GWR_Modeller

Re 1950s. The use of tractors had become very wide spread by this time and so 'tram lines' in fields of arable crops was much more common than pre war. Tram lines occur when tractors and implements need repeated access to the field/crop. Initially for cultivation, then sowing, pesticide application and, less relevantly, for harvesting and use the same tracks in the season to avoid damaging the crops. The agro chemical industry has massively grown since the 1950s so tramlines were not universal in the 50s as they are today. Fields were much smaller. Headlands were there for horse teams and tractors to turn. Don't plant canola in 1950. Paul

https://player.bfi.org.uk/free/film/watch-along-the-line-1947-online I found this in BFI. Part of free.

I have also found a book called the big four in colour and it happens to have four or five colour shots of loco crew posing in their cabs or near engines, all except one wearing pale clothing so in general definately not dark blue. I feel alot better about my painting of figures in paler blues or blue greys but I will avoid using the brighter blue clothing colours that I have seen some modern crews wearing on preservation railways.

Actually I think it might mean almost exactly that after allowing for seventy years of fashion evolution. The definition of jeans is a strong hard wearing blue denim or cotton fabric so good for work clothes. Denim and cotton fades easily. So the various shades of clothing in photos from darker shades to paler makes alot of sense.

Gwr.org, GWW both refer to station staff and say dark blue which I interpreted as like navy blue officers or dress uniforms ie almost black. They are almost silent on other workers. Steamport may be right about labourers (on construction projects) and clerical staff (esp head offices) but that leaves the subject of goods shed workers (imho definately a uniform) and coaling stage workers and lineside gangs. I believe these were employees not casual workers or perhaps a combination? Paul

Hi. I have looked on this site for previous threads on a similar topic and also consulted GWW and the Company Servants books. Station staff certainly wore a well made dark blue uniform and the consensus seems to be that loco crew wore dark blue as well. In some photos loco crew appear to be wearing coveralls or dungarees instead of the trousers and jacket style of working clothes and they seem a bit lighter in colour, were these the same colour? In b/w photos of goods staff, both checkers and porters, almost all the outer clothes are a similar dark colour I presume this is dark blue, with a pale shirt. The goods porters are often in shirt sleeves and wear an apron or have a light coat. I these were guess tan brown. Is this correct? What about coaling stage workers and line side crew? I dont see alot of coveralls in photos and there seems to be some variation in the shade of grey in the photos for jackets and trousers. Were they all wearing dark blue or something else? As an aside from the main question I was amazed in the company servants book to see that the biggest concession made by labourers was to remove their jacket and role up their sleeves. They all still wear caps and often waist coats. Regards Paul

Dear Miss Prism, Thankyou. I did not know what hammered glass was but from your photos all is now clear! Interestingly the flickr image shows one toplight pane (next to last) which has the horizontal pattern I mentioned in my original post. I can reproduce the hammered effect in model form by getting glue all over the transparent plastic when I attach it. That will be easy. I thought the toplights could be opened for ventilation but the internal photos don't show any mechanism so I now suppose they were fixed and ventilation came from the door vents and droplights only plus roof vent? Later compartment designs without doors got adjustable ventilation from beclawat windows and later sliding vents. References to corridor droplights also make more sense than before. Thankyou again.

I model late 1930s GWR in N gauge. So far I have rtr Dapol coaches and some bow ended stock from Dapol b set donors with tpm sides. I am now creating some toplight coaches by modifying old gf suburban stock. Its a bigger job than I thought when I started. However the point of this post is to ask about the appearance of the toplight vents themselves which I am adding by drilling, filing and glazing etc. HARRIS describes the toplights of Toplight coaches as being of "hammered glass". In an interior photo of a Dreadnought the toplight is clearly clear not translucent but Harris seems to imply a change for the toplight coaches. Looking at other photos in Harris the external appearance of the toplights is a lighter colour than the windows which often appear almost black. Presumably the toplights are translucent not transparent? Would this be frosted glass ie white or perhaps coated ie silver/grey? In one close up photo in Russell there almost appears to a horizontal texture to the toplight vent. Any information would be appreciated. Regards, Paul

Hi, If anybody has a copy they wish to sell please let me know. Thanks, Paul Edited: Thanks everyone I found a copy. Paul

After reading an earlier post I have looked for "John Lewis' definitive 'Great Western Auto Trailers' in 2 volumes". Unfortunately there only seems to be a couple of copies of vol 1 available from the secondhand dealers on the internet. Does anybody know of a seller with vol2? Regards, Paul

Dear Nick, Thats interesting. Thanks, Paul

Dear Steamport Southport, Those allocations OF auto fitted locos are a very useful insight. Returning to my question. How were the autocoaches used in that context. There have been some discussions on this forum about train formations and I struggle to recollect any post which said anything like Brake third, compo,compo, brake third and auto trailer? In any context let alone for suburban work. Was there another reason for a suburban allocation of those engines. The 6400s had small wheels like some of the prairies for better acceleration? Didnt the control gear for auto trains require the intermediate carriages to be modifed as well as an autocoach for the driver at the other end. Regards, Paul

Can anybody provide advice or a source of information on GWR Autocoach 1930 operations at provincial mainline stations? I have read in the gwrj and some books about passenger train operations at Banbury and Oxford but they dont make much mention of auto coaches. The layout I am researching towards will have to be based on something much much smaller albeit with min four tracks and bays or loops so I can run local and branch trains into the station and have expresses connecting or passing through and also occassionaly shunt a brake onto/off the rear of a train. Were auto trains common? In Harris the stock lots seem to indicate about 100 in sevice, that does not seem alot compared to other coach types. How frequent would a service be? In an OPC reprint of the 1932 Gwr timetable they dont seem to be identied as such. What did a 'typical' auto train look like? I know of the 48XX+autocoach combination but have also seen a pic (not sure where) of a 060PT sandwiched between four coaches presumably an auto coach either end? Was this common? Were auto coaches used only for branch services or did they form local trains on the mainline as well? Would a set/Loco dedicated to one branch? Regards, Paul

Hi ndg910, I have a similar issue regarding fixed access ladders in particular to water towers. I have consulted the GWW and the HMRS structure colours book, Vaughns Architecture and others and looked at various photos and the GW Modelling website. Most sources describe the ladders as dark stone but some say black and some of those descrbe how in later years the bottom six foot was painted white. In some b and w photos of the 1930s it is unclear but in others comparing the tone of the ladder to other features definately appears to show some black and some lighter presumably dark stone. I have concluded there was not a strictly implemented rule and practice varied from location to location. I have used both colours on different models and prefer the look of the dark stone for aesthetic reasons. In one bw photo of an engine shed in a book the hand rails of the roof boards appear very light possibly white but there is nothing else to compare with in the same position so could just be the exposure and in most other photos the rails are back lit. Thats all I have to offer,sorry if it is of no help. Regards, Paul

Hi ndg910, I have a similar issue regarding fixed access ladders in particular to water towers. I have consulted the GWW and the HMRS structure colours book, Vaughns Architecture and others and looked at various photos and the GW Modelling website. Most sources describe the ladders as dark stone but some say black and some of those descrbe how in later years the bottom six foot was painted white. In some b and w photos of the 1930s it is unclear but in others comparing the tone of the ladder to other features definately appears to show some black and some lighter presumably dark stone. I have concluded there was not a strictly implemented rule and practice varied from location to location. I have used both colours on different models and prefer the look of the dark stone for aesthetic reasons. In one bw photo of an engine shed in a book the hand rails of the roof boards appear very light possibly white but there is nothing else to compare with in the same position so could just be the exposure and in most other photos the rails are back lit. Thats all I have to offer,sorry if it is of no help. Regards, Paul

Dear Karhedron, On a slightly different tack. The picture with the pagoda in it has three different shades of stone or brown. The fence and the trolley are an intermediate tone to the light and dark stone of the pagoda. What colour do you think that is? I thought the trolley would be dark brown. Regards, Tom

I thought that might be the case. Any idea which bits were which colours. The usual principle of raised detail in dark stone seems difficult to apply. From a b/w photo of Slough the interior columns don't seem to be white as they would be in a brick and timber framed shed. Might they be dark stone? The only other details are steel framed windows in the half clad rear, the canopy valance over the open cart platform and a set of steps. Tom

Does anyone know what colour GWR painted the corrugated iron clad steel framed goods shed it built as extensions to brick sheds in late 1920s and 1930s? I am thinking of the modest deveopments at Slough, Paignton and Reading and not the massive one at Paddington. The photographs I have seen are black and white and show the cladding is a light colour. There does not appear to be any contrasting colour. It could be bare metal. There is no sign of any glint or glare off the metal in the photos so I presume they were painted. Regards, Tom