Wiring 6 Pin 4 Function decoders

[PJ-101]

I have just purchased a Dapol Imperium 5 6 pin 4 function decoder which says 'Full instructions included inside' ......this is not true!  I understandf the 6 pin wiring, 4 for the motor/pickups and two for lighting functions, usually directional, but I have no idea how to wire for the other 2 functions as it says 4 functions?  I was looking to have a function for the front light, rear light and internal lighting, leaving one unused.  There is a 2 function version of this chip, so the 4 functions must be accessible somehow. There are no solder tabs on the chip itself.  Any ideas would be very much appreciated!  Thanks.

[ISW]

15 hours ago, PJ-101 said:

Any ideas would be very much appreciated!  Thanks.

If you use the RMWeb search (I used Google actually), you'd find the following posting. Seems they had the same problem, and had to return it in the end.

 

Ian

 

 

[PJ-101]

Thanks Ian, that's very helpful as you say, someone else had exactly the same problem!  Over a year later and it's still being sold as 'four function'. Dapol sales have not responded. I will be referring this to trading standards if Dapol ignore my email. 

[ISW]

2 hours ago, PJ-101 said:

Dapol sales have not responded.

Oddly, the Dapol UK website (https://www.Dapol.co.uk/search?q=decoder) doesn't have an Imperium 4-function 6-pin decoder in the list! I did find a CV listing (attached) that makes reference to up to 6-functions, but I can't 'translate' the text into anything meaningful.

 

Since many other major retailers stock the Imperium-5 6-pin 4-function decoder (Rails of Sheffield & Kernow Model Centre to name just two), why not give them a call and ask about the instructions on how to use/wire the 4-functions? Surely someone has made it work ...

 

Ian

imperium-cvlist_1-0D.pdf

[Crosland]

Pedantically, functions are selected on a cab and are internal to a decoder. A decoder can support many more functions than it has outputs (i.e. wire connections), that's what function mapping is for.

 

You could, if you wanted, map F28 on your cab to some lighting effect. It doesn't mean the decoder has to have 28 physical outputs.

 

Having said that, it would be unusual for a decoder to only support four functions, so I think Dapol (or whoever) are just mislabelling the number of wires as well as calling them functions. "function outputs" would be better.

[Grovenor]

While you may be correct pedantically my experience of decoder sales literature is that functions in that context is used to mean outputs and I would expect a decoder sold as 6 pin 4 function to have a couple of spare wires or at the very least solder pads. Usually this info is available before purchase, if not don't buy as it implies the seller doesn't know what they are selling.

[PJ-101]

On 21/04/2023 at 21:52, ISW said:

Oddly, the Dapol UK website (https://www.Dapol.co.uk/search?q=decoder) doesn't have an Imperium 4-function 6-pin decoder in the list! I did find a CV listing (attached) that makes reference to up to 6-functions, but I can't 'translate' the text into anything meaningful.

 

Since many other major retailers stock the Imperium-5 6-pin 4-function decoder (Rails of Sheffield & Kernow Model Centre to name just two), why not give them a call and ask about the instructions on how to use/wire the 4-functions? Surely someone has made it work ...

 

Ian

imperium-cvlist_1-0D.pdf 91.44 kB · 16 downloads

Thanks Ian. I have contacted the retailer to see whether they can help, although as you say, this is commonly advertised by a number of retailers so I feel like I need to get to the bottom of this one way or another. If it's misleading, Dapol will need to change the description.

 

[PJ-101]

On 22/04/2023 at 11:17, Crosland said:

Pedantically, functions are selected on a cab and are internal to a decoder. A decoder can support many more functions than it has outputs (i.e. wire connections), that's what function mapping is for.

 

You could, if you wanted, map F28 on your cab to some lighting effect. It doesn't mean the decoder has to have 28 physical outputs.

 

Having said that, it would be unusual for a decoder to only support four functions, so I think Dapol (or whoever) are just mislabelling the number of wires as well as calling them functions. "function outputs" would be better.

I'm really a bit of a newbie re DCC and still finding my way, but a 6 pin 2 function, has 2 function outputs and an 8 pin 4 function, has 4 function outputs which all makes sense. I am aware that some chips have solder pads rather than wires to make up the additional function outputs, but the Dapol one does not. Also they sell a 6 Pin 2 function chip for a few pounds less, so I'm struggling to see how this one is any different if it only has 6 wires and no solder pads.

 

[Kaput]

A 6pin decoder either needs extra wires or solder pads to have any more than 2 function outputs.

 

If theres no solder pads then there is some seriously iffy advertising going on here.

[PeterStiles]

Maybe "backwards" and "forwards" are now considered "Functions"?

[Crosland]

On 26/04/2023 at 08:25, PeterStiles said:

Maybe "backwards" and "forwards" are now considered "Functions"?

With my pedants hat on, they are functions.

 

See NMRA standard S-9.2.2 where the forward and reverse headlight functions can be mapped to various output wires.

[PJ-101]

Just to confirm for anyone who finds this thread - the information which came back from the retailer was 'Dapol have told us that the decoder is a two function decoder and the factory have mislabeled the decoder as a 4 function'.  Interesting that the Imperium 5 6 pin is still widely being advertised as four function!