ScottW

25 minutes ago, Guy Rixon said:

For buffers, I am willing to scale up any of the 4mm-scale buffers in my Shapeways shop to 1:64 and have already done so for two items. They can then be used with rams and springs intended for 4mm scale. Buffer heads that scale to 15" or 16" in 4mm scale are close to 12" and 13" in S.

Thats great, Guy. Thank you kindly.

Items like these are invaluable to scratchbuilders, particularly in S Scale. Due to the various prototypes modelled by S Scale society members, the society parts department also tends to concentrate on basic key components rather than complete kits. Obviously not every prototype can be covered so outside sources, like yourself, are always welcome.

Having covered tools I’ll now list the materials required to build a typical wooden-bodied wagon.

The main body of my wagons is made from Plasticard sheet, the rest of the woodwork is produced using Evergreen styrene strips. Evergreen styrene strips comes in a multitude of convenient sizes which saves you cutting endless stripes from larger sheet material. Over the years I have gathered a good number of different sizes, this always comes in handy when building something a little less standard. The one departure from using Evergreen styrene stripes comes when producing the iron work. I use 5thou thick styrene strips for my iron work. Unfortunately, Evergreen don’t produce 5thou stripes so these must be cut from sheet material which, fortunately, Evergreen does produce. So that I get consistency when cutting the 5thou stripes I make use of a simple cutting jig which I will explain later. Remembering that my wagons are S Scale, a typical wagon consists of:

1. Sides, ends & floor, nominally 2-1/2”, scale 40thou Plasticard sheet.

2. Solebars & headstock, nominally 4-1/2 x 12”, scale 80thou x 188thou. 80thou is a little thick for S Scale. The scale size is closer to 70thou but Evergreen doesn’t do stripes this size, the choice is either 60thou or 80thou. Personally, I feel 60thou looks too thin. Also, for reasons that will become apparent later, the solebars on my wagons are produced using two layers of 40thou thick styrene strips.

3. Iron work, nominally 2-1/2” wide, scale 5thou x 40thou styrene stripes. As previously mentioned, these are cut from Evergreen 5thou styrene sheet.

4. Hinges, 40thou styrene rod.

5. Bolt heads, 20thou styrene rod. These are represented by slicing slithers off the end of the rod. I have found that Plastruct styrene rod is best for producing bolt heads this way as it is more pliable than other makes. Slaters 20thou rod, for instance, is quite brittle and has a tendency to fracture when sliced. Alternatively, square bolt heads can be produced from 10thou x 20thou styrene strips suitably cut to size.

The running gear is predominantly made up of components purchased from the S Scale Society; wheels, w irons, breakgear, axleboxes and springs. Other items like buffers and drawbar hooks can also be purchased from the society. With items like buffers and axleboxes, it might be possible to use 4mm components. In the past I have found that some 4mm scale whitemetal components to be a little over scale and looked okay when fitted to an S Scale wagon.

If any one has little pearls of wisdom, use different techniques or procedures then feel free to share them. After all, there is more than one way to skin a cat and just because these techniques work for me they may not necessarily work for others.

This picture shows the small collection of tools and materials that I predominantly use when building a wagon.  The tools, I’m sure, are all pretty much self-explanatory but I will go through them anyway. Starting from the left:

1. 12” steel rule, mainly used as a straight edge when cutting Plasticard.

2. 6” steel rule, used for marking out. It is handy to have one with both imperial and metric divisions, especially as S Scale is an imperial scale. Most imperial rules have divisions as small as 1/64”, in S scale this equates to 1”. One of the bonuses of the scale is you can model within half an inch reasonably accurately.

3.  A large file, for cleaning up edges and ensuring they are true. Not too rough, I can't remember but I think this one may have been a second cut.

4. Needle files.

5. Engineers square. I have a number of these in various sizes but I suppose a single 6” engineers square would cover you for most jobs.

Moving upwards.

6. Paint brush, for applying liquid solvent.  My preference is to use a relatively small brush (007) with a fine point, that way I can either load it up to glue the main components together or sparingly when adding the iron work.

7. Sharp pencil.

8. Swann-Morton #3 scalpel and #11 blade. The choice of knife is entirely your own, I fined the #11 Swann-Morton blade to be really sharp and great for cutting Plasticard. Once the blade starts to go off I just throw it away and replace it with a new one.

9. Olfa P Cutter, used for scribing planks.

10. Pin vice and a selection of drills.

11. Liquid cement. I use two types of liquid cement when building wagons; MEK for gluing the main components together and DL-Limonene for the iron work and bolt heads. DL-Limonene is less aggressive than MEK so there is less chance of melting the very thin (5 thou) Plasticard strips used for the iron work. It also takes a little longer to go off which allows you more time to place components before they set solid.

Two items which I forgot to include in the picture are:

12. 600 grit Wet & Dry, for cleaning up the surface of the Plasticard.

13. 2 part epoxy, to glue any metal components e.g. buffers and drawbar hooks.

One other item of equipment which I believe to be essential is a magnifying head band, or some other sort of magnifying device. I wear mine every time I’m at the bench regardless of what I am doing. If you don’t already own one I would recommend getting yourself one, despite your age or how good your eye’s are. I have been using one for years. The headband allows you to get up really close and see exactly what you are doing, which is imperative when modelling in the smaller scales.  My philosophy is “if it looks good under a magnifier then it will look great with the naked eye”.

I bought this one from Maplin a good few years ago but you can buy variations from other sources. It comes with a small light on top which I find to be pretty useless, especially as I also use an angle poise desk lamp. 

Made a little more headway on the NBR 3 plank wagons. The end supports, iron work and bolt heads have all been added, only the buffers to install and that will be the bodies finished.

I have a copy of Midland Railway Wagons by Bob Essery but unfortunately I’m not at home at the moment. However, a quick Google search produced this:

Not much happening on the workbench of late. Some W irons and wheels arrived last week from the Society store, these have subsequently been soldered up and destined for the four NBR 3 plank wagons.

It’s better for soldering as the heat stays more localised but, in my view, if you have brass available then it’s no big deal using it.

1 hour ago, Lacathedrale said:

Many thanks Jim - Richard actually provided me with the test shot of the Terrier etch and some castings, so I'm in good stead. I've got a photocopy of the chassis etch, but no actual brass - so I'm going to be building that myself. Is there a rule of thumb as to material thickness? My gut feeling would be to go with 40 thou, but I wonder if there might be an advantage to go thicker.

If you are short of any castings let me know as I may have some spare.

With regards chassis thickness, I use 18thou N/S. I don’t see the need to go any thicker. To ensure both frames are identical you normally sweat two pieces of metal together, if you were to use 40thou that would mean cutting through metal 2mm thick. 

As well as the books written by Guy Williams I would also recommend getting your hands on the two books written by Geoff Holt. Despite describing the construction of 7mm locos his techniques are transferable to any scale.

Alan Gibson did produce a kit for a LSWR 02 which, I believe,  can be converted into a G6.

I contacted Colin Seymour a number of years ago regarding the S Scale 4F kit. At that time he said that he had no intentions of re-releasing any of the S Scale kits but might, in the future, be open to the possibility of producing just the etches should there be any interest.

In my view an LBSCR E1 would be a fine choice. Are you intending on modelling the LBSCR or just something Southern region? In the past kits have been made available for both LBSCR and LSWR prototypes eg LBSCR Terrier & LSWR 02. Unfortunately they are no longer available but someone might have one that they're wiling to part with. A kit might possibly provide you with an easier way to obtaining your first S Scale locomotive along with the opportunity to hone your skills. 

With regards to hornblocks, I can do no more then recommend those produced by High Level:

http://www.highlevelkits.co.uk/hornblockpage.html

These consist of a very simple fold-up etch that requires minimal fettling.

The amount of upward movement of a hornblock really depends on how good, or bad, you track building skills are. The train of thought is that you should not require any more than 1/2mm of movement up and down. If it is any more than that then you should really be looking at the track. If the clearance between the top of the wheel and the underside of the splasher is tight then you can always put a piece of insulation tape on the underside of the splasher to prevent it shorting.

2 hours ago, steverabone said:

Superb work Scott. Put's my crude cardboard wagons to shame. I've learnt one or two useful tricks from this thread so may incorporate them in my next batch of wagons.

Not at all Steve. It's a diverse hobby and what works for one person might  not work for another. I'm pleased that you, and others, are getting something out of my posts. That's the beauty of these forums.  

The Caledonian Railway 5 plank mineral wagon complete, ready for the Paintshop.

1 hour ago, Lacathedrale said:

Scott, are you slicing those bolt heads off with a scalpel or a guillotine of some kind?

I use #11 Swann Morton blade to slice them off. There’s no special technique, I just slice a load off then choose the ones I like the look of.  You do have a bit of wastage but its negligible really. I don’t get too bent out of shape that they’re not perfect, once you get some paint on them you can’t tell. I suppose a guillotine would work equally as well but I haven't tried one.

You could insert the plastic rod into a piece of 20thou internal diameter brass tube till the plastic rod just protrudes from the end by approx 10thou. Then slice off a piece of plastic rod by using the end of the brass rod as a cutting guide.

Over the last few weeks I have managed to finish adding all the external bolt heads to the four 3 plank wagon bodies reported on in an earlier post.  The internal ironwork was also fitted and the only thing left to do on the bodies is to add the end supports. Once this has been completed I'll post a picture.

I have also completed the Private Trader wagon. It still requires painting which I hope to get around to in the spring when the temperature out in the shed is a little warmer and I can get the door open. All that was required to finish the wagon was to add the brake lever and ratchet. I struggled a bit with bending the brake lever to the required shape, having two attempts before I was reasonably happy. As I cocked-up the original brake lever supplied with the brake gear etch I had to use a replacement from an Ambis etch.

I apologise for the quality of the photograph, the weather isn't great at the moment and it is a little dark.

1 hour ago, Lacathedrale said:

there's a slight waddle which I've not encountered before.

If you are using the Gibson WW1 wheel then don’t be surprised to find that the waddle is due to an eccentric set of wheels. I have found this to be a common problem with Gibson wheels. Slaters wheels are far superior.

47 minutes ago, Lacathedrale said:

Thanks @ScottW - my immediate thought is to just shorten the push rod on that side so the shoe clears the wheel when the unit pivots. I'll hold fire until later.

Is the brake shoe fouling the wheel only on the rocking side or on both?

28 minutes ago, Lacathedrale said:

I'm building the association RCH wagon kit and having great fun - one small thing I'm not clear on though, is how to set up the brakes - they are located centrally via the brake rigging and are a very close fit against the wheels:

Seeing as the front axle rocks some 10 degrees or so, clearly the brake shoes are going to foul against the wheels. Am I missing something obvious?

 

Jim (@flubrush) can confirm this but I think the problem might be the wheels. The society sells wheels from two different manufacturers; Alan Gibson (aka Colin Seymour) and Slaters. The wheels sold by Colin Seymour are slightly under size with the flange profile larger than the standard S Scale wheel profile. Up until recently the only S Scale wagon wheel available were those produced by Colin Seymour and I believe the etch for the 1907 RCH wagon was based around these wheels. If you are using Slaters wheels, which are the correct size and profile, then this might why you are experiencing problems.

Can anyone tell me what the difference is between Butanone and MEK? I have a bottle of both, the label on the bottle of Batanone says it contains MEK.

Coincidentally, I just bought a 5l bottle of MEK off eBay last month for £24. Not only is it better value for money but I also got free courier delivery; many modelling suppliers of the smaller bottles don’t do delivery due to postal restrictions.

6 hours ago, Lacathedrale said:

 

I'm going to try to build this to Hall & Co (see below) which had a hinged top plank on the door:

 

 

Looking at the proportions of the planks on the Hall & Co wagon it would appear that the top two planks are wider than those planks below them. The planks on the model all look to be the same width, this might cause you problems when trying to fit the hinges and ironwork to the upper plank.

Unless Hall & Co also had wagons with end doors the wagon photographed was constructed with two fixed ends.

Of course, you might already be aware of this and I might be teaching you how to suck the proverbial egg. If so, I do apologies.  

3 hours ago, Lacathedrale said:

EDIT: May the subject 'What's on your S-scale workbench?' would make it clear this is a community thread (in line with the 2mm and 3mm equivalents) if that is the goal?

Point taken and subject heading changed as suggested.

Keep the posts coming, we can all learn and gain encouragement from each others progress. 

23 hours ago, Lacathedrale said:

May I ask how you made/scribed the planks on your wagons? It seems you're using 40thou for the sides/backs and floor, 80thou for the headstocks and 2*40thou for the solebars, with 5 thou strip for ironwork and 20thou rod for rivets - is that correct?  Are the solebar ironworks (not just the v-hangers) produced somewhere? I'd like to give it a bash myself at some point and this looks so clean and well done I feel like I could learn loads from just studying the pictures...

The planks were scribed using an Olfa P-Cutter.

I bought mine many years ago from Squires, they are still available at a reasonable price. Simply scribe between two points using a rule as a guide. Despite its claims it does produce a very small burr which can easily be removed by rubbing a piece of wet & dry over the surface. I use 600grit, using it wet as it prevents it from clogging up. When you scribe the floor planks the floor will naturally bend due to the number and closeness of the planks. To alleviate this problem simply scribe a number of lines on the underside of the floor.

The sizes  you quoted are indeed what I use but don't forget that this is S Scale. I have never built a 7mm wagon but for 4mm scale I would suggest using:

30thou - sides, ends & floor.

60thou - headstocks.

2x 30thou - solebars.

5thou - ironwork.

15thou cubes - bolt heads.

With regards to the ironwork on the solebars, etches can be purchased from the S Scale Society. MJT did produce an S Scale version of their rocking W irons, the etch also contained extra detail for the solebar/headstock ironwork. If you are modelling in 4mm scale I believe etches are available, I know Mainly Trains use to produce an etch for all the headstock/solebar detail but since their demise I don't know what happened to it.

As stated in my last post, work commitments have been getting in the way of any progress. The only modelling I can be guilty of lately is of the check book variety. A few weeks a go this little beauty arrived on my doorstep. It was built for me by a friend and fellow member of the S Scale Society.

Laid down by the Edinburgh & Glasgow Railway in 1866, but subsequently completed by the North British Railway, the prototype survived well into the 1900's. The locomotive is believed to have been made out of reclaimed material and originally carried flat sided pannier tanks with a flat top that met above the boiler. Being rebuilt by Matthew Holmes in 1888 a new boiler was fitted topped with a saddle tank identical to those fitted to the Neilson pugs (LNER class Y9). The original weatherboard cab was also replaced with an overall cab similar to those fitted to the Drummond 4-4-0T's. With it's large 5' 0" driving wheels the locomotive worked passenger trains around the Glasgow area until it's withdrawal in 1907.

The drawing used in the models construction was provided by Euan Cameron who also very kindly gave permission for me to post a copy of his colour drawing of the locomotive.

On 09/10/2019 at 15:00, Rosedale said:

Lovely stuff Scott!

Thanks, Paul.

Unfortunately work is getting in the way of progress at the moment.