RMweb Gold Fen End Pit Posted October 31, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 31, 2010 Hi Pannier Tank The conveyor on Fen End Pit is just over 1m long. The biggest problem I can see with your cunning bird feeding plan is finding a belt material which will deal with the elements. On Fen End Pit I used the kind of webbing used by upholsterers under chairs, I found this available in various widths (I think the current is 50mm). But being a cotton material I don't think it would take the damp very well. The key issue with a conveyor is to get the two ends exactly parallel and the unpowered end very free running. I found some small ball-races which I used inside the bottom roller, the top roller is powered by a very powerful faulhaber coreless motor with a 38:1 gear set. (this I was lucky enough to buy for a fiver from a guy who had taken them out of photocopiers). i also covered the top roller with a layer of emery paper which gives a grippy services to pull the belt. The carrying rollers on my convey are really just for show. You might find one of the rubber webbing materials used for upholstery better dealing with damp, but I would doubt it would survive out doors for very long. I'd be tempted to suggest that some kind of chain bucket lift might be more appropriate. You can buy ladder chain and some fairly chunky plastic gears that it engages with. Putting some buckets on the chain should be possible.Tip the wagons at ground level into a hopper and then lift it up to the bird table. I love the real use for a railway! one of my friends uses the 'Roselea Compost Railway' to take his kitchen waste down to the compost heap! David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ste234 Posted October 31, 2010 Share Posted October 31, 2010 I would think a lift would be the best idea, with a motor at the top or bottom, chains/ropes lifting a platform that could lift a hopper, and some sort of tipping device at the top, to dump the seed straight onto the table, and send the hopper back down, ready for the next load? Completely nuts (pun intended) idea, but I could attempt a diagram if you want Ste Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
298 Posted October 31, 2010 Share Posted October 31, 2010 Hi Pannier Tank The conveyor on Fen End Pit is just over 1m long. The biggest problem I can see with your cunning bird feeding plan is finding a belt material which will deal with the elements. On Fen End Pit I used the kind of webbing used by upholsterers under chairs, I found this available in various widths (I think the current is 50mm). But being a cotton material I don't think it would take the damp very well. The key issue with a conveyor is to get the two ends exactly parallel and the unpowered end very free running. I work with alot of belts at work, and you'd be surprised how our "Technicians" don't understand the basic design elements they need in order to work. It helps to have a small radius across the roller so the centre is a slightly larger diameter than the edges, and any slack needs to be accomodated along the return length to ensure the belt is taught at both ends. I've seen some with larger edges (a bit like a cotton reel), presumably so the belt stays on the rollers should it wander. That ought to be a last resort, if you have to rely on something to keep the belt in place then there's something wrong with the roller alignment (as stated in Dave's post above). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
panniertank Posted November 1, 2010 Author Share Posted November 1, 2010 Hello! And thankyou for your very helpful reply. I was thinking maybe of shrouding the conveyor itself with a 'roof' [i have seen these VERY long protoypes at Avonmouth near Bristol where the conveyor belt itself is housed in a long linear 'shed'] The idea here is to have a belt which would have a reach of approx 4ft or a little less. The railway itself is quite a way off the ground at the point where where the hopper and 'plant' is to be installed. I would like to construct a shed, suitably weatherproofed, where the hoppers [i have just purchased x2 old Hornby working bottom drop doors for this very purpose] would self unload, and the 'product' would then enter a protected 'storage bin' from whence the conveyor [automatically started by the train itself via microswitch] would then carry the food up to the table where it will be directed by a small chute into a dish or whatever. Everything which needs to kept dry, will be, including the hopper wagonloads themselves. I think this plan can work, and I'm determined to try it out, so, if you can supply me with the "how- to -do -it" especially as you have already done it, I would be eternally gratefull. I will be more than happy to reimburse you for your trouble. p.s. Is it possible to see your setup for some ideas on video? And does your friends compost railway use OO gauge? Fascinating stuff! Hi Pannier Tank The conveyor on Fen End Pit is just over 1m long. The biggest problem I can see with your cunning bird feeding plan is finding a belt material which will deal with the elements. On Fen End Pit I used the kind of webbing used by upholsterers under chairs, I found this available in various widths (I think the current is 50mm). But being a cotton material I don't think it would take the damp very well. The key issue with a conveyor is to get the two ends exactly parallel and the unpowered end very free running. I found some small ball-races which I used inside the bottom roller, the top roller is powered by a very powerful faulhaber coreless motor with a 38:1 gear set. (this I was lucky enough to buy for a fiver from a guy who had taken them out of photocopiers). i also covered the top roller with a layer of emery paper which gives a grippy services to pull the belt. The carrying rollers on my convey are really just for show. You might find one of the rubber webbing materials used for upholstery better dealing with damp, but I would doubt it would survive out doors for very long. I'd be tempted to suggest that some kind of chain bucket lift might be more appropriate. You can buy ladder chain and some fairly chunky plastic gears that it engages with. Putting some buckets on the chain should be possible.Tip the wagons at ground level into a hopper and then lift it up to the bird table. I love the real use for a railway! one of my friends uses the 'Roselea Compost Railway' to take his kitchen waste down to the compost heap! David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
panniertank Posted November 1, 2010 Author Share Posted November 1, 2010 Thank you Steve for your reply............And yes, maybe this idea would be better - Im prepared to take a few 'diversions' on this theme! so long as the end result is: 1. Fully automatic [i want no 'hand of god' involvement !] 2. It is weatherproofed as it it will be 'living' outdoors permanently. So, any help will be gratefully accepted. I would think a lift would be the best idea, with a motor at the top or bottom, chains/ropes lifting a platform that could lift a hopper, and some sort of tipping device at the top, to dump the seed straight onto the table, and send the hopper back down, ready for the next load? Completely nuts (pun intended) idea, but I could attempt a diagram if you want Ste Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
panniertank Posted November 1, 2010 Author Share Posted November 1, 2010 A big thank you 298 for the technical pointers. And THIS is where I need the advice....A conveyor sounds a simple project on the face of it, until it comes to the [successful] operation of same. This project right now, is just a plan, but I very much wish to turn it into a working reality because I like to see a railway, even OO gauge, earn it's keep and have another raison d' etre for it's existance other than pure visual effect - and it will also be beneficial to our feathered friends who will not be bothered by a human presence approaching their feeding station. I work with alot of belts at work, and you'd be surprised how our "Technicians" don't understand the basic design elements they need in order to work. It helps to have a small radius across the roller so the centre is a slightly larger diameter than the edges, and any slack needs to be accomodated along the return length to ensure the belt is taught at both ends. I've seen some with larger edges (a bit like a cotton reel), presumably so the belt stays on the rollers should it wander. That ought to be a last resort, if you have to rely on something to keep the belt in place then there's something wrong with the roller alignment (as stated in Dave's post above). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Chris116 Posted November 1, 2010 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 1, 2010 What a wonderful idea! Just one idea I had was to use a spiral to get the train up above the bird table and then another to get it back down again. I saw an American layout which had spirals that raised the trains over three feet so it is possible to do it. Good luck with whatever method you use. Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
panniertank Posted November 1, 2010 Author Share Posted November 1, 2010 Thank you for your reply Chris.........You know, at one point I did consider the south American option [more accurately, the Peru option] where I would run trains up to the bird table level by a series of switchbacks just like the 1/1 prototypes. It'll be simpler and more, dare I say it, authentic with the conveyor/bucket system though, apart from all the reversing which will have to be done manually albeit with the controller. Glad you like my rather quirky idea ! What a wonderful idea! Just one idea I had was to use a spiral to get the train up above the bird table and then another to get it back down again. I saw an American layout which had spirals that raised the trains over three feet so it is possible to do it. Good luck with whatever method you use. Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Chris116 Posted November 1, 2010 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 1, 2010 With a spiral you would not need to reverse at all! Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
edcayton Posted November 1, 2010 Share Posted November 1, 2010 You could use a BigBig Hymek, and have the reversing done by the little posts fixed to the track. Ed Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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