61656

Now that is definitely an idea with legs. Or wheels. How did they not all end up in the four foot?

Great looking layout this, with some really atmospheric photos. Surprising how good the 40’s look with the Shawplan glazing - another job to add to my endless list!

I probably need more than that! It is good to be getting to the stage where I can think about getting BRUTES.

A few photos from tonight’s running session - a little collection of what it’s all about. A 25/1 emerges from the gloom light engine. A class 33, one of the highlights of North Wales in the mid-eighties, takes a Cardiff service southbound. The afternoon Speedlink service for Llandudno and Bangor accelerates out of Christleton. Is there anything better than a 40 on oil? Celebratory 40, 40122, finds a turn on the Stanlow tanks. This is what I really wanted… a class 45 has pulled forward from its rake of Trans-Pennine coaches. Red Star offices, Travellers Fare cafe, a very run down station. What’s not to love?

Despite not having any kind of clue as to what I’m doing, I am really pleased with how this is turning out. The parcels tower is all kinds of funny angles as it doesn’t run square to either the backscene or road, but it’s proved surprisingly easy to build. Both roof sections are really odd shapes, but very easy to cut to size as the building makes a ready formed template. I think I’ll use pre-printed slates for the roof, but any other suggestions gratefully received. I’ve also noticed, that for every job I complete, I think of another 5 to do next. It makes you think that maybe Lord Lucan is just “doing one more thing” on his model railway and he’ll reappear any day now.

Some more progress, with the Parcels tower starting to take shape. This is proving to be a lot more enjoyable than I expected it to be. Plus, so far at least, I haven’t made a complete dog’s dinner of it yet! I really thought that scratch building my own stuff would be beyond me and I’d end up unsatisfactorily hacking card kits about. Anyway, get your parcels wrapped, the Christleton south lift shaft is on its way! The angle with the road is quite oblique, so I’ll probably straighten that slightly, but not to a full 90 degrees. Then I need to start thinking about roof tiles, drain pipes and weathering. The modelling bug is back.

Some more progress on the buildings at the South end of the station. The Red Star office and Travellers Fare Cafe have been completed. I’ve used various home made prints to go behind the 2mm glass to hide their lack of interiors. With this section complete, and some basic paint applied, I can start to build up the brick structures that link the whole section together. On the left are the beginnings of the lift tower, that will allow parcels access from street level, whilst on the right there’s a large wall around the base of North Western Tower.

Well I dropped in to see what progress was being made with the layout, but seeing the white bar is annoying everyone else… I’ll try a few of those tips, meanwhile, nice progress on the scenery! It’s beginning to look really convincing.

I’m looking for some photos to use as interiors for the Red Star office and The Travellers Fare cafe. I thought a quick Google search and print out would do the trick, but I can’t find anything even remotely suitable. Does anyone have any suggestions? Obviously being low relief, I can’t make an actual interior without taking some bricks out of the chimney breast (hmm…).

Interestingly*, I have wondered about including a new line under construction to take the Warrington lines straight into Chester, as if BR sorted out the reversal problem in 1988 and Christleton disappeared. Which is why it’s just plain line today… *to me.

Cheese? Tomato? This isn’t nouvelle cuisine! I understand a Mr C. Dibbler is the current owner.

A little bit of progress with the arches at the end of platform 4. I wasn’t sure I was going the right way with this, but I’m fairly happy with how this little cameo is coming together. The left most arch is a station store, where signs and barriers are kept. A handy place for a quiet cig and a cuppa. The middle arch has seen most progress towards becoming the platform level Red Star office. The next one across will be the long talked about Travellers Fare cafe, home of the famous Christleton buttie.

Mark, Welcome to official forum membership! Thank you for your kind, and inspirational, words. For me, Christleton is my interpretation of lots of my favourite bits of other people's layouts, so its nice to come full circle and provide inspiration for others. As a fairly new modeller, without the skills to match my ambition and ideas, it's always a little odd when someone finds inspiration from my work, which can usually best be descried as 'not a total disaster'! The location and period sort of chose itself by a process of elimination when I listed through the trains I wanted to run (electrics, mainly blue with some intercity livery, peaks and 40s). The benefit of modelling the North Wales Coast, or the approach to it, is the variety of stock that ran there in the 80's. Adding the electrics is just pure indulgence! Looking forward to seeing your own efforts in the Parish News soon! Andy

I only saw Mostyn once, amazing layout. I’d love to have that attention to detail, but there’s just one of me on a part time basis! Useful reference photos for the future though.

Good old Penmorfa has some good information on it. http://www.penmorfa.com/Archive/three.htm The earliest photo is 5 years after today (!), but they can’t have changed much since introduction in 1971. There are so many unique pieces of rolling stock in North Wales at the time, it’s a real challenge deciding what to model. In the short term, I think this will run as some form of tank train.

A really good running session this evening with 61656 Senior joining me at the controls. Only a couple of photos but quite a few observations. We ran the timetable from around 6.30 to 10.30, which took about 2.5 hours. It would have been longer but a few services couldn’t run due to absence of stock. The early morning is filled with units. With only 2 available this gets a little tedious. It may be more interesting as I get a variety of units. There’s the promise of a Heljan 104 and the distant prospect of an EMU. I’m not sure if there’s much more available RTR. As the flow of units is uneven, I need a way to get from the Warrington yard to White Lane. It’s possible a cassette solution could work here. Both passenger and freightliner services are skewed around boat dockings, so a Holyhead to Crewe yard link is required. There is also quite an uneven flow of ballast workings too (currently limited to 25s on OBAs). An early Crewe to Llandudno service is booked for an aircon 100mph rake, presumably for the return leg to Euston. It ran this morning as a short set and must have shot up to Christleton behind an 87. Finally around 9am the first rostered Peak of the day! This is the Man Vic to Bangor - a trans-pennine service that didn’t cross the pennines. Booked for a Peak the whole way, it was brought in slightly late by a 31. Just before the Peak took it out, the Point of Ayr to Oakfield sidings MGR came into the centre road. Short formed today by a 25 on one HEA… role on Cavalex! This will eventually be a pair of 20s on at least 15 HAAs. The new 56 may be too hard to resist too. One interesting suggestion is that having some additional through storage sidings may allow for longer MGR and F/L sets. Food for thought.

I wonder if they smelt? I think some TTAs or TEAs will suffice for the time being!

Time to discuss fiddle yards. I've never drawn a proper track plan of the whole layout before, so I had a go at knocking up something diagrammatic using Anyrail. I chose Peco code 75 for the templates, so the geometry is representative but not very accurate. The Warrington fiddle yard sidings shown in blue and green aren't fitted yet. Essentially I need the ability to make a couple of the Holyhead sidings able to link up to both the Warrington and Crewe yards. in theory this is relatively simple as there is plenty of useable space between the yards, 'below' the two track section at the entry to the Warrington yard. Practically this is much more challenging as that section is the lifting section. Now, whilst a wider lifting section is possible, it has the drawback of locking the door shut when down. With two young boys I'm not happy with the safety implications of this - at the moment if they accidentally lower the lifting section, they can still exit the room (with effort I can also get out, but it involves a lot of groaning), with a wider section here their exit would be sealed. Realistically I think the solution is to make the inner two Holyhead sidings join the Warrington lines before the lifting section, although their useable length (currently loco plus 5/6 coaches) will be significantly reduced. I also want to modify the inner White Lane Carriage Siding so that it is effectively a fan of DMU fiddle yard sidings, but the real thing is much tighter than the drawing suggests. I really need a curved 4 way point...

There’s at least one southbound ECS working in the early hours from Bangor to Bletchley. It’s noted as being timed for 595 tonnes and vacuum braked. I haven’t worked through the WTT far enough to see when it came up. There’s also the newspaper train from Euston which surprised me. I hadn’t realised the Humber to Holyhead wasn’t tanks. Presumably they are modified HAA type hoppers? It’s just noted as COY in the WTT, meaning Company Train, which I take to mean private owner wagons rather than common user. Having the timetable has transformed operations, to the extent that I’ve almost completely stopped doing scenery! I don’t think I can operate it much quicker than real time because of how many movements there are. Chester was amazingly busy.

Paul, The more information the better. I’m a gluten for the detail! Andy

And so the service continues through the night. 02.46 and a large logo 47 brings 1A04 from Holyhead to Euston in. It left Holyhead at 01.15, presumably connecting with a boat from Dublin. The 47 will be replaced by AC traction in platform 1. There’s a DMU service at 03.00 to Manchester Vic, followed by a parcels service to Holyhead. A couple of tank trains pass through in the middle of the night, for which I probably need some bogie tanks, the Humber to Holyhead (loaded in which direction?) and the Purfleet to Bromboro (again, loaded in which direction?). At 5.01 the Warrington Arpley, 7D14, speedlink service to Llandudno comes in, needing to run round in the centre road. It often drops a couple of vans at the brewery, with the 08 helping if time demands it. Here we see a 25 snaking back onto the Down Main to get the train towards the Coast. There’s another lull between 5 and 6. Intercity liveried 47 612 breaks the silence and starts the hiatus of the morning. This is 5K81 the ECS from Holyhead to Crewe carriage sidings. Unusually it doesn’t change traction, but it does stop for a crew change. We see it sitting in the centre road awaiting the new driver to amble across from the mess room. The 47 is followed by a late running 31 on the Bletchley ECS vans, 3B05. This is booked to run ahead of the Holyhead ECS, but must have been late away from Bangor. Here’s the impact on the fiddle yard, with the Crewe and Warrington storage sidings all full. There’s space for another 3 roads, but the biggest issue is that I can’t easily get trains between Crewe and Holyhead. Realistically to run the timetable I need several services to be represented by the same rolling stock. Thoughts on a new fiddle yard layout will follow shortly.

At 01.10, a grubby class 31 gets a grubby set of vans moving on the 3D11 parcels service to Bangor. This is where having a real timetable based on an actual date gets you to think about the layout of your railway, especially the fiddle yards. This will fill the 6 Holyhead storage sidings, two of which will now have parcels rakes in them. The next requirement for a parcels set is from Warrington, so I need a way to move them between yards; I don’t mind lifting the odd loco but whole sets are a different matter. We’ll arrange a seminar session soon to discuss fiddle yards! After the 47 minute gap (my previous suggestion of 49 minutes overlooked release of the station pilot back to Bluebeck), the Stanlow to Aberystwyth tanks rolls through the middle road. I don’t yet have all the stock required to operate the full timetable, so several services are made up of what’s currently available… Ideally I’d like a set of 4 wheel and a set of bogie tanks, but it’s becoming apparent that storage space is going to be at a premium.

The middle of the night is proving to be a busy time at Christleton. First of all comes a 101 on 2D49 from Manchester Vic. It will terminate in platform 3 at 00.17, before going back to White Lane sidings. This photo shows a view I don’t normally include. The 101 is coming round what will be a scenic section, the pair of electrified lines to Warrington. Behind the 101 are the six sidings of the Chester / Holyhead fiddle yard, which join the main layout front centre. Between the Chester and Warrington lines is the hole for the canal. On the left is White Lane carriage sidings; they will mainly be hidden, so that the right most line of the three can join the fiddle yard and allow an ‘infinite’ supply of DMUs. The Metcalfe buildings are just sat there whilst I work out what to do with them. Following the 101 in is 1D83, a parcels service from Warrington and down for a DPU (possibly a 127). Anyway, the locals were all surprised to find another 25 come in on a pair of GUVs. Still, there’s no way you can get from Crewe to Warrington that quickly, so it must be a coincidence. I’d obviously not read the script right, because the next move should have seen a 47/4 move onto the Holyheads to await the 1D84 Passenger and News from Euston. With only a 45/0 on shed with enough horses, that would have to do. The news & pass arrived behind a class 85, which after uncoupling awaits the passing of an 03 before moving away. The 03 will couple on to the rear of the train and detach a BG. With the 85 sorted on to the stabling point, the 45/0 backed down onto the train. It is booked 16 minutes here, presumably for unloading the papers (which must be London editions? The Manchester editions come in at 02.16). No sooner had the 45 hooked on when station pilot 08489 passes by with a rake of GUVs for loading in platform 4. At the other end of the station we see the two shunters waiting their next move. Doubtless their drivers are making use of the all night cafe that I need to build in one of those arches. With 1D84 away at 00.51, the 03 sets its BG back to White Lane, before returning to Christleton Bluebeck depot. As it passes down the holding road a blue 47 hammers through the centre line on 4E86 from Holyhead to Stratford. Some freightliners change traction here and this one may do too in the future to help balance locos! Alongside the 03 to the left you can just make out a 31 and 25 on the fuel depot. The 31 moved down earlier and will shunt across to P4 to take the GUVs brought in by the jocko. That will be the 3D11 to Bangor at 01.10. It quietens off for a bit now, until the morning trains start picking up 49 minutes later! Think I’ll go see if they’re doing butties in the cafe yet.

I can’t work out if there’s any differentiation between Sprinters and Pacers, although as the early Sprinters were 150s, maybe they didn’t actually need to. It’s possible SP came in the 1987 WTTs with the introduction of the 155s and 156s. I think this is the last WTT where the new generation units were only replacing other DMUs. From late 86 the unthinkable started to happen. So we will remain time locked blissfully unaware of the future. At a station that doesn’t exist, on a line that wasn’t electrified, next to a brewery that appears to brew some pretty fine ales!

Here’s the explanation of references at the front of the WTT: Interestingly there is no reference to Pacers or Sprinters, but it is the May 86 to May 87 timetable and they were certainly beginning to make inroads by then.