Moving soon 20x10 N gauge

[Camps Junction]

Also I wreckon from the station to the apex at the top of the image where there’s a junction nearest Oxford that’s about 900 meters but will only get about 650 metres in so will have to find away to crop it down without changing it to much, Drew

[KingEdwardII]

27 minutes ago, Camps Junction said:

any idea how I can get round this?

I think the Library of Scotland site may have some older aerial photos available, but I have not checked whether they cover Didcot. Their site is a treasure trove, but it takes a lot of time to wade through it all.

 

Yours, Mike.

[Camps Junction]

Hi all hope your all having a good weekend? So I’ve been trying like hell to get Didcot station and Junction onto the new size 20x12, But know matter how hard I tried even cutting it down it just didn’t look right neither did it fit, I ended up going back to my origanal idea which was the place I lived opposite as a kid, Bounds Green Junction, Had to add two lift out sections, Move the station and add a loop there is still lots of tweaking but I think it’s getting there. So in 3 months I’ve done a full circle. Drew

[ISW]

56 minutes ago, Camps Junction said:

I ended up going back to my original idea which was the place I lived opposite as a kid, Bounds Green Junction,

Drew,

 

Now I like that much better, model the place you knew as a child. That's certainly what I did, and it helped me immensely to get me to concentrate on the major 'elements' that I wanted to model, plus the trains (passenger & freight) that I wanted to run.

 

A few comments / questions:

1. Top-right on your plan, what happens to those 4-tracks (where, in reality, they enter a tunnel)? Is that to some storage sidings / fiddle yard?
2. You have 4 platforms at the station, but I don't see why. The station is Alexandra Palace Station (well, that's what google earth implies ...), and there are currently just 3-platforms. However, back in 1999, there were only 2-platforms. Given you are modelling Era-7, shouldn't you be looking at the track layout from that time?
3. Have you thought about what trains you want to run (roundy-roundy, continuously), run on the 'branch' through Bowes Park (the next station on the branch), and what you want to operate to/from the depot? This will help decide (dictate?) those elements of the track layout you need to keep.

Ian

 

[Camps Junction]

5 minutes ago, ISW said:

Drew,

 

Now I like that much better, model the place you knew as a child. That's certainly what I did, and it helped me immensely to get me to concentrate on the major 'elements' that I wanted to model, plus the trains (passenger & freight) that I wanted to run.

 

A few comments / questions:

1. Top-right on your plan, what happens to those 4-tracks (where, in reality, they enter a tunnel)? Is that to some storage sidings / fiddle yard?
2. You have 4 platforms at the station, but I don't see why. The station is Alexandra Palace Station (well, that's what google earth implies ...), and there are currently just 3-platforms. However, back in 1999, there were only 2-platforms. Given you are modelling Era-7, shouldn't you be looking at the track layout from that time?
3. Have you thought about what trains you want to run (roundy-roundy, continuously), run on the 'branch' through Bowes Park (the next station on the branch), and what you want to operate to/from the depot? This will help decide (dictate?) those elements of the track layout you need to keep.

Ian

 

Hi Ian thanks for your reply , So the mainlines following Dagmar Rd yes they will just go into tunnel and down into a fiddle yard underneath the main layout, Thanks for the platform info I will adjust that as you couldn’t see the Woodgreen/Alexander Palace station from Dagmar Rd, As for what I’d be running as per Era 7 the up and over line I only ever remember Dmu,s on that line apart from the odd engine coming over (no carriages on) Mainline I can remember Deltics and Warships running on them, I believe the sheds have been changed with more upto date ones since 70s/80s so that will get sorted with items of that period as for the yard area I can only remember seeing  08 shunters setting up passenger trains in the sidings ,Engines being repaired even a few steam still around in early 70s, Refueling also, But thanks for station info will see if I can find any pics of that period, Drew.

[ISW]

3 minutes ago, Camps Junction said:

thanks for station info will see if I can find any pics of that period,

Drew,

 

This is what Google Earth shows for the station in 1999, just the 2 island platforms:

 

But there is loads more map information at the following website:

https://maps.nls.uk/geo/find/#zoom=16.0&lat=51.59789&lon=-0.12044&layers=11&b=1&z=0&point=0,0

 

Ian

[Camps Junction]

1 hour ago, ISW said:

Drew,

 

This is what Google Earth shows for the station in 1999, just the 2 island platforms:

 

But there is loads more map information at the following website:

https://maps.nls.uk/geo/find/#zoom=16.0&lat=51.59789&lon=-0.12044&layers=11&b=1&z=0&point=0,0

 

Ian

Yes I’ve made a start sorting bits out. Drew

[ISW]

5 minutes ago, Camps Junction said:

Yes I’ve made a start sorting bits out

Drew,

 

You don't hang about do you ... 

 

You'll need to 'look' at the southern station approach to see which crossovers / turnout you need to incorporate to actually operate the layout the way you want.

 

1 hour ago, Camps Junction said:

and down into a fiddle yard underneath the main layout,

You don't seem to have left 'space' to achieve this? Those 4-track will have to drop several cm, plus curve round (to be going 'down' your plan) to get 'under' the main layout. This usually takes up more space than you think. It did on my layout, so make sure you have a workable 'plan' before you get too far with the main layout.

 

Ian

 

[Camps Junction]

Tomorrow I’ll bring the tunnel entrance forward and have a look at the southern end of the station, Thanks again Drew, Ps still got 3 months to get this fettled , Now doing the layout I’ve wanted for 50yrs feel more confident with the idea,. Until recently I did have some photos taken from the bedroom window in Dagmar Rd but seem to have disappeared. 

[Camps Junction]

A bit more fiddling if anyone knows Bounds Green Yard the High level that goes over the mainline north the mains will go into a tunnel with a fiddle yard below the base board, The outer loop will be a high level around the Up line and Down will follow a slightly differant route and over a double steel bridge above a river or gully , Still lots of bits and pieces but think it’s taking shape atlast. Drew.

 

 

Edited March 3 by Camps Junction

[njee20]

Why condense all 4 running lines into a single one at the fiddle yard entrance? That just seems to create a bottleneck. 
 

Those curves top left seem tight given the huge amount of space you have, making them much more gentle would pay dividends. 
 

I don’t quite understand why you’re trying to fit all the ‘interest’ into 2 sides, then have 2 sides which are just totally plain track. Why not try and open the whole plan up a bit? You’ll still have time for trains in the scenery. 

[Camps Junction]

19 minutes ago, njee20 said:

Why condense all 4 running lines into a single one at the fiddle yard entrance? That just seems to create a bottleneck. 
 

Those curves top left seem tight given the huge amount of space you have, making them much more gentle would pay dividends. 
 

I don’t quite understand why you’re trying to fit all the ‘interest’ into 2 sides, then have 2 sides which are just totally plain track. Why not try and open the whole plan up a bit? You’ll still have time for trains in the scenery. 

It’s only 3 if you look not 4 also there going to the fiddle yard, , The curves at top left are 3ft to do 90 degrees, As said this is not done there is a stone quarry/yard bottom left to go in also a double steel bridge just before stone yard, Plus bottom right the bridge will be going over a river/gully, As for a lot in one place it’s about bounds green yard that I lived opposite as a child. Thanks Drew

[Harlequin]

Doesn't the outer circuit also have to cross the river or gully?

 

Have you thought about the level of the FY? Is the gradient down to it shallow enough for the trains you want to run? How will you reach it when things go wrong?

 

Every train leaving the FY runs anti-clockwise. So if you want anything to run clockwise it has to stop, reverse and crossover. That may or may not be prototypically correct and is a problem for loco-hauled trains.

 

Edited March 3 by Harlequin

[Camps Junction]

As I’ve said it’s still a work in progress witch has been worked on for over 6 months and still have another 3 months before I can start on the base boards, Thanks Drew

[Harlequin]

I assume you're posting here because you want feedback?

 

BTW: The removable section is too small to be useful in accessing the top right corner.

 

[njee20]

8 hours ago, Camps Junction said:

It’s only 3 if you look not 4 also there going to the fiddle yard, , The curves at top left are 3ft to do 90 degrees, As said this is not done there is a stone quarry/yard bottom left to go in also a double steel bridge just before stone yard, Plus bottom right the bridge will be going over a river/gully, As for a lot in one place it’s about bounds green yard that I lived opposite as a child. Thanks Drew

Ok, it’s 3 lines, but you show the 4th just stopping? Again you’ve got a really tight curve there into the fiddle yard. At one point you were talking about a helix, presumably that’s off the cards?

 

that curve at the top left is less than 12” on the inside track, given the grid it’s easy to see it’s nothing like 3’, although it could be, and would look better. 
 

It’s a great plan - just needs a bit of finessing. Stuff like that will ruin a great layout if you find it doesn’t actually work in practice. Like Phil though, I’m assuming you actually want the feedback…

[Camps Junction]

Yes Feedback is allways welcome, I’ve spent most the day with anyrail fettling  the layout, Making Shaw the loops run UP & Down  with no issues, Helix is not of the cards at all,  Once I’ve got it so I’m happy with the design and base boards are all done I will print it out and transfer to base boards if it doesn’t work then I can make changes, I’d sooner spend 8 months planning or even 2 years if I have to as I’d sooner make the mistakes at this point, The actual main junction will be all on the same level whilst the rest will be block raised so I can raise the track and also put in pitches, rises and drops as I see so many layouts all on the same level, But that’s a way of yet, When I get a final plan sorted I can then order the points as I currently have 8 box’s of code 55 flexi, Anyway enough for now thanks for the feedback will try and get more done tommorow , Cheers Drew.

[Camps Junction]

More fettling last night and this morning, Drew

[stivesnick]

Hi 

 

I am trying to understand how you intend to operate this layout. 

 

The real Bounds Green depot would send empty stock towards Kings Cross during the day and then these trains would operate in service down the main line into your lower fiddle yard. At present there is no fiddle yard or station to represent Kings Cross. At the end of the day the trains would return to the depot by running over the flyover and then reversing in a spur  between the tracks at Bowes Park station. 

 

When planning a layout, I find it useful to write down what train movements I expect to operate as a way of checking that the track plan will allow me to do that but also that I don't have too much redundant track that would never be used.

 

Hope this helps. 

 

Regards 

 

Nick 

[ISW]

18 hours ago, Camps Junction said:

Once I’ve got it so I’m happy with the design and base boards are all done I will print it out and transfer to base boards if it doesn’t work then I can make changes,

Drew,

 

I hope it doesn't come to that. The whole point of planning, planning, and more planning, is to avoid such occurrences.

 

Printing the layout out and transferring it to the baseboards is what I did too:

 

I then used a bodger (pin, nail, something sharp) to put holes through the paper and into the underlay to 'transfer' the alignment to the underlay. I did this at all key alignment points in curves (TS, SC, CS, ST, etc), all the turnout extremities, and then generally at ~150mm spacing. I then just 'joined the dots' to draw the alignment on the underlay.

 

When it comes to designing the baseboards, I did mine in Xara Designer Pro X10. However, when it came to making the Upper Level baseboards, there was far more '3D' involved, with tracks going under/over each other, and Ramps to join to. To get this right I used SketchUp instead, like this:

 

It's a great tool, and lets you 'zoom / pan' about the layout, looking underneath the baseboards checking for clearances, and measuring off all the main dimensions.  There's no way I'd have been able to make the baseboards (and have them fit together!) without this drawing.

 

Ian

 

Ian

[Camps Junction]

6 hours ago, stivesnick said:

Hi 

 

I am trying to understand how you intend to operate this layout. 

 

The real Bounds Green depot would send empty stock towards Kings Cross during the day and then these trains would operate in service down the main line into your lower fiddle yard. At present there is no fiddle yard or station to represent Kings Cross. At the end of the day the trains would return to the depot by running over the flyover and then reversing in a spur  between the tracks at Bowes Park station. 

 

When planning a layout, I find it useful to write down what train movements I expect to operate as a way of checking that the track plan will allow me to do that but also that I don't have too much redundant track that would never be used.

 

Hope this helps. 

 

Regards 

 

Nick 

 

[Camps Junction]

Thanks bud as I’ve said still a way to go , I’ll shortly look into the workings of the junction and the then I can finally get the right plan that operates the right way.I stil have 2 or 3 months before any physical work will start,  Many thanks for the info Drew

 

Edited March 4 by Camps Junction

[Camps Junction]

so this is where i am in the hope it should run close to how it should ,Also put in hidden fiddle yard/ return loop think its getting close???? drew PS i forgot to put the 2ftx2ft access panel back in main yard will do so when i next update'

[ISW]

3 hours ago, Camps Junction said:

so this is where i am in the hope it should run close to how it should

Down in the bottom-right, you have the Mainlines turning off the Branch lines. You be better (and more prototypical) to have the Mainlines running straight into the tunnel (to the fiddle yard), with the Branch Lines err, well, branching off.

 

Would the Quarry benefit from a headshunt? This would let you 'shunt about' in the sidings without affecting the mainlines.

 

You seem to have 'invented' a new junction top-right, that isn't / wasn't there. Any reason?

 

Ian

[Camps Junction]

tried again lol drew