andypops Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Hi all, After getting to grips with the "first try", and being reasonably happy with the results, I now want to have a go at a more realistic sort of layout. This is going to be a sort of rationalised exchange sidings, where short freights are cut & tripped off to nearby factories (and the returns re-assembled) by the yard shunter. I want to fit as much as I can in, but realism is important to me. Firstly, what I want is similar to real life in the area being modelled. Hereford yard (north of the station) had (still has!) a connection to Bulmers, and a small MEB power station. There is also a steel / metal working factory (Painter Bros) on that spur, who used to recieve trainload metals, and also timber-filled OTAs were unloaded in the yard itself for onward road transport. The freight was dropped in the yard by a mainline loco, and tripped away by road or by rail using the yard shunter. Other freight flows also existed. I have discussed the planned track layout herealready, and whilst I'm now close to being decided on it, any comments will still be very helpful. Specifically, if anybody can highlight anywhere that'll need a trap / catch point!!! The layout will be: Finescale (code 75) LH / RH turnouts will be medium radius electrofrog - the Y point will be short radius Big enough to allow me to play, but small enough to be transportable, and on 2 boards 1980s-modern day era DCC controled Use electrically operated points Industrial buildings will be anonymous "modern style" metal-clad warehouses (scratchbuilt), with signage replaced depending on what I feel like running. Signalling will probably be non-existant...but I am open to suggestion on this! I want to mirror prototypical areas, and this may be possible with just a ground frame (which isn't my preferred option - I'd personally wire everything possible up!) Below is the trackplan. I know I've drawn it with horrible settrack geometry, becauseI've lost the SL parameter files somewhere on my computer. So this is as close as I can draw at the moment. When it comes to laying it, I will be using concrete sleepers for all lines, except the "industrial unit" using wooden sleeepers (since peco don't make a short Y-point with concrete sleepers) and also the "disused" connection at the bottom being wooden sleepers. The lengths of the sidings / spurs are essentially what I want to achieve. Trains are dropped off in one siding, and the loco pulls into the HS. The dropped wagons are cut by a shunter and tripped off on single lines to various industries. The loco can run around, collect returning wagons, and move off scene. My idea is that over time, the original industries have died off (along with their connections to the sidings), and the once busy exchange is now forlorn, with only a few short rakes a week. The mainline connection / entrance is a single track on the left hand side. This leads past the shunter's stabling point to the exchange sidings. A spur to a distant industry (top, LH side) has been truncated a few years previously, with the land sold off to a housing development. A modern industrial unit has sprung up on the old trackbed, and has kept the connection, with goods brought in & out by rail. To the upper-right, another old line has been truncated and kept on as a road-trail cross-shipping point. This tallies with the wood and steel both being unloaded and tripped to local businesses in real life, which went on right up until the late 90s / early 00's. I may have a crane here to aid this, or I may not. Suggestions welcome! I think I only need 1 headshunt - I can't see a big benefit from having 2, other than the additional costs of pointwork and motors! To the lower right hand side, another disused but as-yet unlifted line leads away, and will provide a nice eye-level vantage point to look along, from which to view the scene. Plus, it gives me somewhere to perhaps have a PW gang working away, for interest! I could even wire in a signal, showing a permanant red aspect. Again, very prototypical. Thank you for going to the trouble of reading all of this! I hope that it makes sense, and I really would welcome any comments / suggestions. All the best, Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mason Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Hi Andy I very much like your plan and the great detail behind how it works. i look forward to seeing it develop. One question, what will you do with the space to the top left?? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andypops Posted January 24, 2012 Author Share Posted January 24, 2012 Thanks for your reply Mason. To be honest, I'm not sure. I've toyed with the idea of having a kind of kickback from the industrial building in the process of being lifted - just a lot of ballast and some buried sleepers! I would like to use the space though. Any suggestions? Perhaps I could move the rail-road transshipping point over there? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mason Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Why not model an industrial park with different types of businesses on there, i.e a back street mechanics and a window fitters yard and a few smaller businesses. Could be alot of scope for detail away from the railway with things like lorrys being unloaded, a burger van sat on the road. and i think it would flow well into your railway area. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andypops Posted January 25, 2012 Author Share Posted January 25, 2012 That is a very nice idea. In real life, there's all manner of things going on along te side of what used to be the exchange sidings at Hereford - a window fitters, a back street mechanics...! (also an air conditioning company and a bowling alley! It's amazing how you don't notice a glaring patch of emptiness yourself though - lesson definitely learned! Thank you for your attention to detail! I've come up with a rejigged idea: Essentially this is just swapping the road-rail tras-shipping point. I think I prefer this way around, and still gives me plenty of scope for modelling the rest of the world going on in the background. I can have lorries, businesses, as well as PW / engineers doing their thing in their own compound, Although, tbh my main focus is of course the railways! (plus, I just realised - it'll give me a nice place to have those troublesome class 08s being taken to the works on low-loaders for mending!) How does it look now? Comments welcome (and appreciated) Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andypops Posted January 25, 2012 Author Share Posted January 25, 2012 My only concern is that I am going to struggle to sort out scenic breaks. A bridge on the left perhaps, but on the right hand side it might need to be low relief industrials... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mason Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 you could always mask it with a high rise block of flats, kinda at an angle so you dont lose the focus on the rail fed building to the top right. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andypops Posted January 26, 2012 Author Share Posted January 26, 2012 The problem is, there are very few flats in this area. The only thing we have similar are horrendous 70s-80s maisonnettes, and none of these are nearby. I could have a road, with some other low-relief mock-ups around though. Or, a small footpath along the edge, with just a delapidated area. Is very prototypical! And as for the building, I've started to get the accessories together, and I'm going to be painting these and sorting these out first. I know it might seem backwards, but it's the way I like to do things! When it comes to track laying, I like to hammer it all out over the course of a day, or a weekend at a stretch. Likewise ballasting (my most hated thing, ever). I'm busy for the next few, but I'll start to get the track together and make a start when I do have time. Obviously, pictures will follow. I'm getting excited about this now Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ess1uk Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Looks good I was down there the other day and the rails are very rusty even though there is new ballast on some sidings looking towards Burcott Road Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andypops Posted February 5, 2012 Author Share Posted February 5, 2012 I was down there the other day and the rails are very rusty even though there is new ballast on some sidings Thanks for that, you're quite right. It looks like they're actually doing a lot of lifting of the old rails at the moment. The new sidings and fresh ballast are on the site of the the old yard, which is a very recent, new, network rail base, with lots of huts, nice fresh tarmac and shiny vans all over the place. The only line remaining is a few short shunts inside their fences, long enough for just a couple of wagons. It's sad to see it go, in the name of "progress". Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ess1uk Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 it's happening in lots of places Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortliner Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 Andy - see my comment in your earlier topichttp://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/49721-update-rail-served-business-layout-finalised-plan/ Cheers Jack Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andypops Posted February 27, 2012 Author Share Posted February 27, 2012 Some pictures of the "work in progress". 1&2 - the track laying and testing in progress 3 - the overall trackplan, after cutting the boards, and with temporary fixings in place whist the cuts were made. My impression so far - it's been a nightmare! I'm never going to use flexi code 75 again! I'll stick with code 100, and probably settrack dimensions! (although I think this might be one of those things that you hate at the time, but later I might look back at it more favourably!) Next job - make sure the join in tracks is relaible, and fix the track down permanantly. Then to crack on with the backscene, and the droppers... I need to have a very long think about the wiring - I've never fitted a point motor in my life, and I can see this is going to give me problems. I've been trawling rmweb, and googling (brian lamberts site is quite good) about it, and I'm still not understanding all this microswitch malarkey, so any nudges in the right direction would be very welcome. I have no problem with the physical act of electronics and building circuitry, but thinking about it beforehand and understanding it is definitely not one of my strong points (and I'm a research scientist by trade!!) All the best, Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andypops Posted March 18, 2012 Author Share Posted March 18, 2012 Update: Point motors fitted. Insulating sections done / redone when I realised I hadnt fully insulated all of the frogs. I've added microswitches for the frog polarity switching, and I intend to have LEDs showing the route setting... I've designed an operation panel, and I'm in the process of converting the design to a real-life model (see picture below) ...As for the route indication, I have bicolour LEDs, which should show green for the route set, and red if the route is not set. I'm still considering my options for wiring these: 1) I could link these to the track feed / frog microswitch, but this way I won't be able to isolate the operation panel if I need to for fault finding / replacement etc. 2) I will probably use relays from the frog microswitches, so that the accesory power is completely separate from the track feed bus. This way, any fancy LEDs won't be able to cause issues / drain on the track output. More Pictures will follow, when I get 5 minutes to take them...! Andy p.s. As an aside, the white circles are (to scale) for the toggle switches controlling to point motor at the position, and the red/green circles on the panel are meant to show where the LEDs will be...but I will change these (I can see a few errors already!) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ess1uk Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 looking good Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andypops Posted April 9, 2012 Author Share Posted April 9, 2012 Hey, My apologies for the delay; have had a lot on with work, and no space at home to even do any modelling! This is just a quick picture of my most recent problem - trying to fix the join between both sides of the layout. All I can say is . The lack of alignment it driving me, well, nuts! Hopefully my progress now will be quicker.... Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andypops Posted May 7, 2012 Author Share Posted May 7, 2012 Progress update: It's been very slow. I've been busy, but I have spent the last two days working at it/ I've had to rewire the entire thing. I'm not happy but my attitude with this layout is that I want things to be right. So, new droppers, new insullating sections, a new set of points (I'd managed to drill through the spring when I was making a gap for the point motor arm), and re-siting point motors and the microswitches, to get reliability... I'm still going to have an integrated operations panel, but this isn't going to show route indications because its frankly beyond my ability. I was going to use relays and all manner of fancy things, but it is gettring too complicated. I can't wait to get this wiring finished, because I am desperate to make a start on scenery. At the moment it doesn't look anything special; in fact it looks a bit rubbish on the board, and all I have is my idea of what it should be like! I hope to add to this soon! Andy EDIT: Is there anything more frustrating than doing the last checks on the frog polarities, and finding a short circuit on the whole board? And then being completely unable to find what's causing it?!?! EDIT: It was a misbehaving microswitch. Revenge has been gained - vis a vis the electronic processes he's had his lot. This is now an ex-microswitch. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andypops Posted May 13, 2012 Author Share Posted May 13, 2012 Update: Ballasing has begun. I hate this, but the points and electrics are complete and (currently) working, so hopefully thats the right way round to do things. I hope I won't find anything broken when I next come to try it though! The control panel is just sat on a bit of open ground at the moment. I don't know where to put it yet, whether to mount it off-scene or to actually incorporate it here. Otherwise, its a big patch of open ground to fill... Some pictures: Long views of the board from the right hand side: (note the idiot's finger over the lens...) Views from the other side. The shed is a very basic scratchbuilt modern-type warehouse. I know it looks a bit basic (and not the best quality), but I havent completed it yet; I've just been trying a few different finishes on it. I've been testing clearances with OBA and VGA wagons, although I do have some longer stock (BZA, BAA, BRA), but I dont think I can justify these here. I might change my mind though, so the crearances are being tested with these too. In any case, the building won't be fixed down for a while, so a bit of ad-hoc demolition and redesign could occur if there are problems. More will follow when the ballasting is finished. Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andypops Posted May 14, 2012 Author Share Posted May 14, 2012 Here's a few pictures of some scenic accessories I've been making / painting in the meantime, for a bit of added interest: Some reclaimed / failed sleepers, waiting to be collected by the engineering dept: Isn't greyscale more forgiving...?!) These are some palletised drums. Nice, simple to make and very effective IMHO: (I will possible wrap them in clingfilm, and add a packing label too). And finally, my OTA weathering project. From this pristine, straight-stantioned waggon: To this: I like modifying these Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andypops Posted June 10, 2012 Author Share Posted June 10, 2012 Some more pictures: Side shot of a (terribly painted!) wagon being shunted: More detail of the building side...note the terrible painting on this side (the reverse as seen from the front) This is they type of scene I want to see...a short trip in, a short rake assembled, another short trip away. Simple This is a shot of the layout with boards around the outside. I know they're a bit high, but I haven't got the means to make a decent (straight) cut along the length so it'll have to do. I may put a top on, so that I can get some lights on there (and store stuff on top of it!) but that can wait. The piece of pine is just a prop to hold it while I take pictures! The grey painting is a base coat for areas which will be tarmac or hardstanding, and the green bits are going to be heavily vegetated. [is that a word?!] overgrown. The gap on the front right (where the drill is sat) will be where I mount the control panel for the power, points and lights. Note the left hand side, there is a piece of wood propped up on two handy cans. I've decided to hide the entrance (and the shunter stabling road) under a bridge. I think it will break things up a bit more nicely. And it won't be that tall when it's together! And from the front. The Bachmann OTA is there for a sense of scale. I would appreciate any comments or criticisms. All the best, Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andypops Posted June 26, 2012 Author Share Posted June 26, 2012 I've been a bit busy: 1) Building some lighting gantries. Just for a bit of interest for me, as a break. I found it quite good fun TBH. Apologies for the background mess, and I admit that the photographs arent forgiving. Some pictures: And after the first coat of paint: 2) The layout overall. A lot of static grass has gone down on one edge, and I want to sort a few electrical issues out first before I do anything else. But it's looking like it's coming together now, to my eyes at least...! (the boxes are just propping the lights up for the moment, until I sort the right resistors out to go onto the accessory bus and I can fix them down permanently. As always, comments / criticisms always welcome. Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob D2 Posted June 26, 2012 Share Posted June 26, 2012 That's looking good you are certainly getting there. The only thing I would say is with the buffer stops, I normally cut off the lamp bit, I don't think it's applicable to dirty sidings, a bit passenger terminus style. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkNewZealand Posted June 26, 2012 Share Posted June 26, 2012 Hi Andy Being an ex-herefordian I know the areas you're describing. I can remember walking along the Bulmers link a few times as a kid. Looking forward to watching the progress. Cheers Mark Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andypops Posted July 10, 2012 Author Share Posted July 10, 2012 Hi Rob & Mark, Firstly, sorry for the long delay - I have been incredibly busy with work, so I only really get to look at things for a few minutes a couple of times a week! I will do my utmost to make more time for it though! The only thing I would say is with the buffer stops, I normally cut off the lamp bit, I don't think it's applicable to dirty sidings, a bit passenger terminus style. I completely agree with your comments on the buffer stops Rob, they don't look right when I've put them down. I think they need to be dirtied a bit before I plant them (buffer grease anyone?!), and I think that I will have a completely red beam (much more prototypical) and then probably buy a couple of the Express Models light kits to show an LED behind the buffers (see the bottom of the page here), which is again much more prototypical IMHO. As for my recent work, I apologise for the poor quality of the photographs (and the OBA ballast load in the foreground!) but this is what I've been doing with my airbrush recently. I'm quite happy with the results. Before: After: Before: After: Please keep commenting everybody! Thanks, Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob D2 Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 Nice and dirty ! Keep it up - I haven't got the courage to weather much yet, I have reduced the glare from a couple of Hornby pallet vans but not owning an airbrush at present reduces the options. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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