Western Scottish

Thanks Caledonian. When (hopefully not if) we get our Scottish loco , you should get an honorary one! Hope you recover from the Lurgy!

Only problem is I don't think the Q1 was a particularly giood seller. No official figures of course, I just base this on the fact they were on offer on Hattons for a long time and have now disappeared from the catalogue, after a relatively short period of time. But the Q1 is another reason why we should have hope. As well as being geographically limited ,it was only ever black, and quite frankly was an ugly machine. Certainly if you didn't need one I reckon very few people would buy it because it was attractive. With out choices you have pre grouping liveries (lovely Caley Blue I hope), LMS or LNER liveries and BR early and late crests. Plus any of the three main candidates is much more attractive than a Q1! It does seem to have gone quiet on the Scottish loco front. I hope everyone is voting in the MRE mag poll. Also Hornby website also has a page where you can request your top 3 locos. Other than that all we can do is canvass the main societies. Here's hoping 2012 brings a nice surprise!

I think Bob makes very good sense. The next stage would be to address all the points in Dennis Lovetts letter. My view is we should then approach SRPS or Strathspey Line (good point about the need for funds to extend the line). However I would caution against a free for all writting letters approach. What we need to do is build up the case and approach someone on the commercial side of these organisations. They must have someone in charge of marketing and promotions. That would be the person to approach. Unfortunately I am not a member of either of these organisations, although I'd certainly join! I've forgotten about the Caledonian Railway at Brechin. They too may be interested. Why go through these societies. They are probably already dealing with the sums of money we are talking about. The SRPS frequently charters trains and I would have thought that re-boilering a locomotive is very expensive. So dealing with the sums of money necessary to commission a model should not be as daunting as say for one of our very good model shops. They are large organisations that will have the commercial acumen to bring this project to completion. Similarly if they say no we should perhaps reconsider the viability of what we want. They have a large membership. As a few people have pointed out we need to stretch beyond the membership of RMWeb. I don't know how many members the SRPS have, but I reckon its pretty substantial. Canvassing them to see how many would buy a model might help bulk up our case. Not excluding anyone at the moment. It may be we have a McKernow models in our midst who will take up the challenge. But looking at the scale of funds necessary (£50-£100k?)I think the bigger organisations have a better chance.

A very good reply from Dennis Lovett. I've read it a few times now and still pick up different vibes from it.As someone else has said it is extremely informative and polite but ultimately what he is saying is that without further support a Scottish model is not even on the shortlist. Part of the problem now is that we have actually given this issue quite a bit of publicity. In a way this may put Bachmann off if they think Hornby are interested and vice versa. For that reason I would suggest the most suitable "clearing house" is one of the preserved railway societies ie SRPS or the Speyside line. They would surely know if someone had measured up one of their locos and advise accordingly. Dennis also alludes to a commission by referring to NRM Deltic and City of Truro, also mentioning AMRSS who did commission a First Scotrail 158 sometime ago. That wasn't exactly a success , ironically because it was oversubscribed and there were a lot of disappointed people. The AMRSS is also not a sales organisation and other than Model Rail Scotland really doesn't have an outlet for the sale of the locos. It is possible that they could comine with Scottish model shops, who do have sales channels. However I do feel that such a commission would represent such a financial outlay that it may be beyond these shops even if they shared the cost. So where does it take us? I feel the only way forward is to lobby one of the big organisations to commission a loco. This would be either SRPS (either 439 or J36)or Strathspey line (Caley 812). We need to convince these organisations that such a venture would add to their funds and be beneficial all round. After all the NRM are presumably earned enough from Deltic that they commissioned City of Truro.They see these commissions as fund raising for their main activities. Why would this not work for a Scottish organisation as well?Is anyone a member of these organisations? Maybe its them we should be canvassing instead of the manufacturers.I genuinely believe there is an opportunity for someone to make money here. Of course how much would need to be thrashed out between commissioning body and Bachmann, but again if its worthwhile for the NRM....... One thing that I think Bachmann has overlooked ,is the attractiveness of these models in their own right which makes them much more saleable /desireable than something like the K3. If you didn't need one would you really go out and buy a K3? However I'll bet a lot of people who didn't need an M7 or T9 or , closer to home , the recently announced Midland 3F and S&D 7F did go out and buy or will buy a loco for their collection simply because its attractive and something out of the ordinary. The three prime contenders from the poll surely have that "X" factor. Hope this helps. As well as wanting these models this is a fascinating insight as to how model companies work .Thanks to Hornby , but particularly Bachmann for their detailed response.

Thanks to Dennis from Bachmann for replying. At least we know now we've caught someones attention. Perhaps negative posturing was the wrong phrase to use, I merely meant that manufacturers are retiscent or reluctant to reveal any of their plans . And for that reason any commitment that Dennis can give will surely only be along the lines of "we will look at it"- as if he tells us he's doing one he has effectively just revealed his 2011 plans (or 2010 , who knows what we will see on Sunday!) I think, as Caledonian, pointed out , the pertinent fact he has missed is that we have already recognised there were 5 Railway companies in Scotland and we have effectively already done the sorting for him. It is clear that Caledonian and NBR command the most support . Is it a marginal interest? Well there are lots of Scottish layouts around. While not as widespread as GWR branch layouts once were I do believe that many more people model Scottish Railways than live locally in the area. Ian Futers, for one has done a great job promoting Scottish railways, The Railway Modeller still has a Scottish themed issue in March, so I do think the market is larger than he initially appears to believe. One final point- when they brought out the Fairburn 2-6-4T as a limited edition in Caley livery (as preserved on L&H)- did it not sell like hotcakes? While I admit there's a large gap between a 512 model limited edition and 9000 model production run it does show that there is a demand for locos in Caley livery. And what with LMS Red/Black and BR Black liveries I'm sure we could get to 9000!

The initial response is disappointing,but maybe thats just the defensive posturing these companies have. They are hardly going to say "Oh yes we'll have a go at that" I would hope they take the initiative seriously though Never get it past the accountants? I think the case built up is capable of being presented. Would they have got the original Caley 123 past? Anyway what do accountants know about railways? If its blue and cute they'd probably go for it - its input from enthusiasts they need. I think you should be proud of the presentation made . It was carefully built up and certainly warrants more consideration. Hopefully the dismissive comments were just defensive posturing. Failing that, there's always "OO" Works.

Just lead Simon Kohler and Dennis Lovett by hand over to Annan Road where Caley Jumbos and 439 0-4-4s were in operation and then down to Alloa for a J36! I want one or two, or three......... Thanks for organising this Caledonian. Here's hoping they were receptive.