ChrisG

Stop Press - I have been corresponding with Allen Doherty of Worsley Works who is interested in preparing etches for the SECR coaches. I am pursuing this avenue with a view to ordering a few. It depends on the success of recreating the rivetting effect on the sheeted sections. He is a 3mm scale specialist but does supply his etches in other scales. I am most of the way through building his Brighton Saloon coach, and have found it goes together very well and makes a lovely model. No connection other than as a satisfied customer. Chris

Now that Kernow Models’ O2s have unlocked for many people the possibility of building an Isle of Wight-based OO layout, I thought it would be timely to consider the various sources of models of Island coaches. I will be talking only about the BR period, which is what I model, for which one needs ex-LBSCR and ex-SECR coaches. Suitable brass kits are available from Roxey Mouldings, Worsley Works and (on extended order period) Mousa Models (Bill Bedford). Leaving these asie, except to say that if you have or are keen to acquire the skill to build a brass kit, these are very satisfactory models and I have built a number of them myself (usual disclaimer applies). The cupboard is pretty bare as far as the SECR coaches are involved. The best donors are the old Graham Farish suburban coaches, which can be turned into reasonable replicas of sheeted Island coaches, with the biggest issue being changing the roof profile from arc to semi-elliptical. My own attempts at this are still work in progress, so I will pass by these as well (for now at least). The Brighton carriages are easier as Ratio Midland suburban coach kits are a very suitable basis. As we know from earlier in the thread, Paul Mays even claims to have fooled people with these by building them as per the instructions, save for painting them in Southern olive green. I prefer to take the conversion a bit further by lengthening them, dealing with the bow-ended body profile, fashioning new underframes, and fitting the SR bogies which carried them during their lifetime on the Island. Please note that I am not attempting to create highly detailed scale replicas, but coaches that at normal viewing distance look like the real thing (the “Tony Wright” school of layout modelling, no less). First up is a Ratio 3rd class compartment coach, which has been built largely as per the instructions and painted green, fitted with SR bogies, and with various components of the underframe removed. Like Paul’s, these seem to fool most people, and their shortness (48’ vs 54’) does not seem to matter at all. Second is an LBSCR 6 compartment brake under construction which has involved the following alterations:- Cutting and shutting of two bodies to make a 54’ (21cm) length body; Reversal of the ends, filing them flat and adding panelling and steps from strip- styrene; Cutting of windows at the guard’s end of the coach; Lengthening of the roof and removal of original rainstrips to be replaced by plasticard strip; Lengthening of the chassis (cut and shut again); Underframe trussing fettled from brass wire and split pins; SR battery boxes from Comet Models (now Wizard Models); Bogies are Bachmann 8’ SR steam bogies which are lovely smooth runners. Another approach involves using the OLD Tri-ang clerestory coaches. This was advocated by Terry Gough in the Model Railway Constructor in the 1960s and more recently (within the last year or two) in the Railway Modeller. I have never attempted a conversion based on these models, however. And I am currently expecting that the more effort I put into building these conversions, the more likely it is that one of the R-T-R manufacturers will announce some Island coaches in their range! Chris Gardner Alton Hants

(Go straight to the bottom of this post for a video) Finally I have completed the major tasks I set myself back in October/November. These were the re-alignment of the hidden section (not a major issue in tracklaying terms but the rewiring was a different matter), and the complete rebuilding of Newport, to be controlled by a Modratec interlocked lever frame. I took the opportunity to add LED displays to the panel controlling the hidden sidings, and whilst these tracks are not yet "hidden" I am extremely glad I now have a visual display showing how the routes are set. I used an extremely simple method, facilitated by DCC, and following instructions from Brian Lambert's excellent wiring pages on the internet, whereby the LEDs are powered by the DCC traction current via the switches which control the polarity of the crossings (frogs) of the turnouts concerned. At Newport the layout is now much more to my satisfaction. I have a length of straight platform (the idea of building curved canopies had been giving me the heebie-jeebies). I have tested the whole layout exhaustively until it is derailment-free. The one change I have to make to the rolling stock is to remove the Sprat and Winkle hoops and replace them with a wire soldered or glued across the front of the buffers. This ensures there is enough width for the coupling hooks to swing on the tightest curves (c22" radius). I have also been experimenting with Kadees for the fixed coaching rakes and found that pairing medium and long versions gives a decent coupling distance and excellent operation - faultless at high speed running forwards and backwards. Attached to the bogies, which wouldn't have been my first choice had I not had such tight curves. The interesting thing about Newport is that whilst counter-intuitively it is sited on the width rather than the length of the layout, and is therefore confined to 9'6", it doesn't look cramped and really does conjure up the atmosphere of the real Newport. Turnouts are now controlled by a mixture of Cobalts and Fulgurexes, Sprat and Winkle electro and permanent magnets fitted in strategic locations, and the whole thing is running faultlessly. The Kernow O2s have been a partial success. Operation is pretty faultless, but haulage capacity is disappointing. There has been a lively thread elsewhere on RMWeb about these aspects, and I shall be reporting back on experiments in adding lead, having finally (!) it seems, unlocked the secret of getting inside the locos. In the testing phase I finally gave up on ZTC. My local model shop very kindly lent me their Gaugemaster set for the weekend, which finally demonstrated that the problems I had been experiencing had definitely been down to ZTC. I have now made the switch, but I really miss the ergonomics of the ZTC controllers. I've uploaded a video to Youtube. Here's the link:- What's next? I'm building some passenger rolling stock and intending to fit my kitbuilt O2s for DCC. At some stage I will start on the Medina Wharf trackwork. There's never a moment of boredom! Chris

The 0-4-4 wheel arrangement is notoriously difficult and I reckon Kernow have done a good job. It would have been better had the body been metal, of course. My kitbuilt O2s (whitemetal) will haul 6 of my heavy coaches pretty comfortably so it can be done. Your comment about RTR locos being "not fit for purpose" does chime with my thoughts to some extent. I have only started using RTR locos recently, and the first two Bachmann ones I bought had feeble pickups and needed a hand built set added before they would run reliably. The Kernow ones I reckon are a good step up from that - I've had no pick up problems, no derailments (another potential problem with 0-4-4Ts), and they run smoothly and quietly. I am prepared to persevere to see if I can improve the haulage. Generally speaking, I think modern models have an eye more to the display case than the hurly burly of running on a busy home or exhibition layout. Detail on Bachmanns is also very fragile and I am treating my Kernows as if they were made of eggshell. Again - kitbuilt locos are well-detailed and resilient when built (one can't beat brass soldered to brass!). Chris

I have to admit I do not have a clue as to the difference between a coreless motor and a "conventional" motor, but for once in my life I did follow the instructions that came with the loco, and ran it in as instructed. This greatly improved the performance over time, and for many hours after running in the performance kept improving. The two (of the four I have) that I have run so far do indeed have different running characteristics, so maybe achieving the optimum running-in regime is crucial to getting consistent performance. Not that it troubles me greatly because the Island O2s in real life were known to have different characteristics. And of course, by playing with CV settings they can be changed to a certain extent. The thing that concerns me most from the latest posts in this thread is that our knowledge of coreless motors and how to treat them is not uniformly good and the complete surprise today was to find out that running in is an important component in the ongoing performance of the MOTOR. Am I the only one who thought that running in was for the bearings, gear meshing, and suchlike? Somehow, I think in the circumstances the instructions with this loco would have benefitted from being more explicit, especially in reference to the motors. I shall follow up on Ian Hargrave's weighty investigation with my own - it's encouraging that 100g may be possible in the boiler, although I guess in the light of other things we are now hearing about the motors, that there may be unexpected consequences from the additional weight. Chris

I believe it is to do with the way the trailing bogie is mounted. It has less sideplay than one would generally expect. In fact it is very much like a coach bogie, although pivotted off centre, towards the front of the loco. To be able to negotiate 2nd radius curves the drivers then need more lateral slop. Rest assured I don't believe you will be disappointed with the running, despite the slop offending the normal conventions - this appears to have been thought through thoroughly and the chassis rolls like a dream. Chris

That's so helpful. I'll have a go on Sunday, which will be my next opportunity. I am wondering if I should sacrifice some cab space for some lead. We shall see - experimentation required. My Wills/Southeastern Finecast O2s will pull 6 coaches quite happily - on the flat, at least. Chris

I can't believe that removing the cog would do anything but damage the smoothness of operation. On the other hand, leaving it in AND adding less sloppy con rods might have the desired effect. Me - I'm going to leave well in that department! Geared drivers is nothing but an improvement for operation. Chris

That's a most interesting and useful e-mail. I guess the models are perfectly balanced as they are, and unless the weight can be added uniformly along the whole length it is going to upset the balance. My kitbuilt O2s have all had their boilers stuffed with lead, with great success, but then I have built that into the equation when adjusting the ride height at the back to ensure optimum traction and perfect balance. The optimum place for the weight is of course probably somewhere between the drivers. It is of course disappointing to hear that the extra weight made no difference to tractive effort. Whilst I may be giving the impression of being a dog who won't leave the bone alone, I am interested in more detail as to how you separated the body from the footplate. Can you tell me whether the splashers/sandboxes are fixed to the boiler or the footplate. i.e. did they stay on the footplate when you removed the boiler, or not? Between Ventnor and Wroxall you need 6 coaches of course! As you say - such beautiful models in every other respect. Chris

Yup - tried it myself and it doesn't appear to be anything to do with getting the body off. I'm still stumped.................

Did it go back together OK? Chris

Readers of this thread may remember I kicked off a discussion about how one gets inside a Kernow O2. Of course I was questioned on why I would want to, but the reason is simply if I can put all the DCC gubbins in the bunker (I have no ambitions of fitting sound chips), I can put a slug of lead in the boiler and, I hope, improve the haulage characteristics which are not up to pulling the sort of trains I build (brass coach kits, whitemetal wagons, etc.). In this connection, the most interesting thing that has transpired has been that Kernow Models have told me there is a THIRD screw under the front coupling. I haven't had a look yet - I'm now out of the loft and don't intend going back up there tonight. This might solve the mystery of how to remove the body from the chassis (assuming they are right!). This third screw is NOT mentioned in the instructions! In answer to my more general questions about servicing (which were particularly relevant in a situation where the body cannot be removed) Kernow have confirmed that items returned for repair will be examined in the shop. If they can't fix them, they go to DJM who hold the supply of spare parts. Chris

A friend of mine built an Adams radial tank and bingo! Someone has to do it.......................

I have bought and have started building some brass kits of Island coaches. That usually guarantees that RTR models will quickly follow.....! Chris

At the Alton Febex last weekend where Mark Pretious's 4mm scale model of Merstone had its first outing, we had a chat with Chris from Kernow, who seemed quite taken by the idea of producing an Island O2 in malachite green British Railways livery. We didn't exactly get the impression he was going to rush it out however, and he seemed to be hinting at disappointing sales of the island versions... We shall see. Chris

I guess everyone's experience is unique. My O2s just seem to run better every time I give them a go. Silky smooth, very quiet, and superb track-holding. Their "Model of the Year" accolade is definitely justified. I'm now waiting with baited breath for announcements of new IOW liveries (there are a number to choose from).......! Chris

Things have been moving on apace at Newport. When I last blogged I think I was still at the "track positioning" stage. Now all the track at Newport is laid permanently, glued down with Copydex, and has been tested digitally (i.e. pushing stock using finger power!). There are four boards of which one is now wired and one is partially wired. I have also finished the Modratec interlocked lever frame. With the change of track plan and complete rebuilding of Newport I needed to commission a new set of locking bars. Harold at Modratec responded very quickly and had airmailed me a new set of bars in time for the Christmas break, during which I spent many hours assembling the frame and filing the notches in the tappets. (Usual disclaimer applies, I am merely a happy customer of Modratec.) The Kernow O2s arrived as birthday presents in early January and I now have an operational DCC fleet of 4 locos. They are superb lookers and superb runners. The small pile of Wills Finecast kits is now looking more likely than ever not to get built. I finally got around to making a Sprat & Winkle coupling mounting gauge which has transformed the reliability of my couplings(!) I can't believe it has taken me so long to see the wisdom of having a single reference point for fitting these couplings. Test running (ok, "playing trains"!) continues on the remaining part of the layout, and a few more gremlins have been erased. The most remarkable feature of the Kernow locos is that in many hours of test running, in all possible permutations of speed, direction and loading, not one has ever suffered a derailment. They are little beauties and they deserve to win the top award for 2015. Chris

Today I carried out a haulage trial with my IOW coaches. They are a mixture of modified Grafar suburbans and Ratio Midland coach kits, fitted with whitemetal bogies and therefore pretty heavy. The O2s each handled 3 fine, 4 with some slipping (which looked quite realistic and added to the driving challenge), whilst 5 or 6 were out of the question...Thus justifying my quest for being able to adding weight to the boiler. I still haven't plucked up the courage to have another go at removing the body! Chris

I have a ZTC set up which has a DC setting which is pure unadulterated DC and quite unlike using "Loco 0", which is what I think you are referring to. I guess the warning is timely though for anyone who is not a DCC expert, because I guess many systems do not have this facility. I do believe everyone should have a controller that outputs DC, however, because the DCC chips do get in the way of diagnosing problems I find ("one more thing that could have gone wrong").

I'm a DCC newbie too, and have in the past got myself in a right mess with CV settings. Until I can find the time and the inclination to explore its possibilities thoroughly (and I have rapidly concluded it is a science all on its own), I have restored all my chipped locos to the chip manufacturer's default state. How this is achieved varies from manufacturer to manufacturer, but at least one then has a pretty workable baseline from which to be able to assess where the problem lies. Alternatively, switch to DC (if your controller will do it - mine will) and you will be able to see if the loco runs OK. (But no feedback, mind, as the O2 has a coreless motor). DCC is an additional complication when it comes to working out "what's wrong", and when I'm desperate I simply hoick out the old H&M Clipper and use that instead! Chris

Yes - I unscrewed the two screws in the bunker, removed the roof, and then raised the back of the loco. I chickened out before getting to the 45 degrees mentioned in the instructions. About half way there I was meeting a fair amount of resistance, and could not be sure what was causing it. That's when I abandoned ship and posted on this forum and then messaged you in person. I had imagined the boiler would separate from the splashers but the splashers came up with the boiler, which is what made me nervous. Now that I've seen a picture of the loco with the body removed it is clear that the splashers are integral with the rest of the body, so maybe my courage will return. In any event, I have now hardwired a chip and added a stay-alive in the bunker to No.16 Ventnor, which was what I wanted to do. I have two more IOW models in boxes and I will try removing the body on one of those in due course. It's impossible to get everything perfect for everyone I know, but another suggestion, along with using standard DCC wiring colours, is the provision of an exploded drawing of the whole model. Other manufacturers provide this and it provides useful guidance for the process of dismantling, which, however perfect the model may be, some people are going to want to achieve, for whatever reason! For me the ambition is to get the electronics in the bunker and a lead weight in the boiler. My coaches are heavier and stiffer than most (brass, kitbuilt) so comments like "pulls 6 Hornby coaches with ease" do not apply to my set up! Thanks for all you help Chris

Ah - and I can see you got the body off, seemingly without cutting any of the pipe work, and you have a gloriously empty boiler to boot! Do you have any insight into how the body was removed because it is flooring a number of us! Chris

Thanks Dave, this is indeed extremely helpful. I can achieve most of what I wanted to do without removal of the body. Just a small comment that removing the circuit board for the purposes of hard wiring (in order to get more or bigger "stuff" inside the boiler) would be straightforward if the loco had been wired used the normal DCC colours - red/black to wheels, grey/orange to motor, yellow/white (?I think) to the sound module (though I'm no expert on sound). Thank you again for the excellent and prompt service on this matter! Chris

It can be done: there is a photo on the YouChoos website showing a body removed (see link below). From what I can make out from the photo, the smokebox is held in place by a couple of lugs right at the front. This however does not explain the degree of resistance I was experiencing when attempting to remove the body. The instructions by the way, do say you can do it, but be careful. Based on my experience with locos of this wheel arrangement you need as much weight as you can get into the front of the loco, for which body removal and re-wiring is a pre-requisite. Whilst most people will no doubt be happy to do nothing more than plug and play, this is a little bit disappointing for someone who wants to do things differently:- http://www.youchoos.co.uk/Index-Resource.asp?L1=Guides&Item=KernowO2

Thanks for the suggestion. I had the same idea, wrote this morning and received a helpful and prompt reply. Marvellous service beyond what one normally expects.. Chris