C126

I agree "economic devastation" is an emotive term, and which should be defined, but without having access to detailed economic web-sites to which to link, may I start with 'increasing health and wealth inequalities', caused by Osborne's austerity.  I would suggest, from partial memories of articles in Private Eye primarily, this was caused by an under-regulated financial network imploding.  The consequences for the majority of the population, coupled with an inept governing elite who under-performed after this global financial crash compared to other equivalent nations, has been pretty 'devastating', when incomes have stagnated at best (mine in the public sector has decreased by 25% in real terms), and things have not improved with Brexit and Covid.

Yes, we all have the opium now of colour televisions, buying tat on the internet, etc., compared to the 1930's, but compared to other nations, I think things could be much better for the U.K. population.  Sorry I do not have the time (or ability!) to write a cogent definition, but perhaps someone else can supplement this concept with other suggestions and evidence.  My point I was trying to make was, more than one certain party can mess up the economy, and it is not just govt.  Other agencies conribute to the mess, but the tax-payer usually foots the bill.

As to 'where to get the money', I would suggest expanding the fiscal net: again banks, multi-nationals, monopoly public suppliers, and many others, have had their taxes reduced over the years.  At least I think this is the case, if I remember Private Eye correctly.  🙂

Well, let us wait and see.  The point I was trying to make was not only one party's economic policies can reduce the economy to its knees, as I hope has been demonstrated recently.  Thanks.

4 minutes ago, lmsforever said:

This statement by Labour is par for the course to those of us who have lived through the governments they have formed all that happens is,  the country is ruined,the TUC seem to be in charge, foreign policy stops  and overall the Tories have a hell of a job to get the UK  back to a decent state  .Forget any  new works on rail and the south will be forgoten  as  all new works will be in the north of the UK ,as thats were the supporters are its always the same believe me.  So get yourselves ready for a very hard time  and a country run by a bunch of idiots.

I appreciate we are all getting a little over-heated in this thread, but you are not serious about the above, are you?  Have you lived through the last sixteen years of economic devastation for the majority?  I do not think it was the Labour party responsible for the economic policies and their consequences during all that time...

A solution I have rarely seen to the (self-imposed) ideological 'problem' of keeping govt debt below forty per cent. of G.D.P. is by using a 'Statutory Company' to keep the borrowing off the public-sector balance sheets.  This company can then borrow on the open market.  Or is this too simple?

Sorry to bump this thread so crudely, but is there any news on the date of @Karhedron 's Wild Swan book's publication, please?

16 minutes ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

... any actions that would penalise competing modes (basically road), would be anti-competitive, illegal and open to challenge.

As an ideological fool, can I just ask why a suitably composed law can not prohibit challenges?  If a theoretical govt wished to make freight go on a monopolistic railway (and was able to pass a law thus - a big caveat), why can it not pass a law to do this?  Sorry to open a can of worms, but I have often wondered why govts are made out to be impotent with things like this.  Thanks.

One dialled your exchange operator, and said, "I would like to place a Trunk Call to [X] exchange, number [1234]."  Last used at my hospital switch-board in the 1990's, which caused much reminiscence with the operator.  It was only a call to another library, so not urgent.

Did they ever carry the T.O.P.S. code "VFV" as described by Colin Marsden in his Rolling Stock Recognition book on wagons, please?  I can find no trace of this on @hmrspaul 's photo web-site.

16 minutes ago, Wickham Green too said:

Unfortunately the title that's obvious to YOU might not contain the key words someone ELSE thinks obvious ...... truck / wagon, carriage / coach  or locomotive / engine frinstance !

I quite agree - the Librarian's nightmare.  We need someone to compose an 'Authority File'!  😀  Just look at the disparate 'tags' for pictures on Flikr, for example, for the same subjects.  O well, I will keep the thread here, and watch the cobwebs grow on it...

I agree an Index would be useful.  I was thinking readers could do a search on the RMweb web-site 'search box', which would detect the key-words.

E.g., the photos and P.D.F.s of the 'hot core' PXX wagon come up on a search, but without a thread related to the subject of each file, I thought a 'dump' like this might work.  Bother.

I thought it might be useful to have a 'library' for RMweb of all those random P.D.F. files people might find of interest.

If you have a scan of something you think others might need, please post here with a suitable description in the message, so others can locate it with a quick subject key-word search.

Let me start it with a brochure for B.R. (or BR) staff about their new uniforms from April 1968, called "Your new uniform".  Hope this is of interest to all.  Best wishes.

Your new uniform 1966.pdf

10 hours ago, Rivercider said:

Have the freight propelled in to the depot from the local yard which is just off-scene 'up the line'. You might, or might not, need a brake van at the front of the propelling move depending on local circumstances as shown in the Sectional Appendix.

In the Bristol area in the 1980s freight traffic was propelled from Lawrence Hill yard along the freight only Avonside Branch for about a mile to Avonside Wharf, there being no run-round facilities at Avonside. Also in Avonmouth the Rowntrees warehouse at Avonmouth was served by a trip working that then propelled back (right line) for about two miles to Hallen Marsh due to the track layout at Avonmouth. Both moves required a brake van at the front of the movement in which shunters and guard rode as they both crossed gated road crossings.

 

cheers  

Thanks, @Rivercider .  This sounds good, and an excuse to have a rare brake-van.  There is a picture in one of Paul Shannon's books, I think, perhaps of this branch, with the shunter and guard leaning indolently on the back of the brake-van's verandah, 'watching the world go by'.  Their poses looked perfect for whether arriving or departing.  Look forward to seeing how the speed controls work/look.  Best wishes.

Just a quick note to say, for those of us who have not seen every episode of The Sweeney, it is starting again on I.T.V. 4, Monday, 22d April:

https://www.radiotimes.com/programme/b-fyec17/the-sweeney/

Queenstown Road Battersea station makes an appearance, I believe...  This is part of the 'eternal loop' alternating with The Professionals.

Just one thought: won't it look a little strange the Freights being propelled such a long way out 'off stage' upon departure?  Ditto, any loco-hauled peak-time service E.C.S.

Sorry to ask a daft question, but please could there be a way of storing P.D.F.s in one's 'Gallery' (or another suitable tool)?  It would be useful - I thought - to save scans of old documents thus, which takes less space than photos I assume.  Thanks.

19 hours ago, melmerby said:

On a curry nights they could serve the chicken tikka masala to the smell of recycled ghee from the local curry house in the firebox.

Put me down for that one, please!!

Just for completeness's sake, the number is 01182302227, and is cited, e.g., thus:

https://who-called.co.uk/Number/01182302227

I have discovered my Panasonic KX-TGB610EB 'phone has a call-blocking function, if I can work out how to use it...

<Sharp intake of breath.>  Note you have only half the no. of platforms now.  Might a relocation of the station be called for, or a 'change in time' to a more run-down era of B.R. (S)?

Gosh, was it really three years ago we had the discussions about this?!  So sorry for your changing circumstances, but glad to see you are using the opportunity to make something new.  Your example inspired me to type up a couple of Working Time Table pages eventually for my layout (still unfinished).

Any chance you could post the missing photos on this thread as a record, if it would not be too emotionally taxing, please?  I always liked your 'split station' layout, and was envious of the idea.

Having rummaged through the copies I could find of the B.R.B.’s Annual Report and Accounts, the total tonnage (MT) per year is as follows:

1972       168.842

1973       195.82

1974       176.3

1975       174.729

1976       176.209

1977       170.355

1978       170.507

[Gap in reports.]

1984/85    96.8

1985/86    139.7

1986/87    138.4

For those whose eyes are not yet bleeding from boredom, I thought I would try to describe the figures cited under ‘Statistics [col.] 5B’ of each report (figs are thousand-tonnes):

1973.

Train-load and wagon-load:

i) Coal & Coke                       99,415

ii) Iron & Steel                     34,950

iii) Other train-/wagon-load     52,155

                     Sub-total       186,520

[(iv)] +Other (estimated)        7,400

[(v)]                           TOTAL 193,920

However, in 1974’s report, 1973’s total is ‘revised’, listed for comparison as 195,820 KT.  Item (iv) (my appellation) appears to be an annual ‘corrected estimate’, but ceased after a few years (perhaps a reflection of the efficiency of TOPS).

(iii) lumps together COY block-trains and wagon-load/Speedlink, alas.  It would have been interesting to have figures for each sector, presumably unavailable till ‘Sectorization’ in the late ’80’s.

Anyway, this has decided me on the W.T.T.s for Oct. ’73–May ’74 and Oct. ’85–May ’86.  Thank you all for your contributions and interest; it is much appreciated.

38 minutes ago, ejstubbs said:

 

This was likely an autodialled call.  ...

 

Many thanks for this, @ejstubbs .  I had wondered about the details of these things.  Strangely, our cheapo telephone hand-set used to display the incoming line nos., but now says (usually) only "Incoming call", even if the person is in the programmed 'directory' on the 'phone.  (Yet it did display that 'silent call'!)  Keep meaning to 'surf the web' with the model no. (I think it is a Binatone) and see if this is a reecognised fault, or just B.T. trying to get more money from us by increasing our sub. to a 'call blocker' rate.

Had one of these calls Saturday, which was dead and then rang off when I answered.  The Bristol number (I do not have it with me, alas) is listed as a fraud site on the www.  I enjoy repeating, "From where did you get this number?" repeatedly until "Jo" terminates the call in despair.  What a way to earn a living...

@Covkid Memoirs, please! 😀

If I remember correctly, the Coal Network came about not only owing to the bean-counters' demand for greater control of costs (instead of sharing!), but because the Speedlink routes were less convenient to the domestic coal depots.  Hence centering on Didcot Yard for the south-east.  But an accountant can make anything appear 'un-economic' if desired...

20 hours ago, Rivercider said:

I don't have any WR WTTs for 1973/74, but I do have some for 1976/77. Back then there was a Mandatory WTT and a Conditional WTT for each Division. Quite a few of the Conditional freight trains did run each day, though others were more by customer request or traffic demand.

The WR London Division Mandatory WTT is PA, you would also need the London Division Conditional WTT PF which contains some of the freight workings.

 

One observation. By 1987/88 Acton Yard had more or less ceased to deal with wagon load traffic, (it never became a proper part of the Speedlink Network), but was then used as a hub principally for aggregate traffic from the Mendips,

 

cheers

Many thanks, @Rivercider .  Michael Rhodes (Illustrated history of Britsh marshalling yards ) quotes Acton Yard closing to Speedlink traffic from 1984 onwards.  Also, I must take into account the launch of the Discrete Coal Network (was this an official name?) in 1987, so I think I will bring the year forward to October '86-May '87, to include more trains.

It occurred to me to read the B.R. Annual Reports!  I hope they will list freight traffic by sector, and I can base my choice on something based on evidence.  A bit dull-witted of me not to think of this before...

@stivesnick Many thanks for this gen.; much appreciated.  I thought the October-May time tables would be best, as more traffic would run through the autumn-spring, rather than a slacker summer.  But I could be wrong.

So far I have:

OCT '73-MAY '74.

Southern = M (Mand.), N (Cond.).

London Midland = A & B (Cond.), and also J? T?

Eastern = A (Mand.), K (Cond.).

Western = PA (Mand.), PF (Cond.).

OCT '87-MAY '88.

Southern = WE.

London Midland = CC? CR, CS, CW?

Eastern = LD, YH.

Western = PD.

I realise I ought to 'define my terms' in listing the inter-regional yards to be plotted.  More to post later...

Thanks again and all good wishes.