Lecorbusier

I still reduce everything to less than 800 px wide, which was what the limit on this board always used to be. Is that no longer the case?

Nope ...

Attach Files window says .... You can upload up to Unlimited of files (Max. single file size: 32MB)

eg..

Well, that's my stint on rolling stock done for the time being. 

My third 16T, a variation on a theme.

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I'm really pleased with what I've managed to get finished! However I've not a layout to grass!

 

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9793 passes Cwm Prysor with the 5.45am Bala-Trawsfynydd Class K. As can be seen, other than the 16T with domestic coal, the train is comprised of wagons for the building of Trawsfynydd Nuclear Power Station.

Excellent modelling Tom,

Just discovered this thread following your helpful comment on lamp irons etc ... have really enjoyed getting up to speed.

Cheers.

These are both Ks.

 

Lovely as usual ... but I always have a slight bug bear with your postings - the images you post are always quite low res so when clicked upon they hardly enlarge at all. Such a shame as it would be great to zoom in and really appreciate the excellence of both the modelling and the detail.

Not a criticism ... more of a plea  

I would have thought the cloisters myself.

 

 

Anyway on a lightly more serious note can I make an appeal for some help. I am getting on nicely with my Midland 2-4-0 a Johnson loco in Deeley condition with roundtop boiler from a shedmaster (Now Laurie Griffin) kit. I've got a lot of footplate details on this week but have come to a bit of a halt due to lack of certain castings that are now en route from the UK. So today I could procrastinate no longer and made a start on assembling the boiler backhead. I have the aid of some lovely photos of cab interiors in my Jenkinson and Essery books and over the course of 2 hours today I sorted out all the assorted, and beautiful, lost wax brass castings and got the backhead trial assembled with various pieces of brass and copper wire soldered into various places. I'm going to paint the actual backhead black tonight (I'm also putting gloss black on some kitchen cupboard hinges at the same time) but could do with a decent reference colour photo of an Edwardian loco backhead. I'm aware that some pipes would be copper and that some fittings would be painted and some would be brass, but would be very grateful if anyone could post me a colour photo that I could use as reference. Obviously the ideal would be of 156 that's at Butterley but any loco from that era would be fine.

 

 

Yours in hope and expectation.

 

 

Jamie

Any Good?

Agreed, also with Andy; sadly though, this British Disease has also returned to the classic car movement. 

 

It is no longer the preserve of people who spend their weekends in draughty garages restoring a car from their youth, with the full expectation that spending £3000 on renovation will increase the car's value by no more than £1000.  They restore these cars for their own enjoyment.  The 1980s are no repeating themselves (many of those economic "expert" commentators who insist it's different this time are too young to remember it) and old cars have become just another asset class to be inflated.

 

I find it very sad that people would buy models, never to even admire them on a diorama, let alone run them.  They know the price of everything and the value of nothing.

Recently rebuilt the engine on my 1971 VW Bus .... moving on to the interior now .... couldn't give a monkeys what its re-sale value is (apart for insurance purposes) - but then I like kit building trains and rolling stock ... QED!

Having had a few years out after getting burnt out building https://www.island-publishing.co.uk/son%20of%20card_challenge_07.htm against an exhibition deadline (and not getting it satisfactorily finshed) may well have another go at brass. I did get the scratch built traverser done for Pebbles End with everything parallel so I've more confidence now than when I did the railbus. The just started shunting plank will need some bespoke items not available r-t-r long-term and I've got my mojo back currently. Will look at those S Eastern kits.

Just in case you are not familiar with Tony's videos I will link here again ... apologies if this is all familiar to you - I still re-watch them.

Sadly Tony what you describe is what I see as  british disease.  I have bought x for so much and it must now be worth more.

 

This is most prevalent with property purchases.. how much did you buy it for?  How much did you spend? What is it worth now? syndrome.

 

This has moved on to our models.  You can almost hear the Antiques Roadshow critique - "What as shame it is no longer in original condition."

Its odd isn't it .... because we will happily buy a car and write off exorbitant sums of money!

Reason for my post (and I got torn to bits for saying this on the old forum) is that the improved RTR stuff is to the detriment of mid-range have a go modelling. As an example we've lost all the half-way house Wills body kits to go onto r-t-r chassis, that got people moving beyond first base, taught painting etc. I regularly draw a parallel with soccer, as I see it the loss of things like the old-style Wills kits, combined with improved r-t-p scenics and r-t-r stock, has wiped out much of the middle ground. It's rather like as if in soccer Sunday league is still popular for low-skill players but all the divisions beyond say County leagues and the lowest EFL (Div 2 as now called/Div 4 as was) have gone so better than average but not brilliantly skilled players would have no progression as not good enough for the top four leagues. Top skilled modellers, and Tony is one, still exist but the steadily opening void between them and beginners is lower down. The progression from beginner to expert has become more difficult as, from my perspective, the kits etc., which twenty years ago existed, targetted at the improving beginner/mid-skilled modeller have gone. The clamour for better accuracy killed them off.

 

As a recent kit builder with limited experience I think basic 0-6-0 tender and tank engines with inside motion still offer this. My entry was an old DJH Barney kit ... re-made 3 times. DJH and South Eastern still produce such kits. Simple rigid chassis construction as demonstrated on Tony's Right Track videos demystifies the process of this element. Given that these two manufacturers produce very accurate and well thought out kits .. you could argue that they are simpler than earlier offerings to build. Just a personal observation ... but then I have no idea where I would stand in the league football analogy.

What I do think is a great help is to have a friendly mentor or failing that (my situation) a friendly virtual mentor via a DVD/Video/Youtube.

Basic question ..... does anyone know if it is possible to neutralise blackening fluid insitu on nickel silver already installed on the layout (point rodding) .... if so how without damaging stuff around?

Similar to JW, I spray them white (Halfords) before touching up with white enamel.  I then give the lamps a coat of Klear, before a final grubby wash just to tone them down tad.

 

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Are they removable or permanent ... if removable - by what attachment method?

Lovely photo and lovely modelling by the way.

It was absolutely with reference to soldering (relating to the Gibson 4F build) and the danger of blunting the cutters when trimming ... perfectly valid comment if you are not looking for magnetic interchangeable lamps.

 

But magnetic modelu lamps have peaked    PIQUED .... PIQUED ..... PIQUED ....PIQUED .... PIQUED .... PIQUED.... PIQUED.... PIQUED.... PIQUED.... PIQUED.... PIQUED.... PIQUED.... PIQUED.... PIQUED.... PIQUED.... PIQUED.... PIQUED.... PIQUED.... PIQUED.... PIQUED.... ( 20 times) .....my interest somewhat. 

I know I shouldn't, I said I wouldn't, but I can't help myself, so apologies in advance!!

If you had got really excited it could have even piqued your interest.

 

Mike.

              .....   

I think it was more with reference to fitting lamp irons to kit-built, metal locomotives. Steel is much more difficult to solder, and to cut. 

 

It was absolutely with reference to soldering (relating to the Gibson 4F build) and the danger of blunting the cutters when trimming ... perfectly valid comment if you are not looking for magnetic interchangeable lamps.

But magnetic modelu lamps has peaked piqued my interest somewhat. 

Make new ones from office staples. Then you can use lamps with micromagnets embedded in them so that they can be moved around easily. That will keep Sir off your back.

Sounds interesting .... any chance of a photo(s) of your system?

In Tony's Right Track video he says '.... there's nothing more useless than steel staples for lamp irons .... I make my own from etch offcuts!'

A way to easily attach and detach modelu lamps during a running session is rather an attractive proposition.

I think, with respect to all, it's best to draw a line underneath the whole thing now - at least on this thread. 

 

Amen !   

'Established' modellers are not 'beginners' and don't really need to be enthused to get started in the hobby. They need some guidance and from the list of specific demonstration list I would have thought many of those would be more ideal in trying to encourage creative modelling and explaining specific skills and techniques. From what I know and experience of Jerry's 2mm demo stand, Tony's clinic and the DEMU society demo stand they would certainly fit the bill for those 'established' modellers in advising and helping take them to a higher level.

 

G

I wonder how many of the 'established modellers' encompassed by this are members of a local club, rather than being simply forum members with a nostalgia for both steam and childhood memories of playing trains. I have no idea and am not implying either many or few.

However, if the answer  was few .... then i would suggest that the local club would be a very good route of getting established modellers into other and different creative aspects of the hobby. Casual conversations amongst friends and acquaintances will demystify much and certainty of help would perhaps lead to some having a go? So marketing of local clubs at shows?

If the answer is many .... then this suggests that many clubs either don't promote modelling of this kind/do not have the skill base .... or there is no appetite for it. If this is the case ... then developing such an appetite would need some sort of outreach from the loco kit building fraternity via talks, demos etc - I suspect there would be little appetite amongst this fraternity to embark on such a strategy (such modellers I think would prefer to be invited and even then might decline - after all it is a hobby not a religion!). Good quality shows and magazine articles showing what can be achieved are therefore perhaps where we are at? People are then free to go down which ever route they choose.

 

........ But how do you enthuse them to get started? 

Not convinced shows are the place for this. I came to it with very little prior knowledge through the internet. Clubs are the other obvious place .... maybe having more marketing etc for local clubs might be an approach?

To put the case for the kit ... from the perspective of one who is hopefully not going to drop off his perch for a good 30 - 35 years!

Firstly if you model a line or era which is poorly served by RTR, you are going to have to kit or scratch build anyway  .... and as the current train spotting generation works its way through, the massive emphasis on 1930s - 60s I suspect will drop off.

Secondly, if you decide to model to EM or P4 standards (not to mention the myriad of options in other scales) then if you go RTR you are still going to have to buy Wheels/Chassis/Gearbox combos (before any detailing alterations) ... so the cost comparison is not so out of kilter.

I think you will always have a section of the hobby who will be more interested in the building/craftsmanship/making side of things .... it may settle back a touch, but i don't think it is a dying art.

3d printing will I suspect have a massive impact upon both kits and the RTR market.

I refuse to be all doom and gloom.

In P4 at least what we now have available and where things are going all look pretty healthy .... though I accept P4 is a pretty niche market compared to the over all hobby.

 

The hobby is becoming more RTR-dominated (and not just in OO).

More folk seem to moan today (through social media?) about such and such a loco/carriage/wagon not being available RTR, yet don't seem prepared to make/modify it for themselves; because they can't/won't, or can't afford others to do the things for them. Many of the sternest moaners are anonymous. 

There's been a dropping off in folk actually making things (cause and effect?).

It just goes to show how supply and demand can effect things I suppose.  The explosion in the sheer range and quality of RTR over the last 20 years has been extraordinary. This means that people can achieve much finer layouts out of the box than ever used to be the case. Given this i can understand how ones hopes and expectations might rise and so complaints will arise for those things not commercially available ... particularly where absolute fidelity to a specific loco/coach/wagon at a specific point in time is not the aim. I can also see that many will be seduced into finer scale modelling with no will or wish to roll up sleeves and get hands dirty so to speak ... or perhaps there interest lies in scenic modelling or some other aspect.

If there was a way to measure, I would be fascinated to know what relative numbers in the hobby are now compared to say the mid 1990s. Perhaps the RTR box openers are a new comtemporary subset of the hobby in addition to what went before rather than instead of?

 

 

He also told me how Iain Rice had picked him up for suggesting (in an editorial) that model railways should be fun. 'No, it's a very serious hobby' was the comment.

Sorry ... the day it stops being fun and becomes work, I'm off. Fun and serious I don't think are mutually exclusive. 

Thanks Colin,

 

Definitely not me. Though I'm puzzled how anyone could believe that I 'do' Facebook.

 

Regards,

 

Tony.  

Your alter ego perhaps? .... Jekyll and Hyde and all that - Its a nice thought experiment 

Small ... yes .... Insignificant ...hmmmm! Love the picture frame top right.

There are a fair few photos of the station concourse itself from the 70s in the studies library (part of this set - see below) ... I could get some copies if they are of any use? I haven't done so to date as they are primarily internal.

T

Any Help?

It's one thing to poke the fire but please remind yourself about who lit the fire.

And lets be honest with ourselves, the fire was lit with the clear intention that it would be poked. That was it's sole purpose.

A polemic?

A polemic (/pəˈlɛmɪk/) is contentious rhetoric that is intended to support a specific position by aggressive claims and undermining of the opposing position. Polemics are mostly seen in arguments about controversial topics. The practice of such argumentation is called polemics. A person who often writes polemics, or who speaks polemically, is called a polemicist.^[1] The word is derived from Ancient Greek πολεμικός (polemikos), meaning 'warlike, hostile',^[1][2] from πόλεμος (polemos), meaning 'war'.^[3]

Polemics often concern issues in religion or politics. A polemic style of writing was common in Ancient Greece, as in the writings of the historian Polybius. Polemic again became common in medieval and early modern times. Since then, famous polemicists have included the satirist Jonathan Swift, Christian anarchist Leo Tolstoy, the socialist philosophers Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels, the novelist George Orwell, the psycholinguist Noam Chomsky, the social critic Christopher Hitchens, the existential philosopher Søren Kierkegaard, and Friedrich Nietzsche, author of On the Genealogy of Morality: A Polemic.

 - but the respondents appear to enjoy their approach to modelling, in its widest sense, and for that I would hesitate to pass too much criticism on them, but then I am of a generation that did not grow up expecting  the world to share my expressed opinion.

I suspect it is more to do with communication methods than it is generational or specific to a given strata of people. In the past people were happy to be extreme/rude (irate of Tonbridge Wells) when hiding behind the screen of a letter ....where there was no personal contact. Equally things can get quite judgemental within private groups where there is a consensus of opinion - though here the object of ire is rarely aware of the attack. However, face to face or to some extent through the direct contact of the telephone a more tolerant/conciliatory atmosphere generally prevails. One first tries to understand rather than immediately jump to defence.

I would argue that this began to change with the advent of email - people started making impulsive and more extreme responses that would certainly have required a girding of the loins and a deep breath if done face to face .... effectively hiding behind the keyboard. We have a rule in our office that any strongly worded e-mail response has to be read by at least one other professional and should not be sent for 24 hours (a cooling off period).

Forums have exacerbated this situation as comments can be passed in both anonymity and with no danger of ever having to meet the person. Add into this mix the disingenuous and the trolls and you have a volatile environment. Furthermore, the method of communication is very two dimensional meaning the subtleties of inflection and irony can be easily lost - it is open to misinterpretation and indeed misrepresentation. To some extent the development of Imojis is an attempt to address this.

For all their limitations and problems I am still a fan of forums as they allow a connection and method of communication that can be very fulfilling and create links that would otherwise never exist. I suppose, as with all things, they are what you choose to make of them.

Presumably one is entitled to one's own opinion and free to express it (even be commissioned to express it  ). Equally, every listener and or reader is free to disagree and express their opinion as to why.

Otherwise life would be so boring