Continental Wagon ID help please

[Mol_PMB]

Having found a rich new vein of photos of my favourite chocolate factory branch online at www.polier.ch, I've had a bit of a 'WTF is that?' moment. Can anyone help to identify this wagon for me? The one with the pitched roof.

 

Photos are from this web page, the archive of R Villoz:

http://www.polier.ch/Fotoarchiv/V/VillozR/VillozR.htm

 

The date is given as 1982 and that is plausible given the condition and livery of the other vehicles in view.

Although this is in Switzerland, My 1978 copy of the SBB CFF freight wagon catalogue doesn't list any wagons like this.

 

 

 

 

 

With the grilles at the top and the shutters at the bottom, could it be a cattle wagon? But there's no flap at the bottom of the door.

Frustratingly the lettering is illegible in these images.

 

Any help would be very welcome.

(especially if it turns out someone makes an O gauge model of it, though I expect that's very unlikely!)

 

Cheers,

Mol

 

Edited February 24 by Mol_PMB
spelling

[Andy Hayter]

The pitched roof is typical of those from the mid 20th century FS Italian wagons.

 

This one from Roco is similar but not identical:

https://www.reynaulds.com/products/Roco/56066.aspx

 

 

I have expanded the view and think I can make out FS at the end of the third row up on the markings at the far end.

[Mol_PMB]

Many thanks!

There's certainly a strong family resemblance in that Roco van, although it's a longer wheelbase variant.

That's great because at least it gives me a country to search in!

 

Edit: this Tillig TT model appears to be the right prototype:

https://www.tillig.com/eng/Produkte/produktinfo-14885.html

 

 

Cheers,

Mol

Edited February 24 by Mol_PMB

[Mol_PMB]

It's an FS Ghkkms like this one:

https://www.photorail.it/forum/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=175

 

I think the one on the transporter wagon at Bulle is the variety without a brake cabin.

 

I've found models in TT and HO, and even gauge 1, but not yet an O gauge one.

https://www.printables.com/model/181876-fs-carro-merci-tipo-f-ghkkms-spoor-1-spur-1-gauge-

[Mol_PMB]

OK, looks like this was an expensive photo to find.

 

I've already got an order of rollwagen on the way from Schnellenkamp, and now it seems he makes something very similar to this van:

https://spur-0-kaufhaus.de/epages/f9725276-ffe7-4b2e-aab8-fd80f674b4d6.sf/en_GB/?ObjectPath=/Shops/f9725276-ffe7-4b2e-aab8-fd80f674b4d6/Products/81100-1

 

Not only that, look on the right of this photo at the more modern sliding wall van:

...similar to the one seen here at Broc-Fabrique...

...and he makes them too!

https://spur-0-kaufhaus.de/epages/f9725276-ffe7-4b2e-aab8-fd80f674b4d6.sf/en_GB/?ObjectPath=/Shops/f9725276-ffe7-4b2e-aab8-fd80f674b4d6/Products/s91024-01

 

 

 

 

 

[Mol_PMB]

Revisiting this thread and this pitched-roof wagon on a transporter at Bulle:

 

After further research I've concluded that the pitched-roof wagon is an Italian Ghms in the 83 FS 163 # ###-# number series, very much like this one, and with exactly the same livery and lettering:

Since I can't read the actual number of the one on the transporter at Bulle, I'm tempted to use the number of the wagon pictured above. The only physical difference I can see between them is the type of leaf springs.

 

Some of these were coded Ghkkms but the one on the transporter at Bulle seems to have the shorter Ghms code.

The 163 number seems to define a wagon without brake cabin, and with two sliding vents per side.

Many of these wagons had 4 vents per side (162 number series) or 4 vents and a brake cabin (161 number series), and they all seem to have been Ghkkms. I'm not sure what the kk signifies.

 

Unfortunately for my bank balance, Schnellenkamp made models of some of these vans in O gauge a few years ago. They certainly did some Italian versions although I'm not sure if they made exactly the type in my photo - possibly only the ones with 4 vents per side. However, all the Italian ones have sold out; only a couple of variants remain in stock and those are in DR livery. With limited choice I ordered this one:

 

To create my desired prototype I will have to add the sliding vents to the sides, then repaint the body with new decals followed by some weathering. That shouldn't be too hard and will make the wagon my own. It will be quite distinctive among the Swiss and German vans with their rounded rooves.

 

 

 

[jonhall]

For an interesting gallery of Italian wagons I would point you in this direction 

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/alcoalbe/albums/72157626296398927/with/6907663136

 

Jon

[5944]

On 14/03/2024 at 08:57, jonhall said:

For an interesting gallery of Italian wagons I would point you in this direction 

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/alcoalbe/albums/72157626296398927/with/6907663136

 

Jon

There are some fantastic albums on there for various things, a wonderful resource. Sadly Alessandro Albe passed away about 4 years ago, so his Flickr site is no longer updated. It also means there's a chance it could disappear at any time, so if you see anything that may be of use, download/screenshot whatever is required.

[hmrspaul]

On 24/02/2024 at 18:04, Mol_PMB said:

It's an FS Ghkkms like this one:

https://www.photorail.it/forum/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=175

 

I think the one on the transporter wagon at Bulle is the variety without a brake cabin.

 

I've found models in TT and HO, and even gauge 1, but not yet an O gauge one.

https://www.printables.com/model/181876-fs-carro-merci-tipo-f-ghkkms-spoor-1-spur-1-gauge-

Unexpectedly I photographed one of these when unloading a car at the Milan motorail depot https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/italianrailway/ea46480d4  in 1995. I suspect in "internal use" the way the door is open and it is at the blocks. 

 

Paul

[Mol_PMB]

Thanks Paul, that’s a nice view. It still has its 161 number which ought to have been changed for a vehicle in departmental use. But perhaps they haven’t got round to it. 

[hmrspaul]

7 hours ago, Mol_PMB said:

Thanks Paul, that’s a nice view. It still has its 161 number which ought to have been changed for a vehicle in departmental use. But perhaps they haven’t got round to it. 

Only guessing as to local use. Other wagons in the yard were in active service so this may well have been. I was just surprised I had a photo of a wagon of interest. As can be seen photos in Italy are very rare, I don't go out of my way at all to photograph railway subjects when on family holidays. 

 

Paul