asarnot

The group of sidings shown in dark red on your plan, Graham, were often known as the land sales sidings, which would explain the presence of the weighbridge. J69 no. 68504 was frequently used as Kirkcaldy station pilot, Ian, (I wonder if it was vacuum fitted?), but was an early casualty, being withdrawn before the last of the J83's (68453, 68456) or J88's which also fulfilled station and goods yard pilot duties. I have a vague memory of a J88 sitting at the ash pit at Roseberry Terrace, but no more than that. I don't think the siding was occupied much during the working day, and certainly not by more than one loco at a time. I wasn't sure about a water tank there, although that would make sense, as I doubt if there were any facilities at the harbour itself. Regards, Andy.

When I were a lad, I was 'authoritatively' informed by an older trainspotter on the Library wall at Kirkcaldy station that it was 'impossible' to make an Austerity 2-8-0 ( universally known as 'clankers' in local parlance) slip. Oh no it wasn't! WD 90534 loses her feet spectacularly crossing from the up main to the down main at Dysart, having just reversed out of the 'Dubbie' sidings. I wish I had had a tape recorder. It would have sounded like an earthquake in a scrapyard. PS. Pete Westwater took quite a few audio recordings around Kirkcaldy back in the sixties.

Hi Graham, I don't remember the Randolph sidings as such, but I can recall seeing the sharply curving embankment and the access road bridge to the pit. As far as I recall, the bridge was a plate girder type, rather than a masonry arch, and it had a pretty low headroom clearance for road traffic. I remember seeing wagons sitting on the embankment, but no locos. This would be about 1961, as I was learning to drive at the time, and a friend regularly took me along the Standing Stane Road to Kennoway for driving practice. On leaving Boreland there was a short straight, then a sharp right hand turn in the road, and the entrance to the pit was to the left at about this point. The wagons parked on the loop were quite visible from a fair distance back, but didn't seem to move much - wagon storage perhaps? Later, there was substantial open cast coal working between Randolph and Thornton, which later still was extensively re-landscaped, so there is almost no trace of railway or pit infrastructure left hereabout. I remember reading (John Thomas, perhaps?) that the Randolph workings were so shallow that the miners could apparently set their watches by the passage of the Aberdeen trains on the main line. Andy.

There is a letter in the October issue of 'Railway Bylines' magazine concerning the problem the introduction of the spring points caused at the harbour branch junction, following the switching out of the box under the 1967 proposals. This refers back to the excellent article on the branch in the August issue of the same magazine.

The double stop was quite frequently used in the up platform. Aberdeen /Edinburgh trains, especially with KX portions, often loaded to 10 or 11 carriages, and sometimes to 13. As I recall, the loco - usually an A1 or A2 - would draw up at the up starter, ie short of the full platform end, leaving a substantial 'tail' projecting beyond the other end of the platform. After the regulation period the guard, standing at the north end of the platform would give a couple of sharp blasts on his whistle, and this wouild be relayed to the engine crew by a senior member of the station staff standing towards the head of the train. The loco would then ease forward until the tail of the train was just in the platform, when the guard would again blow his whistle, and the the other staff member would signal the loco crew to stop. Unfortunately, I cannot remember whether the whistle signals were accompanied by the display of the appropriate flags, although I think the guard probably waved his - green then red - to confirm. This manoeuvre generally left the loco positioned on or sometimes beyond the bridge over Abbotshall Road, and frequently lead to panic amonst the uninitiated, who thought the train was off without them. I believe the practice was stopped in diesel days, as it occupied too much station time. Interestingly, this summer I made a trip from Dundee to Kirkcaldy, the train being an HST (Ah, comfortable, quiet, punctual, fast, if a little tired looking, but still British engineering at its best). Shortly before arrival, the conductor announced that the train might be too long for the platform, and would passengers in the rear coach make their way forward. The train stopped with the last coach and power car beyond the platform end, but there seemed to be plenty of room at the head of the platform, so i am not aware of the reason for this move.

This topic is really developing! Thanks to Graham and Keefer for kicking it off. I don't have many pix, despite the endless hours spent watching trains at Kirkcaldy and Dysart, but here are a couple of the 'spotter's paradise'. A2 60530 sitting 'on top of the wall' at the exit from the up goods yard. This was a favourite location for seeing the trains, as the low wall behind the Art Gallery formed a mini grandstand, from which the up starter could be seen above the station buildings and canopy, while the down home was directly opposite at the platform end. Also, it was quite common for loco crews waiting for the road at the yard exit disc to converse with the spotty youths below with their Ian Allan ABC's. I learned from the fireman of J69 no. 68504 on pilot duty that his was a 'furrin injin', and recall long conversations with the crew of J38 65904, and with the driver of a V2 about the Gresley 3cylinder locos. Incidentally, the pic shows the same train as was featured passing Den Road in a previous post, so my trusty armour plated Raleigh with Sturmey Archer gears must have flown along Victoria Road to capture this second pic. These show J37 64549 at Dysart from the spotter's bridge just north of the station. (shadow in foreground). The loco is marshalling a lengthy rake of empties for the 'Dubbie shunt' - note the brake van on the branch and the signal protecting the level crossing. The rake was then propelled down the branch round a sharp curve and over the 'A' class public road, with absolutely no visibility of same from the loco. Risk assessments, Elf 'n' Safety anyone? Re the 'Clans'. Either 64A or 64B had a couple for a while, and I can recall Clan Macgregor through Kirkcaldy. I also recall seeing 9F 92073 or 92173 (it was dark) passing through at the head of a very long train of 16t minerals full of sugar beet for Cupar, just before Christmas 1962 or 3. My only 9F in Fife.

Thanks for that explanation Graham. That clears things up nicely. Anyway, I suppose that due to its position and construction, it would not have been convenient to bracket a bay starter from the main platform starter, especially if the bay was not intensively used before the advent of the dmus.

Hi Ian, Yes, thanks for that pic of Thornton. I have a colour slide of that somewhere. If I recall rightly, the B1 was 61172, and we went down to Elie and back for a 'Last Run'. Back to the bay platform at Kirkcaldy,- as its use by dmu's seems to be quite a bit more frequent than I remember, I am therefore surprised that the exit should be controlled by a ground disc, especially from a local ground frame and not directly under the control of the signalman. I was always under the impression that a passenger bay, as distinct from a goods/parcels dock, had to be controlled by a 'real' signal, especially as in this case, when it exited directly onto a high speed line. The up advance starter, as has already been noted, would not be visible from the cab of a dmu in the bay. Or am I just havering again? Regards to all, Andy. Sitting on the dock of the bay - or vice versa.

Hi Ian, Yes, the Sunday trains were normally V1/V3 hauled, and terminated at Kirkcaldy. The loco uncoupled and ran forward to the crossover beyond the signal box cabin, then crossed to the up road and ran through the platform to the crossover at the up end, where it would whistle for the road to be reset. It would then collect the train, usually 6 or 8 non-corridors, propell back through the down side,and cross back into the up platform. I don't remember the loco drawing the train through the up end crossover and propelling back into the platform that way, but it could have. I used to attend Abbotshall church at this time, and one of these manoeuvres was carried out shortly after 12 noon with aforesaid whistling and often much blowing off of excess steam, usually in the middle of the minister's sermon. The beautiful stained glass windows prevented me from seeing the shunt moves in question, but the sound carried into the kirk quite clearly. These Gresley tanks had quite a bark. I'm not sure if the Standard 2-6-4 tanks ever performed these duties after the V1/3's were withdrawn. I can only remember the Gloucester railcars after that. Incidentally, I can't tell my up from my down. I should have said in my post of the A2 at Den Road, that it also clearly showed the siding on the down side. This ran from an industrial building of some kind behind my position all the way towards Sinclairtown down goods yard. There was a road crossing roughly where I was standing, and I think there were spurs into Nairn's works. Certainly their power station was still coal fired in those days.

RE the various rebuildings of Kirkcaldy, attached is an extremely duff scan of a photo taken on 16 June 1964, from the 'Flying Scotsman' railtour, Edinburgh to Aberdeen & back. Although you can't make her out, 4472 is definitely at the head of the train, and we are thundering through at a good 60-ish or so. The 'old' up station is in the process of being demolished to make way for the glass box version, which subsequently burned down and was replaced by the present building. The big fellow with the glasses (if you can make him out) was the senior ticket inspector, who normally inhabited a wee wooden box on the exit from the down platform. I thought I could remember the up bay being used by (green) Metro Cammell units on an occasional basis, and I'm pleased to see that the recent pix confirm that. This is developing into a most interesting topic, and great to see the amount of info that is being unearthed.

It has often surprised me somewhat that a rail centre the size and importance of Kirkcaldy was so poorly served by railway photographers. Not even WJVA paid much attention to the town, but I must plead guilty to the same shortcoming. Here, as promised are a couple of my efforts. A2 60530 Sayajirao passes Den Road with an express 'perishables', which will pick up half a dozen wagons of meat carcasses for London markets at Kirkcaldy up goods sidings. The long up siding referred to in a previous post can clearly be seen, as can the various linoleum factories of Michael Nairn (Nairnzez to the locals) on either side of the line. The present Muir's scrapyard is roughly behind me in this shot. No 9 sets off from the old E&N up goods shed to head the official Sc Region return to steam, 4 may '72. The grey timber building was the up transit shed, much used by linoleum traffic, before becoming the NCL depot 4498 heads the 'Tyne-Dee' special past the site of Invertiel Junction in June '74. The gate in the foreground is across the former trackbed of the Kirkcaldy District railway, Invertiel, Auchtertool, to Cowdenbeath. seafield colliery is in the background.

The siding in question across Bennochy Road lead to Hogarth's flour mill, and while I never saw a shunt across the road, I can recall frequently seeing strings of vans in the mill, and the occasional 20T grain van. Interesting that Gerald Robinson's photo shows Hornby's "Sir Harold Mitchell", so all you modellers have no excuse now for ducking a Kirkcaldy themed layout. Have looked out my old photos, but frankly there's not many and they are pretty poor. Most of my memories are in my head, although I have difficulty now in recalling what I did last week - see related posts on 'The Last Gresleys' and 'Kirkcaldy harbour branch'. I guess Pete Westwater might be the best source for photos of the area, if you can persuade him to post. Thanks very much Graham for starting this topic, and hope you get some lively discussion.