Steve507

Hi Mark, Yeah its probably for the best going down the multiple decoder route, it makes it so much simpler, even though costly. but i spread the cost over a number of months so takes the sting out of it, just over £200 in decoders. 3 per train set x 4 sets = 12 decoders. (Zimo X2 ) (DCC concepts X2) (TCS X8) I've only got a single motor with pickups on the motor bogie and second bogie and I've had no problems with power issues, the decoder in the motor carriage is DCC concepts Zen Mini. in the dummy carriages they have pickups on all wheels and use TCS FL4 function only decoders. Ive e mailed the company who designed the 2014 'communications' livery, fingers crossed they can assist, if they do im thinking of contacting Adam at Electra rail to print them on vinyl. edit to add, got a reply from the company. they assigned the IP and Copyright of the designs to Merseyrail a few years ago. So advised to contact Merseyrail.

I've ordered the bus wire kit as you recommended. 👍 3D printer; what puts me off purchasing one is i just cant see me using it beyond completing the 507. All the detail you've printed for the 507, exterior and interior are they contained on a file? (if that's how it works) would it be possible for you to e mail me that file and i could contact 3dprintcorner to see if they could print them out for me as i've used their services before for printing the 3rd rail beams/shoes. (that's if your happy to) the number i need it might cost a bit in time and material as i have four 507's, 3 car set, having so many might mean its worth me buying the 3D printer after all.. i dunno... windows; I was hoping you'd hear back from them with a solution it would've saved me some time cutting them all out. its a shame they never replied. 507 disaster; wired connections between the carriages, that's why i gave up on running wires between them, i had a problem similar to yourself and then when finally solved it, another problem the micro sockets would come loose after x-amount of circuits - when it comes to soldering and wiring it fills me with dread to the point i put it off till the last. - before i started this project i'd never soldered or used a multimeter. the latter still confuses me when testing the LEDs. Just take your time and im sure you'll sort it. best of luck. progress; Yesterday i primed (bottom pic) the other 3 sets units ready for painting the front cab, rear, roof and doors, need to sand the print lines on the cab ends first - im gonna use the same vinyl livery, tiger stripe, but on the off chance probably copyright issues but i've contacted Merseyrail to see if they can send me their graphic for the latest 2014 "communications" livery. As a mate in work mentioned his youngest lad had a cardboard box with part of the communications livery on it. - my thinking was to try and scan it, resize modify and get it printed on vinyl. image from the internet. The tape is used to keep the floors attached, as you know the floors need sanding to fit flush - and each one ever so slightly different.

Hi Mark, i've made no progress whatsoever on the model since my last post, - somehow i avoided getting covid for the 2 or so years its been about and then i got it twice in 3 weeks which the second bout knocked me sideways. but im back to feeling okay now, so i'll be having a go at the lights using the fibre optic i bought. im off work next week for our annual shutdown so hope to make progress then. On the windows, i used Evergreen 0.25mm clear polystyrene sheet. i cut widows out by hand using scissors, using the photoetch window as the template and i simply glued the clear plastic to the frame using Humbrol clearfix. I then just glued this on top of the train livery vinyl, it sits proud, but the clear plastic sits flush with the back of the etch frame, but the window frame sits proud anyway and to my eye the extra 0.25mm thickness of the plastic doesn't make much of a difference. - but the glue i used was humbrol clearfix. which if it gets on the window i just rub off with a dry cotton bud when dry. On 3D printer, what sort of printer would i need to print out seats, cab detail like you have etc.... - what price would i be looking at for printer and resin? on a different subject, if anyone can help what's the best wire to use as a bus wire on a layout, and dropper wires, preferably wire i can buy from the likes of B&Q or similar store. I don't have room for a permanent layout at the moment but could build a modular layout which i could put up and take down which would measure about 16 to 24 foot max, in a circuit, if that makes a difference when it comes to recommending wire.

(bold) that gave me a good laugh, 😂 The class 153 motor in fairness i've had no problems with it, well once i was shown on here how to wire it up and i got the weight correct - its run great for the last 4 or five months. like you every bogie as pick ups. which must add friction and ever since i came across DCC concepts pick ups, the ones that look like coiled springs. that fit on the axels, which wouldn't fit on the Hornby ones but would the Bachmann. so that got me thinking. The Bachmann motor, - it looks more beefier, and bogies better designed. i'll try squeezing the keeper plate on the Hornby ones. I've got the fibre optic cable now, so gonna try that tomorrow, question = I've got Nano LEDs for the marker lights. these are a combined white/Red set up. the LED face has white one side and Red the other. but both need to share the same marker light hole. with the fibre optic, if i fit the 2mm fibre optic into the marker light hole so this becomes the lens, will i have to use two 1mm fibre optic pieces. ie: one glued to the white LED face, and one to the Red LED face and then both of these pieces glued to the 2mm fibre optic? will the light work like this? will the light travel down one 1mm piece of fibre optic and then into the 2mm? (polish the ends with wet-dry emery to assist) Nano LEDs ive used. https://www.dccconcepts.com/product/led-nanolight-wresistors-6x-2-colour-protowhitered/ the set up would be White LED face -----1mm Fibre----\ -----2mm fibre----- Marker light. Red LED face -----1mm Fibre-----/ old pictures to show the marker lights need to be white and red.

thanks for explaining mate, very useful information ive got a better understanding now if i attempt it on the next one.

Bachmann sell screws. - but at £1 each. https://Bachmann-spares.co.uk/product/category/824/class-150-screw-power-bogie-32-930/e3293-264-08 So fitting of the bogie, it'd get a screw just a tad smaller/narrower than the hole in the bogie. (to let it swivel) this screw would then pass through a washer, a washer also with a centre hole slightly larger than the screw. the washer thickness just enough to stop the bogie catching on the airbags. - the screw would then be screwed solid to the chassis. - stupid question now. would the washer be glued to the bogie? or left loose on the screw? @Wear Valley Wanderer while browsing the Bachmann spares page. - would this coupling mechanism not help with wires running between carriages. lighting? or Motor? https://Bachmann-spares.co.uk/product/category/824/class-150-dmu-complete-assembled-coupling-mechanism-fixingplate-32-930/e3293-289-02

the Bachmann motor and housing looks substantial in comparison to the Hornby motor. - the kit maker recommends the Hornby motor, but do wonder would the Bachmann motor housing fit. even though the Hornby motor performs well, i cant help but feel the Bachmann would improve things further. How would be best to fit the Bachmann bogie? with a screw and bolt? as the kit simply as a hole through the floor. The Hornby bogie simply clicks in. but the Bachmann lacks this.

The ability to 3d print the interior and cab detail makes all the difference, I think all that you've done is brilliant and the tips you've given will come in useful. I agree with the wires being a pain, the running between the carriages was the worse part for me, hence i abandoned it and went with multiple decoders. - as for the lighting wires/decoder the approach i was going to take was to hide them in the ceiling, in a cavity that exists between what would be the carriage department roof and the roof of the actual train. wires would run along the roof cavity dropping down behind the drivers cab and under the drivers cab floor to the lights. the decoder would be at the back of the carriage in the space that would be created between what would be the passenger corridor door and the corridor connection door - (bear in mind im yet to implement it, as working on my interior detail as come to a standstill, and im now (unashamedly) watching you trailblazing the way forward. I ordered the fibre optics, but still waiting for them to be delivered. On another matter, The bogies I've used are the Hornby class 153. (pic / link below) they seem to offer more friction, than say my old 1980's Lima class 156. whose wheels spin more freely. it doesn't seem to be affecting the train running, but if you spin them by hand they stop within 5 or so seconds whereas the old lima ones spin for what seems 20+ seconds. (Hornby bogie - actual link i purchased from) https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/265028454323 Bachmann spare bogie for class 150 (this looks more like my old Lima Bogie and could imagine the wheels spinning more freely than the Hornby. Do you or anyone else think these Bachmann ones could be used instead? Also the drive motor. I'm using Hornby class 153 petes spares https://www.petersspares.com/Hornby-x9882-class-153-dmu-drive-unit-complete.ir Bachmann spares again. would it be possible to use this motor, which im guessing would be a upgrade on the Hornby one? housing motor

thanks for the info and help, The station seats i mentioned, their dimensions are, compared to yours. Station seats/(Yours) Height: 12.68mm (11.5mm) Width: 65.86mm / 7.31 per seat. yours (5mm per seat) Depth: 14.92mm (12mm) Im starting to think i'm getting to caught up on interior detail, something that wont really be that visible. i'd like it to be the best i can do, but. the train is complete except for interior carriage detail and driver cab. I've another kit to do, and want to cross over the things ive learnt from the first one, and implement the hints and tips offered throughout this thread and try and improve. - on the fibre optic, are these the right type, the end lit ones? if so i'll order 1mm, 1.5mm 2mm, & 3mm. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/265591545856?hash=item3dd67d6000:g:P38AAMXQya1Q9CCH

The undercarriage detail is brilliant, unfortunately i don't have a 3d printer. wouldn't even know where to start with one. I haven't sourced any additional undercarriage detail. just been using the ones supplied with the Kit. - On interior detail i've came to a standstill, - On seating i was thinking of buying this seating ([pic below) i know its station seating, but possibly cutting it into pairs and using them as interior seats. but they could be oversized for the interior? what's the dimensions of the pair of seats you've 3d Printed? https://www.modelrailwayscenes.com/collections/station-accessories/products/station-seating-group-of-18-2-pack Once again looks brilliant. What's this method of using fibre optic? Do you just cut a length of fibre optic and glue one end to the LED on the 'face' of the LED, and the other end of the fibre optic becomes the headlight lens- what type of fibre optic do you use and where do you source it from? i wouldn't mind having ago of this method. i've just glued my LED's straight into the headlight holes. its worked but i'd think your method is better. I was making headlight lenses by using humbrol clear. and then pushing the LED up against the lens before gluing, Ive used tower LEDs for the main headlight and micro LEDS for the other lights. Also i noticed in one of your pictures the middle carriage that contains the motor, if i've seen correctly you seem to have two motors installed in the one carriage. what's the benefit of this just better traction/speed? and does one decoder run both motors? I've been running my train for a few months now without problem. ( i dont have a layout so set up a oval of track to make sure everything is still working) . oh, i did change something, i don't know if i mentioned this, i had wires running between the motor carriage (middle Carriage) and one of the end units to control the lights. but the micro sockets i used just kept coming loose, so i've ditched them and now have a decoder in each carriage. TCSf4 function only decoder in both end units and Zen mini controlling the Motor in the middle carriage. its done away with the micro sockets, but its an expensive way of doing things 3 decoders in one train but it does give piece of mind.

yeah makes sense that, and i never really thought of it that way. the one i have up and running runs well with the motor in the middle, the part that's letting me down is wiring from the middle coach to the end unit the mini sockets come loose. I was thinking of using three decoders per set to get around having wires going from one coach to another. but it becomes very costly having three, function only for the lights in each end unit with their own pick ups. and decoder for the motor. Do you reckon i'd need one or two motors per three car set? (i've already purchased three Hornby class 153 motors) but would ditch and switch if its worth it. just looked at the black beetles, haven't a clue what ones id need. 🤔

Hi Mark, can you share any pictures of the underframe and inside cabs, seats you've designed. are these scratch built or 3D printed, / Resin? I had a go of scratching built an interior but didn't look great. it would sort of pass looking from the outside but im looking for an alternative as I've purchased three more units. which i've sanded, primed and are ready for the vinyl. so anything which makes it easier. my attempt, with a bit of spare plasticard, and i've stopped at this point in regards to interior. looking for an alternative. Question for anyone out there: these 507/508 come as a three car set, with the middle carriage designed to take the motor, so the middle carriage runs as push, pull. I was wondering why this is, is it because its a better configuration to Run? and would it make a difference if the motor (Hornby class 153 motor) was instead mounted in one of the end units, instead of push pull, it would be either pushing two carriages or pulling two carriages depending on direction. this configuration would help with the decoders, not having to run wires from middle carriage to one of the end units for head/marker lights. The unit i've done with the motor mounted in the middle carriage, is fitted with a zen mini decoder, with the wires running to one end unit for the lights. but these are connected by mini sockets, between carriages but these work themselves loose, and im not having a good time with them - the Unit at the opposite end is self-contained with its own pick ups and fitted with a TCS FL4 function only decoder. Any help / advice appreciated

The resin roof colour looks good to me, hence i thought you'd painted them. the headlights did look good on your 508 build. im following this build with interest, looking forward to see how you affix your 3rd rail beams.

Hi mate, same here, found them by chance when browsing DCC concepts website, I had trouble soldering them and the wire is so thin, with the wire being so thin i didn't know how to strip it. to make matters worse my wire stripper would actually cut the wire instead of stripping it, i was getting frustrated, then by accident i found the heat from the soldering iron either melted or burnt away the wire coating, exposing the wire, - but then found the exposed wire the solder wouldn't adhere, so i had to place the wire on a sanding sponge and with another piece of sanding sponge lightly sand the exposed wire, add a bit of flux and the solder would work. I then pressed ahead with soldering everything only to realise i wired them all up wrong. - somehow i labelled the wires wrong, I left it for a day or two and last night i redone it all. Its easy once you've learnt from the mistakes. and i seem to be making mistakes every step of the way. but i sort of get there in the end.

I re-wired the Bi-coloured LEDs. so two marker lights are DCC concepts Nano white/Red. am going to have to send for the nano white light for the upper marker light. move onto creating some sort of interior, and sort out the light bleed. gonna paint the 2mm tower LEDs (headlights) black except for the tip. and make a basic cab. and put a driver in. also my 3rd rail beams arrived from 3dprintcorner. a few pictures. 3rd rail beams. day/night/marker/tail lights.

im currently building class 507, i visited Hall road train station to see the underframe detail, but it seems like no two trains have the exact same layout, some of the components are but others, are missing or different all together. in the end i said to myself the next 507 that arrives whatever the layout is im copying that. A video on Youtube, half hour at Brunswick might help you, just pause the video, the suns from the right direction to show the underframe components. From about 2mins.

looking great, what paint was used for the roof and yellow fronts? Are you going to be installing lights? I've started adding them on my build. I ordered some of the 3rd rail beams you recommended from 3dprinting corner should arrive in the post next week. look forward to more updates on your build

its been a month, thought i'd do a little update. started on installing the decoder, which was straight forward, wired up the lights and remapped the buttons. but made a mistake on wiring up the bi-coloured white/red LEDs and just haven't got around to re-wiring them. made my own decals as well, the black around the lights, M logo, and unit number, used the very basic Microsoft paint. - and decal paper was Mr decal paper (clear) inkjet £7 for 5 sheets off amazon. printed on a standard inkjet printer. then left for the ink to dry for 30mins before giving it three coats of gloss to seal the ink into the decal paper. liquitex high gloss varnish. wires a bit of a mess but temporary to make sure everything runs. noticed a drop in top speed under DCC control, than under DC. even with decoder CV altered. used micro sockets to connect wires from dummy unit to motor unit ( middle carriage ) once again picture of temporary set up. windows coming loose due to repeated handling. small pieces of plastic to attach the LED's headlight lens made from Humbrol clear fix.

I've been waiting 20 odd years for a manufacturer to release the units, But Fingers and toes crossed for Mondays announcement, - if it was to be announced how long does it normally take from announcement to being available in the shops? by the way who's making the announcement on Monday Bachmann or Hornby?

Yes i received a direct e mail reply from Mick, whose been helpful throughout and i'd be grateful if you can pass on my thanks to him. Moving onto the kit build itself. an update. I started the process of adding the lights, and how best to mount them. but before final install im gonna have to paint the inside of the cabs to help prevent light bleed. The LED's themselves, I used my multimeter to determine which wire was which, the tower LED's was straight forward. i bit less so with the Nano Bi White/Red. having three wires all the same length. - I worked my way through the pack of six, and on the very last one it blew. the red light shone, small pop, smoke and it was no more. - dunno what i did wrong. luckily i only need four.

I've planned to get the carriages closer, Ive got Kadee #17, short couplings, at the moment their clipped into the normal bogie socket. but the kits cast-resin floor as what looks like moulded sockets so, im going to cut the socket off the bogie line it up with the resin socket and glue it to the underframe and the Kadee coupling should with a little modification to the socket click into it. bringing the carriages closer. so the gap will be just the length of the two coupling heads. But i'm open to any ideas to get them even closer. I've done a trial on 3rd radius bends, and large left/right points to make sure it worked before cutting the bogie. i fitted a small screw, just to hold the kadee coupling. it ran for over an hour without problems. plan as above modify so the kadee fits.

I don't have a layout, so its a test track on the floor for now. but a clip of the train running. https://streamable.com/jxcljm @313201 I know you asked a while ago if i'd upload a video of it running.

carrying on from post above. above supports added so i can screw the floor to body.

im no expert, probably you could use a clear vinyl or another possibility add spray primer, build up two or three layers and then sand it down with Tamyia sanding sponges. 1500 or 3000 grit. that would give a nice smooth finish. before applying the vinyl. (something i did, but if i was to do it again i'd add another two primer layers and sand it smooth so you cant see any 3d print lines. and then apply the vinyl) the Electrail vinyl is cut out, so as you peel it the window sections are left behind. picture of the many windows i cut from the evergreen clear plastic sheet. pile of windows bottom left. photo etch windows painted.

If i could start again i'd do what you've suggested, i'd paint the door frames. The doors, would sit better if cut out. I've been over cautious doing just that because one wrong move and i ruin the vinyl i'd be knackered. I also showed a mate in work the train and was telling him about cutting the clear plastic into windows. - he's got a type of cutter that looks like a desktop printer, but it cuts plastic, his wife uses it for creating some sort of craft, he said it would cut the clear plastic sheet - so the windows would fit perfect. so i'd do that next time - What I've done is cut the plastic glazing to be flush with the etch window frame and glued the glazing to the back of the frame then that's glued onto the vinyl. so sits proud - next time i'd fit the glazing within the units cut out window frame. then apply the vinyl followed by the etch frame on top. i'm just surprised the likes of Bachmann haven't in all these years brought to market the class 507's 508's 313's. the amount of liveries for Merseyrail alone gives plenty of options. now that the 507's/508's are being replaced by the 777's, maybe a manufacturer will produce the unit. but a fella (another customer) i was talking in hattons said if they where to announced a class 507/508 the release would still be at least 5 years away.