Ivatt46403 Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Dear All, I'm working on a layout of Buckden station on the Kettering and Huntingdon line, which was built to Midland Railway design. (more details here on my blog: https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/blogs/entry/11876-%7B?%7D/ ) My next task is to install the point rodding and signalling. The signal box suggests that the (cute and tiny) box had 8 levers, and volume 2 of the John Swift series shows a second ground frame at the Huntingdon end, presumably just to control the entry to the long siding(?). Using these and a diagram in a photo (copied below) in "Branch Lines around Huntingdon" by Vic Mitchell, Keith Smith, Chris Awdry & Allan Mott (Middleton Press) I've come up with the following signalling and point rodding diagram: Which fills the 8 levers as follows: 1 Facing point lock, Huntingdon end 2 Entrance to goods loop, H. end 3 Loop/cattle dock points, Kettering end 4 Facing point lock, K. end 5-8 Home and distant signals, H and K ends I've included what I think the point rodding might have looked like, based on guesswork and the picture on the Wikipedia entry for the station (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Buckden_Station_1931512.jpg). In some photos there also appears to be a small ground signal at the Kettering end of the loop (added in the diagram above), but given that I don't have any levers left could this have been locked into the points (ie on lever 3?). Would it also have been likely that there would have been similar ground signals at the other (Huntingdon) end of the loop? Snippet of the original diagram here: Thanks in advance for any help! I'd like to get this right. Marcus. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailWest Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 I don't know anything about the prototype, but..... 1. It is clear from the picture that the lever-frame faced the track. Therefore in effect you need turn your sketch upside down and number from L to R. 2. I would suggest that it is more probable that the GF worked the points+FPL at the that end of the loop and that the 'long siding' point was a hand lever. There would seem little logic in the GF being for the latter, and if it were then I would expect it to be on that side of the running line for ease of access. 3. Don't forget that the MR had a penchant for 'economic' FPLs, so you might yet find an excuse to reduce your rodding still further. 4. Have you seen http://www.signalbox.org/gallery/lm/buckden.php ?? If you e-mail here http://www.signalbox.org/contact.php?id=jh you may well find that John Hinson has a numbered diagram for the location anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivatt46403 Posted February 17, 2014 Author Share Posted February 17, 2014 Hi Chris, Thanks for the suggestions - I think you're probably right that it was just a hand lever for the long siding, pictures of the site do suggest a couple of rods going down to the Huntingdon end so I think there might have been FPLs at both ends (also otherwise I have spare levers!). I'd seen the signal box page but have emailed John to see if he has anything else. thanks! Marcus. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERGE Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 I have the dog chart for the tumbler frame somewhere. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivatt46403 Posted February 18, 2014 Author Share Posted February 18, 2014 With a little help to interpret it that could be Very useful! Marcus. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERGE Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Finding it is the main problem at the moment. It has been scanned so it's lost twice, once as to where it actually is and then where it is on this machine. The picture of the block shelf needs a word of caution. This is post preservation. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERGE Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERGE Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 Next door i'm afraid. I will keep searching for Buckden. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivatt46403 Posted March 19, 2014 Author Share Posted March 19, 2014 John Hinson very kindly found and published his numbered diagram here: http://www.signalbox.org/diagrams.php?id=865 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailWest Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Looks like my guesses were OK then - phew :-) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivatt46403 Posted March 19, 2014 Author Share Posted March 19, 2014 Yes excellent well informed guessing! So would there still need to be rodding to unlock the ground from from the platform box or was it a wire? And are those two ground signals just LMS disc signals locked into the points? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailWest Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Guessing again....:-) The ground signals would be 'point indicators' driven by the points themselves. But I can't comment as to the MR/LMS style for such things. As the GF had a 'bolt release', then yes there would be a rod running from the SB to the GF. Again, whether the actual lock was at the GF, or a 'midway loc' somewhere along the rodding route, would depend on MR/LMS practice. Hopefully others can add more detail for you - or ask John Hinson again! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PinzaC55 Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 The thing which confuses me about the photo of the box interior and the block instrument is that the "double dial" block instrument and the block bell to the right of it appear to be GNR (Great Northern Railway) in origin? I used to attend railwayana auctions and have a large signalling collection but I have never seen Midland Railway blocks like that Edit* I have just noticed that the block instrument appears to be a "bodge job" with a block indicator grafted onto the top of an instrument. That explains why the dials are of different pattern , one painted and one with a paper overlay. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivatt46403 Posted March 19, 2014 Author Share Posted March 19, 2014 The thing which confuses me about the photo of the box interior and the block instrument is that the "double dial" block instrument and the block bell to the right of it appear to be GNR (Great Northern Railway) in origin? I used to attend railwayana auctions and have a large signalling collection but I have never seen Midland Railway blocks like that Edit* I have just noticed that the block instrument appears to be a "bodge job" with a block indicator grafted onto the top of an instrument. That explains why the dials are of different pattern , one painted and one with a paper overlay. Also, it's worth noting that this photo was taken in preserved condition after the box had been relocated rather than in situ. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PinzaC55 Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Also, it's worth noting that this photo was taken in preserved condition after the box had been relocated rather than in situ. Ah, so the blocks may not be original to the box? That explains why there is a double line block (Up/Down) on a single line! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERGE Posted March 21, 2014 Share Posted March 21, 2014 Ah, so the blocks may not be original to the box? That explains why there is a double line block (Up/Down) on a single line! The boxes would have had double line peggers and non peggers as trains sent forward with a ticket could follow one another being kept apart by the block posts at Buckden and Grafham. It is possible with boundary changes that Buckden gained GN blocks though this does complicate things a little.. http://www.gcrauctions.com/sale173/lot225.html Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERGE Posted June 13, 2014 Share Posted June 13, 2014 I've been following odd bits now and then on Buckden. What colour are the station signs to be? I suspect all the signage was changed to blue as soon as the Eastern took over. Have you found otherwise? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivatt46403 Posted June 13, 2014 Author Share Posted June 13, 2014 There is a dearth of colour imagery, and I haven't seen a picture of Buckden (even B&W) with that style of signage, but if it was blue up to Kimbolton I suspect you're right and it would have been in Buckden too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERGE Posted June 13, 2014 Share Posted June 13, 2014 I've emailed a friend who i think has a Buckden running in board. I'm sure it's blue. Edit to take into account modern technology and my friend can read emails on his phone seconds after i've sent one.. It was certainly blue. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivatt46403 Posted June 17, 2014 Author Share Posted June 17, 2014 How many notes do you think would it would take to persuade your friend to let me have it ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERGE Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 How many notes do you think would it would take to persuade your friend to let me have it ? If i can get it here we'll talk. He has to find it first and he's more scatterbrained than i am. Whilst looking for something else i found this... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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