Drws-y-Nant

[Llangerisech]

As the layout has now made its public debut and a follow-up, the immediate pressure is off and I figured it would be good to start a thread here to show how some of the design items came together and any progress that is made in the future. Some of the initial content was in the 2mmSA magazine and I am sure other stuff will appear there in the future.

 Here is the layout at the first show - Uckfield in October 2022 with Michael Druiett in the front operator's hot seat.

 

Before the layout was started, I had decided to make a modular infrastructure for future layouts that I knew would fit in an estate car with 2 operators. This involved a sub-structure with beams and trestles which was simple to erect and would allow for different scenic boards to be used in future.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

As can be seen the beams are held by the trestles and are hinged in the middle for transport.

 

As the main boards are 4 foot 6inches long, the beams are 5 feet long to give a little spare.

 

The trestles are hinged so that they lie completely flat and with only the cross beam being proud at one end, they can be stacked sardine fashion and 4 trestles are barely thicker than 4 pieces of timber. This was important for transport.

There are built in adjusters in the beams to allow for floor variations and ensure all the layout sections line up. By sliding the trestles under the beams, the height is adjusted but up to 2cm, in 5 steps.

 

The use of webbing straps at the bottom of the trestles ensure that they all keep a consistent height and don't rattle in the car.

 

I decided to mock up the sections of timber needed and ended up with 3 sheets of 6mm beech ply and these were cut by the timber merchant according to the plan I gave them. This is where use of a good merchant instead of a DIY store makes a big difference.

As can be seen the main board and fiddle yard are joined by eight end boards which are extremely rigid due to fairly small size. These only then have one more trestle at the centre points.

As can be seen, the original card mock up had a rear board for the back-scene, but this changed to a demountable backscene soon after.

 

The point here is that a plan and a model gave me confidence that the whole thing would work and gave a few ideas and options.

 

As can be seen, the left hand end boards have raised edges, while the right end are flush with the top surface. In the end, I went with a raised outer lip. but not inner.

 

 

 

 

Once the card pieces were figured out the cutting instructions were given to the timber merchant.

 

 

And so the sub-structure was put together without too much cussing, but a lot of ResinW and a good number of strategic wood screws.

 

That will do for the first section - next item the peculiar fiddle yards.

 

Nigel

 

Edited December 24, 2022 by Llangerisech
Add name

[Llangerisech]

I decided that the layout should be operable by two people, but could be run by a single person for short periods, eg lunch and comfort breaks.

To this end, I decided that I wanted the flexibility of the cassette system previously used on Llangerisech, but with a long loop at the rear to allow for stacking 6 trains, 3 in each direction.

In practice this has become the normal mode of operations and the cassettes have not been used much at the first two shows, but they certainly allow for greater flexibility in swapping trains and locos out of the sequence.

 

Here is a view of the whole  layout early in the build showing the fiddle yard. The raised section has the loops and the cassettes can plug in the receiver plugs just in front of the raised section. That is a full 6 car Blue Pullman on the rear road to give an idea of how much space there is.

 

 

The idea was to allow the main operator with the full mimic panel to change the points in the fiddle section, or the fiddle operator could also change routes. By using Cobalt Digital point motors, these receive DCC signals from the main operator, but also have the option of a local button connected directly to the motor ( that red recessed push-button). Above you can also see a cassette connected to the socket. These do not require any additional connections, being a snug fit in the sockets. We have LEDs and resistors wired across the locomotive cassettes to show that DCC power is present and permanent magnets to assist in uncoupling.

 

I use the bolts that hold the sections together to carry the DCC bus bar connections. So the bus cables are soldered to washers and when a nut and bolt are tightened, we have a connection. No trailing cables and a continuous circuit are easy to achieve, with an inherent reliability plus point.

Finally, the indicator lights. These are made from a 3.5mm jack plug and socket, large LEDs in holders with appropriate resistors and with connections to the live frog output on the point. These are necessary as the mimic panel has indicators for the routes that its own buttons select, but with the local switches, these would be out of synch and could not be seen by the fiddle yard operator. So the raised indcators allow the lights to be positioned and viewable to all concerned. I use red and green LEDs, so they appear at first to be signals, but there is no stop/go about them. Simply we use Red as the Rear route and Green is the Front route of each point. In practice this has worked well at the shows with the operators swiftly getting used to them.

 

And to prove all that lot goes into the car

Main layout boards on the left, then the fiddle yard on its side, then lighting rig, beams and end boards and then the trestles on the right (all 8 of them!)

 

So that is most of the background infrastructure. Next installment will be choice of prototype.

 

Nigel

 

[Llangerisech]

So why the prototype of Drws-y-Nant?

 

Well for a start, I could make it fit my planned baseboard size with only minimal compression. I used the National Library of Scotland OS map to prove this, although they only have the 6 inch maps for this part of Wales as the 25 inch are not available. But good enough to prove the point.

 

I already had stock for GWR/Cambrian area in 1930s and wanted to re-use these from Llangerisech. I had a soft spot for the Ruabon-Barmouth route as well as the Cambrian main line, having already made a model of Carrog station building, as yet unused on a layout.

I had holidayed in the area several times and had a few books on the line, the initial interest being sparked by a picture on the WG Rear and N Jones book on the Llangollen line. The peculiar crossing at one end of the station looked like an interesting bit of trackwork and as I have a slightly masochistic streak for building soldered pointwork, figured this would show why 2FS is such a great scale - unique track and great scenery.

 

So, armed with original photos, I went to see what the site is like now.

 

 

This is how the site would appear if you stood at normal viewing distance from the model. That white building is the station master's house and the line would have run slap bang through the middle of this picture. So not much use for checking prototype details, apart from the hill and valley that has not changed . You can look along the very overgrown trackbed, but hardly anything now exists of the station itself. The house is still there and has had a few minor alterations, but at least I could get a sense of scale. It is a very dinky property to my eyes.

 

When the layout is at shows, it does seem extremely green when compared to more industrial settings, but these photos show it really is like that. Wales has a lot of greenery.

 

Anyway, I figured that if I could build that crossing, there was a good layout to be had to show off the scale as a railway in the scenery. It would be interesting to model and operate whilst not too taxing at shows.

 

Once I had built this using the 2mmSA copperclad sleepers, code 40 bullhead track and chairplates, the layout was basically going to get built.

 

Drws y Nant can be translated in a few ways, but simplest would be Door to the Stream. I liked the Welsh idea of forgetting vowels and after folk trying to pronounce Llangerisech, this seemed a logical next step. It is pronounced Droos ee Nant, but Peter Swift at the Epsom club has already renamed it Nancy Drew.

 

What has amazed me at shows is just how many people know the area and offer recollections. So what I thought would be an obscure little backwater seems to have a number of enthusiasts, which bodes well for interest at the exhibitions.

 

Nigel

 

 

 

 

 

[Llangerisech]

The Vehicles move....

 

Having a level crossing as part of the station, clearly the gates had to work and it seemed logical to have something going over the crossing and into the goods yard. Having seen Giles Flavell's work with radio control in O gauge, I wanted to achieve a similar effect in 2mm. OK, we wouldn't have total flexibility, but slow running scale vehicles on a regular pathway that could be controlled would be possible with Magnorail. I have admired the Faller system, but the speed is not remotely adjustable to my knowledge, while I figured that the Magnorail motor could be run through a speed controller in the same manner as a locomotive.

 

So having purchased a starter set (and then another to complete the full distance needed on the layout), I did some experiments to see how the system would cope with a level crossing.

 

It is recommended to keep the top and bottom faces of the road surface as smooth as possible, and I planned to use two layers of thin card for the normal areas, meaning about 0.5mm thickness. This gave smooth reliable running with the magnets remaining attached. The 2mm rail is code 40, so 1mm deep. This meant adding extra card between the top and bottom layers leading up to the side of the rail. The very small running gap to the check rails doesn't seem to present any issue to the system as the skates and chain links are significantly longer.

 

So having proven this with a trial set up, I made up the level crossing area by soldering the rails and check rails at the correct gaps directly to some PCB. Where the Magnorail chain guides were located was a gap in the PCB and the road surface glued directly on top of this. The PCB was also used to mount the gate bearings for the crossing so that the mechanism  could be built off the layout and then installed.

 

 

The PCB is gapped for electrical insulation between rails and the DCC feed to the PCB is run through a microswitch so that when the gates are open to traffic, the electrical feed ceases. This ensures that the skates on the vehicles do not short as they cross the tracks. The little servo shown in mounted on brass and the vertical block is also the bearing for the gate shaft. I have subsequently amended the servo location and used larger servos, but more of that in a later update.

 

The Magnorail channel is secured in place on a sub-surface mounted  above the main baseboard datum, but lower than the trackbed to allow some height variation. It happens to be 6mm thick and cork insulation strips from DIY shops is a great way to build a base for the road surface to attach to. This was a tip seen on Youtube - I claim no originality here, but a great idea for sure.

 

So the general run has a turn round pulley at both ends which helps with smoothing out the chain drive loads, but gives a handy turn round off scene as a sort of vehicle fiddle yard.

 

This view is from the rear of the layout with the off-scene turn round nearest the camera.

 

In larger scales the turn-round is unrealistically tight, but in 2mm is about full lock for a car or van. Longer wheelbase vehicles would have to hand-brake turn, but the ones we want to use are small enough that with steering front axles, it follows the line realistically.

 

Next stop the vehicles themselves.

Nigel

 

 

 

[Llangerisech]

The vehicles themselves

 

In the Rear and Jones book, there is a photo of the goods yard with a Standard 10 van parked near the weighbridge. I had acquired a kit for exactly this type of van, along with other vehicles from R Parker, and it is a lovely little whitemetal casting. For the 1950s/60s period, this would be ideal and so I set about building a chassis for it.

 

The end turning points on the magnorail system are about 7cm diameter, so 35 feet in 2mm - a typical car turning circle on full lock, so with that dimension being the centreline, the outside limits are more like 40 plus feet. However, most Magnorail systems that I have seen keep these turns out of sight and use models with fixed steering. While this is fine on the straights and gentle bends, it would look ludicrous at the turn rounds so I needed to engineer Ackerman steering into this tiny van. But this is 2FS and I like a challenge!

 

 

So the chassis is basically bits of brass and nickel silver strip soldered with 0.3mm rod as kingpins and steering joins. I used my Proxxon mill as a pillar drill here for accuracy, lining up the holes with consistent spacing and vertical alignment. The steering is connected to a pivot to allow the front axle to rock sideways -effectively compensation on the chassis. The skate in this shot is one of the original Magnorail skates and I ended up making a more discrete version later on.

 

 

The front and rear parts of the chassis are held together on a sliding slot with the two bolts in the middle holding it together. This allows very fine adjustment of length to fit the body. The wheels are from a Wiking model and were the right size, if a little modern, but they can be dressed up at some point to be more prototypical, For the moment, it looks little like a resto-mod that could have been dreamt up at Retropower!

 

This shot demonstrates the need for that adjustable chassis length! Compare that with the finished product.

 

As the first show approached, it was clear that another vehicle was required to run in the 1930s period and I needed something a little simpler to build. Wiking do a very basic Mercedes truck with a long wheelbase that could be hacked about to look more like a Luton product from Bedford and shortened so as to not look ridiculous on the turns.

 

I obtained one of the Faller chassis only kits where the steering is effectively already built and the plastic bits are easily modified. I didn't need the motor, but can use that elsewhere, so did a classic cut and shut on these items. The skid was replaced to use the 2 magnets needed for Magnorail instead of the single item native to the Faller system, and also moved the centre point back to try and keep it behind the front of the truck. The result is a very smooth rolling truck that is clearly sufficiently skeletal in profile for folk to wonder how it moves. Bear in mind this is the smallest item Faller do and it has no motor in it, then see how much smaller the van is, you can see the attraction of the Magnorail system for 2mm work.

 

I have ideas for other vehicles, so we will get more variety in the future. But with the typical visitor dwell time at shows, a single vehicle isn't a problem. The system has generated a lot of interest so far from the exhibitions so far and buys time for the fiddle yard operator to re-group and means we can slow down the pace of arrivals at a very rural station.

 

One bit of driving that was  initiated on the second day of exhibiting was to slow to a halt at the T junction and pull away after the briefest of stops. I imagine the driver pulling away with limited power, a crash gearbox and very little traffic to get the right feel. By the Manchester show, I had got this to a fine art. The Magnorail motor has a large DCC chip and a bit of inertia set in it, so everything smooths out. We run a dedicated controller out front so there is no faffing around with addresses and it is always available to entertain the public.

 

Nigel

 

Edited December 29, 2022 by Llangerisech
pedantry radius/diameter

[Llangerisech]

A quick update on a unique item seen on the prototype.

 

Trains in the Dolgellau-Bala direction would drop off tokens on the standard tablet catcher apparatus and that has been on the layout since the first show. But with the river directly behind that and  a few instances of tablets falling in it, a larger net was added behind to prevent losses.

 

 

The net is made from lint netting, but with the threads shuffled around to make the holes much smaller. This is done on a card  frame surrounded by double-sided tape and the threads moved using tweezers. Once happy with the spacing being appropriate and replicating a cargo net, matt black aerosol spray is used before cutting to size. The white frame is simply plasticard square rod and sheet with a 0.2mm bar threaded through the top as support for the net. It still needs weathering , but looks the part and should keep the local experts happy at the Bala show in September.

 

For me, this is one of the beauties of modelling a prototype. The mindset is not "what should go there to make it look realistic?" to "how do I make that so it matches the prototype?" It is a different discipline, but rewarding when it is right.

 

I have also added the "beware of trains" signs at the end of the platforms, so another detail spotted by helpful show-goers has been done.

 

Nigel

[CF MRC]

When I first saw the net I thought you were going to do a working TPO… Lovely detail. 
 

Tim

[2mmMark]

12 minutes ago, CF MRC said:

When I first saw the net I thought you were going to do a working TPO… Lovely detail. 
 

Tim

"It's two bridges then 45 beats."

Great bit of modelling Nigel.  I can't recall seeing that done before.

 

Edited March 26, 2023 by 2mmMark

[2mmKiwi]

Looking really nice Nigel - can I ask what you use for your fencing wire ?

It looks pretty effective 

 

SteveM

[Llangerisech]

Hi Steve,

The fencing is made up with 1mm square brass posts which are drilled in a jig on my Proxxon MF70 mill. Five holes are drilled using a 0.3mm drill. So I do batches in position 1, then go through the batch in position 2 etc until all 5 holes are there. The posts are then painted a concrete colour. The wire is from a 7 strand cable and each is 0.010mm copper, but as it is tinned, it ends up as 0.012mm for a single strand. Tinned copper at least looks like the right colour for steel prototype wire. (RS Components 874-0374  hook up wire). I cut a length of the cable, strip the insulation and separate the strands. I plant the posts in position using a height jig made from card and a distance jig. Once planted, the wire is threaded. A little superglue in the post at one end allows a small amount of tension to be applied before more superglue is applied at the other end of the run. So it is about as close to scale as I could get and so far seems to be holding up. It is fine enough to disappear at some angles and yet be in place when studied closely. I completely see why people leave out wires (I still have to leave them off telegraph posts!) but this was fine enough and controllable enough for me to justify the effort of putting the wire in.

Nigel

[2mmKiwi]

Thanks Nigel - Its looks great and worth the effort- although like you, I can understand why some people don't add the wire. People might argue about the scale diameter etc but in the end the eye makes up its own mind and I think yours doesn't appear excessively large in diameter on the model, so job done.

Thanks for your response mate

Steve

[Llangerisech]

Jig drilling fence posts

 

As I had another batch to do I thought a quick picture of the jig would be in order.

 

The block is 6mm square brass and has two steps milled into the underside so that it always sits level in the machine vice. The post slot was then milled using a 1mm bit which happily produces a rounded end for 1mm square brass posts. The five drilling points were then measured and initially drilled using the 0.3mm drill. Equivilents were also made at the front edge and lines then scribed to make lining up easier. Then the holes  in the centre of the milled section are opened out to about 0.8mm to remove and load on the 0.3mm drill when drilling the posts. So each post is pushed in and just retained to one side of the hole with a screwdriver. Then the hole is drilled. Also shown are two posts at the 80 per cent complete stage and the mill set up to do the fifth hole. The gap between the lower holes is 1mm.

[Llangerisech]

Another vehicle

 

At exhibitions, the moving vehicle has definitely been a bit of a hit, so another suitable for 1930s period was required. I have various ideas for future additions, including simple conversions of 1950s trucks. But let us have a look at the latest fleet addition.

 

The layout is based in Wales and the nearest manufacturer of vehicles was actually Sentinel, just over the border in Shrewsbury. Having done a bit of digging, I found that a DG4 variant from around 1932 would be ideal. Of course, no-one produces one of these in 2mm scale, but having found drawings on line, I figured building one around a Faller chasis kit would be viable.

 

So the cab was built up from plasticard with the nose a solid chunk that could be carved to shape. The sides and rear are standard sheet and after filing to shape, some wire was added to the nose to give the distinctive profile. The roof was separate to allow a basic interior and crew to be added.

 

The main components were then painted, crew etc placed in and the roof added.

 

Then the windscreen could be added and the whole lot placed on the chassis. The flatbed was then built to fit with a scribed plastic top and a brass substrate to keep it flat and strong.

 

Once proven, the final items of underslung equipment, such as the boiler, tank and cylinder block could be made from plastic a s purely representative shapes rather than high-res modelling. This is, after all, a vehicle that is either moving or a good couple of feet from the viewing public, so the cruel close ups here are barely noticed on the layout.

So we now have another option to ring the changes alongside the incumbent "Bedford". A little weathering and maybe some coal sacks as a suitable load still to be done, but I am happy with the results so far.

During my research I found that Skoda produced these vehicles under licence and rarely had front windscreens in their versions. Maybe we should ask the Czechs to arbitrate on whether to pronounce Shrewsbury as  Shrew or Shrow??

 

Nigel

 

 

[Donw]

Excellent work Nigel.  You have captured the feel of the area.

I am interested in building something based on Dolgellau at the turn of the century. I am torn between 7mm where I have Beaconsfield and kits for the locos or 2mm where it would be practical to capture the spread of the place. Trouble is I lack the courage to try a scratchbuild of Mazeppa. Because of the steep gradient down to Dolgelley there was a weighted catch point to trap any runaways. 

 

I lived in Shropshire for some years including Bayston Hill at one point and only ever heard folk calling it Shrewsbury (as in a shrew).

 

Don

 

[Llangerisech]

Hi Don

But if you do build a model of Mazeppa, think of all the level crossing gates you'd have to rebuild!

 

I had a friend who lived in Shrewsbury and it seemed to be a 50/50 on the pronunciation. Check out the Mark Steel's in town episode on BBC Sounds for further confirmation of it. Could be a modern phenomenon since you left with a load of blow-ins!

 

Good to hear from you and thanks for the comment.

Nigel

[Llangerisech]

Well we debuted the new backscene at the Bala show this weekend. A photo I took 4 years ago has finally been printed into a backscene format and replaced the commercial version I have used up to now.

This is the ID Backscenes item that we started with. It is good quality and had a very similar profile to the real place, so was a reasonable effort. But it comes in sections and however careful you are, it does suffer a little on a flexible background.

 

It also puts the background a fair bit more distant.

 

 

So the replacement is the genuine article, is all one piece and brings the valley in towards you more successfully. It is also printed on a more suitable vinyl. All in all money well spent on the printing.

 

Just need to tone in the foreground tree foliage a little to blend even better. The camera was getting a little confused with light levels and the contrast is greater than the eye sees.

[Llangerisech]

Later Locos - BR Standard 4MTs

 

Drws-y-Nant saw a lot of the 4MT standards in the early 60’s displacing a good number of the Manors. But I figured this would be a tricky build until I saw how nice the Farish Standard 5s were and I checked out line drawings and compared the 5 and 4.

 

I discovered that the 4MT 4-6-0 could be laid side by side with a 5MT and the differences were:

1 shorter smoke box not quite flush with the footplate but much less proud

2 Chimney to front of firebox was critically the same shape according to the drawings

3 Shorter firebox with safety valves re-centred

4 Cab essentially the same as the 4MT Mogul with slightly shorter roof.

The valve gear is almost a direct match, so the smaller driving wheels are the biggest difference, plus the shorter chassis back end. The rear wheelbase is 6 inches shorter, meaning 1mm movement on the model.

OK a class expert may there is more to it than that, but they are the key visual differences. Bits of pipework are relatively simply to put together on top of the basic shape.

 

I had a 4MT Mogul sitting around that I wanted to convert but never actually got around to and a friend had given me a second body for one of these, so I had one to pull apart.

 

In the end I kept the original Mogul in one piece and bought a second spare 4MT mogul body, 2 tender bodies and 2 tender chassis mouldings (nothing mechanical) from the Farish spares department. In addition to the two 5MT victims, and a load of regular 2mm conversion bits, the following shows how I made the first of two 4MTs out of that lot and produce something that looks close enough to the photos I have for use on the layout.

 

I knew I wanted 2 4MTs for the fleet, so purchased a couple of Standard 5s from the Bluebell Railway model shop which is now pretty much my nearest physical shop.

Both were test run and found to be excellent runners. The challenge was to do all the conversion work without impacting the quality of operation and with minimal impact on the excellent finish of the Farish model. So this shows the cut to the 5MT body and then the old and new combinations side by side.

 

 

After all the body measurements were done, I looked to figure out a way to shorten the wheelbase. As Farish use the hornblock style bearings, I figured I could replace the rear set with large items that allowed the rear axle to move forward.

Milling the chassis to accommodate this was pretty straightforward, once the brave pill has been taken. But Farish will sell chassis blocks if all goes pear-shaped.

Along with cut and shut coupling rods from the association shop and replacement wheels, the chassis mods were pretty simple after that – the same as doing a regular standard 5 finescale conversion. Admittedly some chopping with a hacksaw at the back end to make it fit the body was required, but this was just “excess” metal and had no mechanical impact. Basically anything metal aft of the motor on the top of the chassis and behind the drawbar pin on the lower section was removed along with a bit of fettling to allow the cab to sit in the right position.

 

The 11mm drivers are part of the smaller size look of the 4MT and these certainly help visually. I made up a solid front bogie to use Association wheels, although the original bogie is still shown in the photos.

 

The tenders use a conventional 2FS split chassis from etched nickel silver and PCB and this sits neatly into the tender. I put a 6 pin Zimo decoder in the tender and shortened the Farish drawbar, with soldered flexible wires to connect the stiff drawbar wires to the chassis. The motor wires followed the same sort of routing as per the 5MT back to the decoder. The tender bodies for the 4MT Mogul are BR2 tenders and have a good built in weight as the Moguls are tender drive. Without the mechanical gubbins there is good room for a decoder and a decent weight to make it ride well.

Once all put together, no body painting or re-lining has been needed, only conventional number change transfers. So a combination of 73050 and 76053 has become 75023, and after a touch of weathering and a suitable Modelu crew, it will be ready for service on Drws y Nant.

Then I just need to do the second one to create 75009!

 

You can see here how much the 4MT combo is shorter than the original 5MT .

It may not be perfect, but it captures the feel of the 4MT I see in the photos I have of Drws Y Nant.

 

We hope to have some more 1950's and 60's trains running at Abrail in early March in addition to the 1930s stuff already available.

 

[Donw]

Very nice Job. I much prefer the Manors but that will look the part.

 

Don

[bécasse]

That is so nice (for an enterprising reworking of another model) that I anticipate an early announcement from Graham Farish that they intend to add a 4MT to their range.