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I agree, and it's those modellers who need something simple to guide them into greater knowledge, rather than expecting them to pick up every little nuance of the prototype from the word go. Once they grasp that then they can take it further if they want without feeling they are continually being judged. After all, it is but a hobby which we do for our enjoyment and we can take signalling, or any aspect of what we model, as far as we like. For some it's signalling, others it's locomotives, others it's landscape. The hobby is a broad church! Roja

Which is why, in the real world, there is route training for drivers who need the knowledge before they are passed for that route! For the majority of modellers, the traffic light anology works, after all, how many layouts have you seen at exhibitions where a train has passed a red signal and you've shook your head at such a transgression. The majority of modellers are hobbyists who can take it to whatever level they like, and concepts such as in advance and to the rear are confusing to someone new to the hobby who wants to signal a junction or whatever. Most of us don't have the space to correctly site signals, much as I, for one, would like; what we model is a snapshot of just a small area. For those who want to model a specific location signal diagrams are available and there is no excuse for getting it wrong. Yes, if you want to go down the full knowledge of signalling route that's fine, but a lot of modellers don't have the time, or even the inclination, to study the subject to the depth it deserves, they just want something that says "here you need signal A, here you need signal B" Roja

For us mere mortals with only limited space for our model railways, signalling can be simplified, no need for in advance or to the rear! Red means stop, yellow slow down and keep your eyes peeled and green carry on lad! Roja

Hi, I'm following this thread with considerable interest, mainly to see how you you resolve various issues! Regarding the storage yard and putting stock on them, I had a different, although somewhat similar issue with an N gauge layout I'm building for the Hull show next month. I haven't the space for a large number of loops so what I came up with is a mix of loops and cassettes. There are 2 complete loops and 2 loops with cassettes in them. This means that not only can trains be removed and changed quickly, if the stock is stored in the cassettes then there isn't a problem with getting it onto, and off, the rails! As an alternative, perhaps a short siding, minus the buffer stop, could be used in the storage area and cassettes attached to this. Roja

I'm not a signalling engineer, just a moderately skilled and knowledgeable modeller. I read up on signalling matters, both online and in books, and yes, at first glance it looks confusing but with a bit of time it makes sense! Photographs of real locations can help, as can visiting actual locations and knowing the traffic flows, but the basics are there to provide the safe operation of the railway and as such can be applied, and as knowledge increases then more finesse can be brought to the model! I don't find the terms unambiguous at all. They make sense and wouldn't have been used by generation of signallers if they didn't! Trying to change them now would only confuse the issue further, as people are finding out. If you think this is confusing then don't even try quantum physics! Now wave particle duality, to name but one small part can really make your head spin! Roja

Hi, why worry about the signals? They are part of the whole railway scene!

Hi, like the technique, makes it so simple! However, instead of using gravel I will be using sifted chinchilla dust! I am disabled and gravel is a bit scarce near me, but my local pet shop sells 1.5kg bags of the stuff, ideal for ballasting (depending on the area modelled and time period) and scenic work!

Ah, the curse of the camera! At least it was an easy fix!

Has the Sentinel being doing some enthusiastic shunting? The body is a bit skew-whiff!

I'm thinking of using the finer size as a base layer followed by a thin layer of slightly larger grains. A little experimentation will be in order I think.

Hi, have you thought about using chinchilla dust? It's cheap to buy and can be sieved to get grains of varying size from very fine to coarse. I'm going to use it on an N gauge layout I'm currently working on.

Hi, this is one of those subjects which, on the face of it, looks simple but there's actually a lot more to it. The 08's were designed to do a specific job, ie shunting. Although they only have a 350hp engine they develop 35000lb tractive effort, compared to a 67 which has a 3200hp engine but develops only 31,770lbs tractive effort, and this is down to the gearing used, hence the 08's low speed. Given good rail conditions a load of 1000 tons is well within the capabilities of an 08. If the gearing was changed on an 08 it could be made to do 60mph without any problem but it would be useless as a shunter. Although other locomotives, such as 20's, 37's, 60's etc are used as super-shunters it's not really good practise as they are not geared for such work. Prolonged high power outputs at low speeds with heavy loads can lead to a variety of faults, such as generator flashovers and increased maintenance costs, which is why such locos are used only when the situation calls for it. Foster Yeoman went for an American shunter since there simply was no suitable British locomotive capable of doing the job and at a reasonable cost. So, it boils down to personal choice. Go for whichever option you like. And you could always go down the cl13 route! Regards, Roja

My pet beef about double standards is some of the 2fs fraternity going on about the accuracy of the scale\gauge then running re-wheeled N gauge stock! Roja

Hi, I received a post from your friend Clive yesterday evening. He suggested you might be able to do a diagram showing the position of the masts and wiring runs for me, so, if you are willing, I'm attaching two thumbnails of the layout, showing just the electrified lines and relevant details. Thanks in advance, Roja

Hi Paul, I chickened out with the fronts and asked for the rebuilt versions with the wrap around windows replaced by a flat window and metal panel. He did ask which version I wanted, but I thought trying to get the correct curve in whatever glazing material I chose would be a task too far! So maybe he's found a way of doing them. Regards, Roja

Hi Ian I've had a fascination with the Glasgow suburban lines ever since Ian Futers published a feature on the Cathcart Circle in Railway Modeller many moons ago. The question of the 303 vexed me for some time. I considered scratch-building, conversions, resin casting and 3d printing but in the end I contacted Allen Doherty at Worsley Works and commissioned an etched brass kit. Each kit comprises sides, with separately fitted recessed doors, ends and underframe. Etched brass bogies for the LNER-type 8ft and 8ft 6in are available from Ultima Models, whitemetal 8ft from BH Enterprise. I'm sourcing the power, roofs and interiors. When I have a few minutes I'll photograph the one currently waiting for a power bogie. I also think I may start a new thread about the layout. It's called St Mungo's, and is a 'what might have been' link between Mount Pleasant and Queen Street (High Level) via Dalmarnock, Duke Street and Springburn. If it had been built it would have been a very useful diversionary route. Regards, Roja

Hi Clive, I've followed your threads on ole and find them enlightening and clear! The period modelled is 1968-72, so mk1, assuming the line was electrified in the early 1960's. A sketch of the wire runs would be great appreciated! All modelling is a compromise so I'm aware that the mast positions around the curves would be closer than prototype; in the case of the exit onto the mainline the curves through 2 of the turnouts is 9", which is not a problem as trains would only enter/exit the loop at low speed. I'll draw Titan another plan, with just the electrified lines, noting the radii of the various curves.

I'm finding it's not as simple as some would have you believe! I've got a copy of a book about the Cathcart Circle coming so I'm hoping there are some photos in there that will help. I've used the Dapol N gauge masts on a previous layout. They looked the part, but I found them a bit fragile when I modified them to have two register arms per post in the terminal station. I used the posts that had the arms removed as the terminal posts, complete with a representation of the tension weights.

Hi, thanks for the info! Looks like I'm going to have some fun sorting the position of each pull on/pull off arm! At the moment it looks like I'll be using portals over the right-hand end with single masts through the station and loop to the double junction. I wont be wiring the overhead as I think it can be grossly over-scale in N, but I'd like to get the infrastructure right. Then again, if I can find something fine enough.., though with a nominal scale diameter of 0.2mm or thereabouts, I don't hold out much hope! Then there's the problem of maintenance etc. Anyway, looking forwards to any more info you can find. Thanks.

Hi Titan, should have thought of that! This is a rough plan of St Mungo's. the mainline, loop and branch (at right) have ohle, the coal rees and bottling plant accessible by diesel only. You will note that access to the loop at the station end is via 2 single slips, whilst at the opposite its via turnouts and a diamond crossing. It was going to by a curved single slip but I took the easy option! As an aside, the track is all hand-built using wooden sleepers and brass pins with only one, or 2, pcb sleepers in turnouts to make wiring easy! I hope this has worked, my first attempt at this, only joined yesterday!

I'm hoping some-one here can answer this query. I'm currently building an N gauge layout based on a 'what might have been' line linking the Cathcart Circle through Glasgow to Queen Street High Level with ohle so I can run cl303 emus. I've seen the postings by Clive Mortimer, and very useful they've been, but, as I have a double junction and a passing loop, I want to know the arrangement of the register arms in these locations, both for single post and portals, over the point work, all lines being electrified.