. Those points alone are a bit ambiguous due to lack of explanation, so I had a look at the full report instead.

 

One key issue is related to nylon straps failing, which is both a manufacturer and regulator oversight - but also something that can be solved with maintenance. The more important part seems to be that individual units in the Talgo set are not crash-proof taken alone (they depend on being part of a larger train, which is assumed to not separate - except that in this case it separated). By comparison normal carriages seem to be crash-proof (or at least crash-worthy) because they might be used anywhere in a train or alone I suppose. Fair enough, seems like a reasonable additional layer of protection - which I think was included in the later Talgos built after the new standards were in place. Is it enough to scrap a train? I don't know... most countries allow existing rolling stock to continue operating within reasonable constraints (e.g. PRM modifications).

 

The grandfathering issue, and demanding that grandfathering be removed, is... interesting, because it goes against what most of the rest of the world does. These trains were legitimately built before the new standards were published, so exempting them in the first place seems reasonable (that's actually a point that both Talgo and WDOT brought up when the new standards were being drafted - see comments in the final publication from 1999). And generally countries provide enough time for manufacturers to adapt to new standards - perhaps with the notable exception of what France did when Stadler first tried to get Flirts approved there - so granting it to these specific trains was also reasonable.

 

It seems like a reasonable comparison might be the HSTs in the UK: we know they're not as safe as new trains, and there's a push to get rid of them in some locations - but they're not being banned overnight. But of course every country does things differently.