Woodcock29

J6 or J11 Andrew

Tony The GNRS book on GN Tenders by Malcolm Crawley is worth getting in my view. It was one of the two books in the parcel from Steve White of the GNRS that was sent to your place for me when I visited in in 2017! I don't think I did much more than glance at it quickly then shove it in my bag when I was at your place. I should have shown it to you. It has a series of drawings by Paul Craig, who also assisted with development of a number of the GN LRM kits. It enables one to determine which loco had which type of tender from around 1930 to withdrawal as well which I found most useful for my mid-late 1930s modelling period. It doesn't contain any photos which was apparently Malcom's wish. Also it doesn't cover this issue of the movement of the front coal plate to a further forward position on horseshoe tenders either. I had to rely on Yeadon and other books with photos for that. Still I wouldn't be without it for what I need to build. From what I've found almost none of the w/m GN tenders in various kits are correct. My next loco build is likely to be a Premier kits D3 but the tender in that is too short so I'll need a LRM horseshoe for that - might have to steal the tender from my unbuilt LRM J6 in the short term! Andrew

Terry Could have got you one a few months ago at the golf club but it's a bit cold now! I'll keep my eyes open for one next summer. Expect you've got plenty up your way anyway. I'll have to think about getting a new bottle of flux soon, I'm getting rather low. The only back up is an old bottle of the, you guessed it Bakers Fluid! Andrew

Tony its looking very good. Might get to start on my Lord Faringdon later in the year? What is the source of the chimney? I plan on using a PDK chimney but will need to get a few more from them. Andrew

So perhaps I need to see if I can find an O4/3 shedded at Retford, Grantham, Lincoln or March? It doesn't appear as if any were ever shedded at New England. Roughly what years would you like? Andrew

Terry I should be able to help with selecting a number for an O4/3 for you. Trust you're both well up there at Booborowie? Andrew

Sounds familiar.

One of my O4/3s actually uses the GWR boiler as well, the one with the flowerpot chimney, but it's a lot more work correcting the boiler and smokebox front. Mostly removing bits, filling holes and making a new door hinge, replacing safety valve It's even possible to reuse the GWR chimney if you've only got the GWR ROD to work with. One has to remove the capuchon and although the shape is not perfect its not too bad. One aspect that is so useful is the way the body separates into major components so easily. Andrew

Sorry - I don't have my own thread, been too lazy I think. I'm sure Tony won't mind if I give you some pointers here. Basically the GWR footplate is the better one as it has a shorter wide section over the cylinders and the bolt heads on the front frames which most locos had - basically Bachmann got the shape of the footplate wrong on the O4 version - I don't know why they don't use the ROD footplate on their subsequent O4 models? Maybe its all too difficult with dedicated tooling for each version? You should use the O4 boiler. However, you need to decide whether you want an O4/1 (ie original GC loco as inherited by the LNER at Grouping) or an ex ROD version which was bought by the LNER in the 1920s from surplus Govt stock. The O4/1s were fitted with vacuum brake and therefore had the ejector pipe inside the handrail on the righthand side of the boiler as the Bachmann O4 has and also had water pickup so you need to use the King tender water pickup box arrangement for the rear deck of the tender and you need to remove the rear coal plate on the tender, and fit a ships wheel to the front of the tender for operating the water pickup gear (Judith Edge can supply these for £2). Note however that water pickup was generally removed after 1946 - so it depends on period you are modelling. You will need to fit a vacuum pipe to the front as well as the oval buffers from the O4 footplate - they pull out with a little bit of persuasion. If you build an O4/3 you need to use the O4 boiler but use the GWR cab as the rear angle iron on the cab roof is further forward - a feature of the ex ROD locos. My two O4/3s built from Bachmann parts do use the GWR cab - but you will need to remove the two whistles and then determine whether the single whistle for the engine you are modelling was on the top of the firebox in front of the cab or still on the roof, but in the centre (earlier period). You will need to remove the vacuum ejector pipe inside the boiler handrail which will probably mean making a new handrail and fitting new handrail pillars. You will also need to use the oval buffers from the O4 footplate. I trust this is of some help micklner and that it all makes sense. Andrew

Did someone mention LNER 2-8-0s! A number of these have appeared on here before. My first O4 , an old Ks kit I bought secondhand in 1975, it was rebuilt in the early 80s with a later Ks chassis, ie not the key hole cutouts for axles and fitted with my first Portescap, it will just about pull more than anything else on the layout. The chimney is actually from a Black 5 but was the nearest I could get at the time. It needs fully flanged drivers and brakes when I find the time. Its also a bit of a hybrid neither an O4/1 or O4/3. Its numbered as an O4/1. Possibly I'll take the handrail so I can fit an ejector pipe and refit the vacuum pipes that fell off. The tender front also needs modification and water pickup if its to be an O4/1. The cab roof is not right for an O4/3 but possibly it requires less work to make it an O4/3 - its a product of its time and my lack of knowledge at that stage! My second O4 - the first Bachmann release - its had work to make it into a better O4/1 - tender has water pickup added, cylinders lifted, front pony pulled back 1-1.5mm, longer reversing rod. My second Bachmann O4 - utilising a Bachmann O4/1 boiler on a Bachmann WR ROD footplate and WR ROD cab, ejector pipe removed, other mods to loco chassis as above. An O4/5 utilising a Bachamnn WR ROD with a Bill Bedford 3-D Printed boiler and cab. Water pickup added to tender, chassis mods as above. Another Bachmann WR ROD was used to make this O4/3 with flowerpot chimney. The chimney is a cut down Bachmann J11 chimney. Chassis mods as above. My first O2, a Nucast kit I built in 1982. Also Portescap fitted. Cab is made from tinplate to get a better curve for the LNER cab. Was upgraded in the 90s with fully flanged 14 spoke drivers, new smokebox dart and Crownline chimney. Has probably run more miles than any other loco I have! Heljan O2/3. Has had a full makeover including new expansion links, new chimney, buffers, smokebox handles, handrails, repaint. I agree with the comment made previously that the Hornby O1 is probably the best of the RTR LNER 2-8-0s. This has had a new chimney and smokebox front, courtesy of Graeme King. It could do with some additional less brown weathering of the chassis. Last but not least of the current operational fleet, not that it gets much of a run as I rarely run BR period stock, my father's Bachmann WD, weathered by my friend Alan Harrison, who also visited you with us in 2017. But that's not the end of the story! I have another couple of Bachmann O4/RODs to work with, plus two Nucast O2/3s, one of which will form the basis for a Gresley O1. Also I have another old built Ks O4 that I was given as well as an unmade Ks O4 to use. Plus an unbuilt Little Engines O1 I paid less than 15GBP for at a BRMA Convention a few years ago! Andrew

Nice work Graham. My next loco build is an old w/m Premier kits D3 in superheated form so its 4-4-0s galore! Also the quint looks great. Andrew

I don't believe LNER black locos ever had gold shaded lettering, Bachmann got that wrong, as have Hornby on various occasions. Green locos had gold lettering. Black locos had yellow lettering, shaded until 1946. After 1946 although the standard was plain Gill Sans yellow for black locos, old stocks of shaded yellow lettering were used up. Andrew

Tony - the D16/3 looks excellent. Did you use Romford 27mm driving wheels as they didn't make 7ft diameter wheels if my memory serves me right? I have a Crownline D16/3 to make one day. It will be the green 8900 Claud Hamilton (and I managed to resist buying the Hornby version of that, although I did buy a black one as it was such a good model). I have a set of Maygib 7ft diameter wheels for it, although they are 22 spoke, which i'm not particularly looking forward to using! It seems the old Romford 27mm 20 spoke are probably the best fit but where to get them? They are also almost the perfect wheel for GC locos: B2, B3, D10, D11, so I could do with at least 5 axles worth if only I could get them. I think you are correct about the chimney it does look too tall. A B1 chimney is the right one to use. I often end up using chimneys on kits I've sourced elsewhere because they are so important to get right. Andrew

That's what we did 14 years ago and its not the first time, but the third! Each time I've ended up with a larger railway! Andrew

Thanks for that info Andrew. I wasn't actually intending to suggest that it was accurate more the case that this is what the corridor side might have looked like closer up and in colour given we have photos of a range of restaurant cars with the partially see through coating from at least the late 1920s. I note there are a number of photos of Dia 187 on Steve Banks website and its clear they had the white windows as shown in the photo above which is one on his site. I think I've even got the Isinglass drawing of Dia 187 somewhere - many years ago I got the drawings for most of the single car restaurant cars. I have the sides for a Dia 241 to build one day. Andrew

It pays to also have a look at ones own photos! Granted this is a preservation era subject however it shows how the LNER Carriage Group on the SVR has interpreted the corridor windows in its Gresley Composite Restaurant Car. Its interesting in that the windows on the other side were the same opaque glass - I'm not sure about that though! Andrew

Yes I had that thought also this morning - I have lots of sheets of transfers mostly with some form of protective sheets as well, so I must investigate. Andrew

Closer to you John. My cousin's husband was the winemaker at Capital Wines just out of Canberra but they've since sold the winery. However, mostly when drinking Riesling its from Clare or Eden Valley/Springton which is just over the hill east of the Barossa. Normally I only drink South Australian wine but when its in the family..... Andrew

I've looked at that photo many times pondering whether its as you say or whether its a different reflection because of the internal corridor behind it? If its as you say then I wonder how we model that effect - maybe some tracing paper behind the windows - can we still buy that? Andrew

Artics - I've built three sets as follows: Kirk 1928 Restaurant Triplet - originally for my father (in the 1980s) but now running on my layout. Need some extra detailing of underframes and HD bogies which I now have in stock. I agree the corridor windows on the kitchen car were not white on these sets. Twin Dia 124/126 - from Hornby 51'0 stock - still needs HD bogie in the centre Howlden Dia 218T - from D&S 6 wheelers (Jonathan your triplet above is a Dia 218K) Currently I'm building wagons (mostly ex NE) but have also started on two of Bill Bedford's newish printed resin 6 wheelers, Dia 148 lav comp (in primer) and Dia 154 luggage comp (in raw resin). Roofs are not fitted. The centre axle arrangement for the Dia 154 was missing so I've constructed a floating arrangement on a brass wire from the spare D&S parts I had. I've got at least three more artics to build. Howlden Dia 134 from two Dia 146s (Frank Davies etches), two D&S Dia 245s into a twin and the Louth Quad (Nick Easton etches) from two ex rigid 8 wheelers, a Dia 245 third and a saloon third). Whether I ever build my Mailcoach Coronation is another question! Now time for a pre-dinner drink here in South Australia - one of my cousin's Rieslings I think tonight. Stay safe everyone. Andrew

I have two on the way at the moment. Dia 164F and 78T. Currently I'm building two of Bill Bedford's 3D printed 6 wheelers and some wagons as a distraction from the finicky business of the somersault signals! I would love a GN 56'6" BG. I'm sure Andy says he can print anything John did drawings of or that the customer can provide drawings of. Andrew

I have an unmade Ks O4 which I might try this on. Shouldn't be too difficult with care. A brass footplate wouldn't be any easier as the valences have to be bent as well and depending on the angle are likely to kink out sideways.

Jesse It should be quite easy on a kit with a whitemetal footplate. Andrew

I actually have a 28xx as well but it doesn't see the light of day very often! Plus two 8Fs.

I love seeing all the 2-8-0s. What they hauled probably earnt the LNER a high proportion of its income in the southern area. I'll probably end up with 12 or more LNER 2-8-0s on my medium sized layout (22.5 x 17ft). Just a comment to those modifying Bachmann O4s or WR/GWR RODs. It's well worth modifying the top of the cylinders so they sit higher up and the piston rod lines up with the centre of the driven axle. Also the pony wheel needs to be brought further back by modifying the pony truck. Graeme King and I wrote all this and more up in two articles in the GCRS journal Forward about 10 years ago. In regard to the incorrect footplate shape on the Bachmann O4 models I would recommend following the recent advice of Headstock. I'll be doing that for the first Bachmann O4 I did based on the original model. Also for anyone making an O4/8 Graeme King makes a nice taller chimney and the correct dome as well. Andrew