William Dean: the greatest of them all

[The Stationmaster]

Purchased today at the Maidenhead show the newly issued title from Kevin Robertson's Noodle Books imprint - 'William Dean: the greatest of them all  His life: his locomotives: his legacy - including then story of the 'Dean Goods' at home and at war'

 

Thoroughly recommended to all GWR loco fans - plenty of illustrations particularly of Dean Goods over the years in various countries together with a lot of tabular information about the class and changes to them over the years, plus attention to other Dean designs, the story of Dean himself (albeit not a full biography but worth a read nevertheless) and what followed to replace his designs.

 

I don't entirely agree with the writer's opinions about the number and usage of GWR tank engines but a lot of the content is very well reasoned and clearly carefully researched, and very nicely laid out creating an eminently readable and attractive style.  It costs £30 but well worth it in my view and for a 'heavy' work of this sort very few errors that were noticeable to me - three concerned identification of locations in captions and one error in the text about the painting of 4 cylinder locos during wartime (stating painting in lined green had ended by March 1942 - that's not correct according to contemporaneous magazine reports).  But these are just minor nit-picking type things and don't spoil the main subject matter one little bit so the book is thoroughly recommended, especially if you're into Dean Goods.

[aberdare]

Thanks for posting that Mike. Dean is one of my favourites so I have just ordered my copy and look forward to reading it.

 

Jim

[The Stationmaster]

Time for a bump I think

[EddieB]

Well, it seems that "the greatest" refers to the locomotive superintendants and CMEs of the Great Western, so I couldn't possibly comment!

 

My interest stems from the use of the Dean Goods in the two world wars and their subsequent scattering after WWII.  Despite the bibliography limited to familiar British publications, the author does seem to have cast wide and managed to collate a very respectable list from the paucity of information available.  For instance a sighting of WD106 at Warsaw in 1941 (reported in Locomotives International 51) is given, but the dubious identification of DRB 53 7607 as WD200 (which "stayed home") at Dresden 1946, is not.   The identification of a number "OKH-TN10" as Polish is unlikely (the PKP classification was Oh101) and more likely to be a Soviet "trophy" designation.  The summary of ROD locomotives (Appendix D) is both good and concise.

 

In this context (I cannot speak on the Great Western), the photographs are much as expected and mostly previously published, but that doesn't detract from the value of bringing them into this volume.

 

Descriptions of standard gauge allied railway operations in Europe during WWI, and associated locomotive histories, have been subjects overlooked since a series of articles in Railway Magazine in the 'thirties.  The recent book by Bill Aves started filling the gap and the present volume certainly helps further.  From this perspective, at least, I would recommend this book.

[The Stationmaster]

Well, it seems that "the greatest" refers to the locomotive superintendants and CMEs of the Great Western, so I couldn't possibly comment!

 

My interest stems from the use of the Dean Goods in the two world wars and their subsequent scattering after WWII.  Despite the bibliography limited to familiar British publications, the author does seem to have cast wide and managed to collate a very respectable list from the paucity of information available.  For instance a sighting of WD106 at Warsaw in 1941 (reported in Locomotives International 51) is given, but the dubious identification of DRB 53 7607 as WD200 (which "stayed home") at Dresden 1946, is not.   The identification of a number "OKH-TN10" as Polish is unlikely (the PKP classification was Oh101) and more likely to be a Soviet "trophy" designation.  The summary of ROD locomotives (Appendix D) is both good and concise.

 

In this context (I cannot speak on the Great Western), the photographs are much as expected and mostly previously published, but that doesn't detract from the value of bringing them into this volume.

 

Descriptions of standard gauge allied railway operations in Europe during WWI, and associated locomotive histories, have been subjects overlooked since a series of articles in Railway Magazine in the 'thirties.  The recent book by Bill Aves started filling the gap and the present volume certainly helps further.  From this perspective, at least, I would recommend this book.

 

The 'Railway Magazine' articles you mention in the final paragraph are an excellent source and well worth tracking down for anyone who is interested in that period (and one I shamelessly used a good few years ago when writing about the Dean Goods).

[EddieB]

For many years that series of articles was about the only published source of information about the locomotives loaned to the ROD.

 

The following article first appeared on a book-seller's site (I believe) - whether it was a draft for the RM articles, or not, it is also a useful reference: http://www.railalbum.co.uk/articles/rod-locos.htm

[Ian Fisher]

Just a tad OT but cracking footballer too....

 

Oh no a different fella?

 

Ian

[EddieB]

Er yes and Webb scored the winner in the 1970 FA Cup Final and Marsh in the 1967 League Cup Final (though their first names differ).

 

Moving swiftly on, I see that there is some additional information in Ingo Hütter's "Die Dampflokomotiven der Baureihen 50 bis 53 der DRG, DRB, DB und DR".  This book identifies locomotives with WD numbers 111, 113, 133, 141, 142, 145, 146, 148, 149, 157, 165, 185 and 188 (among others?) were captured by the Wehrmacht.  (Some of these locomotives were subsequently recaptured ("liberated"), one even being among those sent to China, but most were either scrapped or "lost" behind the "Iron Curtain").

 

However, it seems that, far from being fictitious, there was indeed a Dean Goods renumbered as DR 53 7607 after the war.  Hütter identifies it as WD 142 (GWR 2489, Swindon 1491/1896), which had also served its home country and been sent abroad by the ROD in WWI.  It was scrapped in September 1955.

 

There is a photo of an unidentified Dean Goods, taken at Orscha-Ost (modern Belarus) in 1942.  A makeshift* side-window plating/wooden fitting has been attached to the cab sides - rather primitive to some similar modifications (c.f. the now familiar Krauss photo of WD 188 in Vienna).

 

*I'd better not say "Jerry-built"!

[Morgan+4]

Er yes and Webb scored the winner in the 1970 FA Cup Final and Marsh in the 1967 League Cup Final (though their first names differ).

 

Moving swiftly on, I see that there is some additional information in Ingo Hütter's "Die Dampflokomotiven der Baureihen 50 bis 53 der DRG, DRB, DB und DR".  This book identifies locomotives with WD numbers 111, 113, 133, 141, 142, 145, 146, 148, 149, 157, 165, 185 and 188 (among others?) were captured by the Wehrmacht.  (Some of these locomotives were subsequently recaptured ("liberated"), one even being among those sent to China, but most were either scrapped or "lost" behind the "Iron Curtain").

 

However, it seems that, far from being fictitious, there was indeed a Dean Goods renumbered as DR 53 7607 after the war.  Hütter identifies it as WD 142 (GWR 2489, Swindon 1491/1896), which had also served its home country and been sent abroad by the ROD in WWI.  It was scrapped in September 1955.

 

There is a photo of an unidentified Dean Goods, taken at Orscha-Ost (modern Belarus) in 1942.  A makeshift* side-window plating/wooden fitting has been attached to the cab sides - rather primitive to some similar modifications (c.f. the now familiar Krauss photo of WD 188 in Vienna).

 

*I'd better not say "Jerry-built"!

This information helps to plug some of the gaps. The reference "captured by the Wehrmacht" presumably means that they were taken directly into German military service. However, Hutter's inclusion of No 113 in this list might not be correct as this locomotive acquired a French running number and was one of those gathered up after the war for service in China. So far as can be determined, 21 of the French engines were sent to the Orient plus four that had so far stayed in the UK.

[EddieB]

Tourret says that f the 79 engines that went to France were captured or destroyed in the retreat.  Given that much of the SNCF rapidly came under control of the Wehrmacht doesn't preclude the locomotives being given SNCF running numbers, or that many were later recaptured by the Allies.

 

WD 113 was one of 35 locomotives that went to the former Etat, which was under German command, where it was renumbered it into SNCF stock (030.W.036).  A report of the locomotive at Savernay (near Nantes) in 1946, prior to shipment to China, suggests that it didn't stray as far as many of its classmates, and would have been an early recapture for Allied forces.

 

Ingo Hütter is concerned with Reichsbahn locomotives, of course, so lacks much of the detail found in Tourret - which still remains the authority on this subject.  I have no reason to doubt Hütter's research, knowing that he has a wide network of contacts spread across Europe.

[EddieB]

My long awaited copy of "W-D Supporting the British Expeditionary Force" by Bill Aves arrived earlier today (ordered in early February) and I find it contains perhaps the most comprehensive account of the "Dean Goods" locomotives that were sent abroad, their subsequent service and disposal.  Well worth the wait, it contains a number of both the now familiar and some previously unseen illustrations.  While the full history will never be known, the author has done a good job piecing together sometimes fragmentary information and reports to give a coherent picture.  As such it advances the material contained in the book which is the title of this thread.