RMweb Gold RThompson Posted December 20, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 20, 2011 The minimum back to back has to be 14.5mm or 14.8mm for finescale track. Just be inserting a screw driver between the chassis and wheels will help quickly re-gauge them but make sure its as near to the axle as possible. btw all, i will try and get that promised photo of my compensated pug asap. The current collection is OK, the wheels appear to be not riding smoothly through the frog end of the points. They will go through when driven briskly but not when going fairly slowly as shunting locos should. I suspect it is a back-to-back wheel problem. I am reluctant to spend yet more on making an RTR loco run, otherwise I would have bought a kit in the first place. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RThompson Posted December 20, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 20, 2011 Hi all, heres the promised photos of my pug which i've simply melted a thick piece of brass wire into the nylon chassis block and filed the front axle slots upwards and also the keeperplate. The first 2 photos shows it underneath with the keeperplate removed and the final one shows that it works well should your poor loco need to clomb over a mis-placed screwdriver! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Griffiths Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 The minimum back to back has to be 14.5mm or 14.8mm for finescale track. Just be inserting a screw driver between the chassis and wheels will help quickly re-gauge them but make sure its as near to the axle as possible. btw all, i will try and get that promised photo of my compensated pug asap. Thanks for your help Robert, I will try this & add more weight inside the boiler if there is space. Your photos are inspiring, I will continue to perservere with my frustrating little loco!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Griffiths Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 The current collection is OK, the wheels appear to be not riding smoothly through the frog end of the points. They will go through when driven briskly but not when going fairly slowly as shunting locos should. I suspect it is a back-to-back wheel problem. I am reluctant to spend yet more on making an RTR loco run, otherwise I would have bought a kit in the first place. Continuing from the above post, I have now filled the boiler with lead, adjusted the wheel back-to-back measurements, polished the wheels & track til you can see your face in them but absolutely nothing will make this loco go through code 100 insulfrog points at anything less than a scale 90 mph. As a shunter it is a complete disaster. Don't buy one unless you want it to haul a main line express. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rope runner Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Continuing from the above post, I have now filled the boiler with lead, adjusted the wheel back-to-back measurements, polished the wheels & track til you can see your face in them but absolutely nothing will make this loco go through code 100 insulfrog points at anything less than a scale 90 mph. As a shunter it is a complete disaster. Don't buy one unless you want it to haul a main line express. That's your problem. The wheelbase is too small to span across the plastic frogs to make contact with the metal rail ends Paul A. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hartleymartin Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Surely someone produces a replacement gearset that improves the slow running. I find that a good PWM controller makes a huge difference. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 I have one which I picked up second hand... Haulage capacity isn't a problem as I've found it will pull pretty well anything its asked to within reason, bearing in mind that its a little dock tank. I now have two of these. The first, which as I mentioned was picked up second hand, runs ever so sweetly even on my pointwork and I had no hesitation in buying a new one to go with it - one of the 51235 batch. This one doesn't work; on exactly the same track it usually needs a bit of "kerfingerkopoken" to start it and then stutters and stalls. I've tried the usual; easing out the back to backs, making sure the wheels are clean and that its well lubricated, but to no avail. I get the impression that the motor keeps siezing, but there's no obvious cause. Any suggestions will be welcome. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spitfire2865 Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 I now have two of these. The first, which as I mentioned was picked up second hand, runs ever so sweetly even on my pointwork and I had no hesitation in buying a new one to go with it - one of the 51235 batch. This one doesn't work; on exactly the same track it usually needs a bit of "kerfingerkopoken" to start it and then stutters and stalls. I've tried the usual; easing out the back to backs, making sure the wheels are clean and that its well lubricated, but to no avail. I get the impression that the motor keeps siezing, but there's no obvious cause. Any suggestions will be welcome. Take it apart, fiddle with the bits, put it back together, pray. Really It may just be a faulty unit. Thats unfortunate. Good luck though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 (edited) Yes, stripped it right down and put it back together again. It appears the gears were misaligned and this in turn, fairly bizarrely appears to be at least partly due to pressure from the cab unit bearing down on the wiring of the motor unit! Anyway it goes now and I know what do do if it happens again. Seems reliable but oh so growly by comparison with the silky smoothness of some of Hornby's more recent offerings. Edited July 28, 2014 by Caledonian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spitfire2865 Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 Yes, stripped it right down and put it back together again. It appears the gears were misaligned and this in turn, fairly bizarrely appears to be at least partly due to pressure from the cab unit bearing down on the wiring of the motor unit! Anyway it goes now and I know what do do if it happens again. Seems reliable but oh so growly by comparison with the silky smoothness of some of Hornby's more recent offerings. I did the same to mine and its amazing it actually works. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turin 60 Posted August 2, 2014 Share Posted August 2, 2014 May I be a touch controversal...you could always replace the chassis with the High Level chassis kit. Assuming of course you don't mind building it. John. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flymo748 Posted August 2, 2014 Share Posted August 2, 2014 May I be a touch controversal...you could always replace the chassis with the High Level chassis kit. Assuming of course you don't mind building it. John. Why on earth would anyone mind building a High Level kit? They are an absolute joy, and the results are superb. This is my "Pug", in industrial guise, and it runs slowly enough to be almost impossible to perceive moving. That's the joy of a 108:1 gearbox for you. The High Level kit also gives you full cab detail, and plenty of room to fit a DCC chip as well. This is it going in between the frames, wrapped in red heatshrink just in case of an accidental short: Enjoy building the chassis kit. You'll not find a better quality one anywhere. Cheers Flymo 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hartleymartin Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 Hi all, heres the promised photos of my pug which i've simply melted a thick piece of brass wire into the nylon chassis block and filed the front axle slots upwards and also the keeperplate. The first 2 photos shows it underneath with the keeperplate removed and the final one shows that it works well should your poor loco need to clomb over a mis-placed screwdriver! I'm interested in what you're doing with the buffers. My pug had an unfortunate date with gravity and ended up losing and argument over right-of-way with a floor. The net result is that I'm now missing a buffer and would like to remedy the situation. Could you please supply us with some dimensions/instructions on what you've done here? From memory, the buffers were timber blocks faced with metal. I've finally plucked up the courage to add the compensation to the chassis by your methods. Does anyone know if the motor and gearset can be changed? I'd rather try fitting a Mashima motor with small flywheel and a higher-quality gearset than try to build a whole new chassis. My other 0-4-0 saddle tanks are an Ixion Manning Wardle and a Tower Models Barclay! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5050 Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 Why on earth would anyone mind building a High Level kit? They are an absolute joy, and the results are superb. This is my "Pug", in industrial guise, and it runs slowly enough to be almost impossible to perceive moving. That's the joy of a 108:1 gearbox for you. IMG_6988.JPG The High Level kit also gives you full cab detail, and plenty of room to fit a DCC chip as well. This is it going in between the frames, wrapped in red heatshrink just in case of an accidental short: IMG_6954.JPG Enjoy building the chassis kit. You'll not find a better quality one anywhere. Cheers Flymo 'Chaucer' eh? You haven't been raiding my bits box have you? I've got an RSH named 'Geoffrey'. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hartleymartin Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 Does anyone know the figures on the Hornby/Dapol motor that came with the pug? I'm looking at replacing it with a Mashima 1015 fitted with a small flywheel and a replacement gearset - the original gearset is 27:1 and I'm hoping to get a 50:1 or better gearset in. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catweasel Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 I've got one of the Hornby L&Y Pugs myself. Fitted with a hard wired TCS M1 chip in the back of the cab, it runs like a Swiss watch. I do have electrofrog points though. I played around with the CV's and got it down to a realistic top speed with a nice slow crawl when needed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium skipepsi Posted March 11, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 11, 2015 (edited) I am going the High Level route but being somewhat hamfisted I need to straighten out the connecting rods before advancing further........ Edited March 11, 2015 by skipepsi Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hartleymartin Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Well, I've moved the wheels out on the axles slightly to reduce the side-to-side hunting and I've done the trick with 1mm rod in the chassis to add compensation on the front axle. What a difference it makes! Of course, I re-installed the wheelsets the wrong way around so now the cotters/oil pots are facing downwards instead of up, but that is easy enough to fix. I'm wondering it is possible to use the stock mechanism but to upgrade it with a 40:1 Ratio gearset such as found here:http://www.scalelink.co.uk/acatalog/Sundry_Items__Lead_Foil__Chain_Etc_.html 40:1 is about the best you can do - the 50:1 and 60:1 gears are actually larger than the driving wheels of the pug! The stock gears are at a ratio of 27:1, which is really much too high for a shunter.The other possibility is to fit a Mashima 1015 with a small flywheel in place of the stock motor.I'll be doing a fair bit of work on the pug anyway, as I need to make up a new set of buffers (it ran off the end of a test-track and lost a front buffer in an argument with the floor) and the buferbeams need to be painted red anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hartleymartin Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Or I wonder if this would fit inside the pug: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/170957794741 Mashima motor with a 5.14:1 gearhead on the front, which would give a whopping 138.8:1 overall gear ratio. Perhaps not... about a 10-12mph top speed would result at 12 volts. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hartleymartin Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Doing some more mathematics... It's good to know I learned something useful in high school! Mashima 1015 with a 40:1 gearset on a pug would result in a top speed of about 30 scale mph. This is based on the figures supplied by Hollywood Foundry that the typical speed of the motor at 12 volts is 11,000 rpm, although the official rating is 16,000 rpm. So I suppose all I need to do now is order all the bits and see how it goes! Flywheel drive really ought to help out with the power interruptions inevitable on an 0-4-0. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayEllis Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 In my youth I was something of a pug addict. I've thinned the fleet out somewhat, but I still have 5 of the things in my collection. I've found that the original Dapol ones are perfect - smooth, slow and fairly quiet runners. The Hornby ones however, are a mixed bag and various versions can differ wildly, but from my experience the 'older' Hornby versions had fewer problems in comparison to the more recent offerings. That said, I have a problem with one of the fleet - and it's probably because I was tampering with it (trying to fit an ARC Barclay kit, in my first and cautious foot steps into the world of kit building). It keeps stopping. It will start out running, then gradually the pug will slow down until it comes to a halt. Picking it up off the track, giving it a bit of a prod and a shake and re-railing it will get it moving again - but the same thing happens. This happens regardless of the direction it is going in or it's speed. Taking it apart and rebuilding it does not solve the problem. In fact, it can make it worse; the pug goes from running smoothly to bouncing around and stop-starting. (I've done this several times in the past hour, it alternates between smooth and stop-start). Can anyone offer any suggestions on what I've done, and how to fix it? (If it helps - It was a Dapol pug, late 1990s model. White metal weight added to the chassis around the front axle and the cylinders. The wheels and track are clean and the pick-ups are in the correct place.) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium skipepsi Posted March 12, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 12, 2015 This may be too simple but are the rods the right way up? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayEllis Posted March 13, 2015 Share Posted March 13, 2015 (edited) No, they're definitely the correct way up (although I did have to check a few times to be sure). The pug isn't locking up when it stops, it just sort of dies. Like I said, removing it from the track and giving it a bit of a prod/shake and gently rocking the wheels is usually enough to get it working again, before it then repeats the whole process of gradually getting slower and slower. Edited March 13, 2015 by RayEllis Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spitfire2865 Posted March 13, 2015 Share Posted March 13, 2015 Pickups bent or damaged? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium skipepsi Posted March 13, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 13, 2015 Is the motor climbing out of gear or moveable in any way Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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