Push-pull coaches on the Gare de La Bastille - Vincennes line

[Talltim]

I've been looking at  photos taken in the late 60s of the Gare de La Bastille, so atmospheric.

This was the one that has stuck in my mind for the last 7 years and prompted another look

Paris Bastille France September 1969 by loose_grip_99, on Flickr

Information on the locos is easy to find, but what are the coaches?

Would I be right in thinking that were ex-Est, like the 141TBs, Wikipedia says "Following the electrification of the line serving the Gare de l'Est in the early 1960s, push-pull stock replaced the "Bastilles". They were used until the line closed in 1969"  or are they later (i.e. SNCF built)

 

These videos are great

[Joseph_Pestell]

I need to go up to Dad's and have a look at my copy of "encyclopedie des voitures SNCF".

 

But I think I am right in saying that they were an SNCF rebuild ("metalisee") of earlier Est stock. Should be able to confirm tomorrow.

[Joseph_Pestell]

OK. Had a look at book yesterday. I had it all wrong!

 

The carriages in question were built new for suburban services from Gare de l'Est. First coming out in 1936, 120 had been built by the time of foundation of SNCF in 1938 with more being built in 1938 and 1939.

 

They came in two series. The first 120 (12 10-coach rakes) were real heavyweights, about 43.5 tonnes. The later series had modifications to make them far lighter, about 31 tonnes which was obviously an advantage for trains that stopped frequently and needed to accelerate rapidly between stops. Not easy to spot the difference between the two types apart from third class carriages which had three doors per side on the "lourdes" and two doors per side on the "allegees".

 

They would have moved to the Bastille lines as the routes out of Gare de l'Est were electrified and operated by EMUs (late 50's?).

 

All the suburban types  built in the 1930's for the Nord, PLM and Est are fairly similar. In France there was a great deal of standardisation in rolling stock long before nationalisation. I am not sure which type is the prototype for the old Hornby-Acho model if indeed it is an accurate model of any of them.

[Talltim]

Interesting what you say about the standardisation between pre-SNCF companies. I found some Nord coaches by Fulgurex, look similar, but not the same. Interestingly Fulgurex brought them out the same year their 141TB All too expensive for me of course!

[Talltim]

Paris Bastille France September 1969 by loose_grip_99, on Flickr

This shot seems to show both the earlier and later type of coach. Note the three doors on the coaches on the left, presumable 3rd class from the earlier type

Apparently the Hornby Acho model is of the later, lighter two door coaches, but shortened by a window (possibly also squashed)

[Fat Controller]

It might be worth looking for references to OCEM; this was the nationwide group which drew up standards for rolling stock post-1919. It's quite likely that similar, or possibly even identical, stock was used by several companies.

[Talltim]

I did a quick Google for OCEM, I've learnt what the French for buffers is...

[Talltim]

Looks like it would be these ones

http://www.amf87.fr/prestashop/voitures-voyageurs/1207-k146149-coffret-de-4-banlieue-est.html