Hull Paragon
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Posts posted by Hull Paragon
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I decided to do the tender body before I finished the brakes etc.........the process is much quicker than that of late; it is good to see something taking shape.
There was one moment when I had to stop and wonder what to do. Two parts needed to be fitted without any tabs....I had to set it up myself for goodness sake!! I also realised that the footplate I had built earlier and the footplate for this stage were different....
Here is the (new) footplate with interior bits and pieces attached
And as the instructions suggest, a test fit with the front plate.......
I actually have to go into work tomorrow so I'll try to get more done on Friday. I have pre cut the parts I need from the main fret....the hinges for the doors which are next are sort of N gauge size so I'll get my magnifying glass out!
Ray
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Hi Ray,
Having built a couple of Dave’s MOK kits, I can appreciate your frustration with the instruction manual:-) on the whole though they were pretty comprehensive and well detailed.
I’m enjoying your build and look forward to keeping up with your updates on your build. I’m considering starting my 9f to keep me out of mischief for some time :-)
I was interested in the little hand tool you use to assist with cleaning up the castings. I have seen similar, but could you tell us the name of the one you are using please?
Thanks, Richard
Hello Richard
The strange thing is that the instructions are so good it is an even bigger pain than usual when something is missing......what I mean is, that with most kits, the instructions are so bad that something missing doesn't matter that much as you are almost scratchbuilding anyway....the MOk kit is so comprehensive that when there is a gap it feels like a chasm! (Hope that makes sense)
I haven't communicated any of my findings with Dave Sharp (he knows I am doing the thread) but I will bring him up to date with my findings.....
I don't know the name of the tool but I got it from Squires....it's a sort of helping hands and very useful for working on round or cylindrical objects....you can buy additional pins too.
Ray
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I thought I had added the picture of the brake actuator shaft in position with soop and brake handles attached. I hadn't, so here it is. I have not soldered the rod in place in th ebrake lever yet...this is due to to not quite knowing how long it should be such that it fits when the footpalte if fitted - or when the chassis is fitted to the footplate!....(see below)
I decided to test assemble the footplate, chassis and frames to see how it goes together, and to assess the space available if I fitted it out of order as it were.
The single stay is just another test measurement...it is not fixed yet
I confirmed my thinking that there was not enough space to fit the tender body tags if the frames are done first. You can see the body slot in this shot. If the wheels are fitted....forget it!
There is still the problem of fitting the scoop lever through the stretcher.
Conversely, it is all clear on the other side!
The exercise was worth it though. Obviously, the chassis has to be fixed to the footplate (10BA bolts) and the scoop link assembled through the stretcher which will have to be left to hang loose until the frames go in.
So I will fix the balance weights in position, then do the brakes.with the scoop link last. The frames will have to wait until the body is attached.
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After a short break due to a) Contractors working in the house, b) Decorating after the contractors had finished, and c) A rather heavy birthday celebration that took a whole weekend out!, I am sort of back in business.
The brake actuators and associated bits and pieces went together OK but the pins on the actuator are really easy to bend so care needs to be taken not to break them off.
This fits into the chassis assembly thus:
The brake cylinder neeeded to be cleaned up so I used my useful little hand tool!
The next series of steps have given me some difficulty and hence a lot of thought; not in the work involved, but in the order of assembly.
The instructions as well as being very detailed with the excellent photographs to guide you are also frustratingly lacking at times. The installation of the brake shoes and stretchers is scheduled to follow the above then the scoop assembly. However, there are no pictures of the brakes fitted in the chassis and I can't quite decide if the brake assembly will impede the installation of the scoop. (In fact some of the pictures showing chassis fixtures are taken at different stages in the construction, out of synch with the main body of instructions). This is further compounded by the fact that the instructions then call for stretchers to be screwed to the external frames, (especially as the scoop operating link passes through the stretcher).....but the frames hang loose unsupported by the footplate as does the chassis which can't be screwed to the footplate yet. It is not for another 6 or 7 pages of instructions that the frames and chassis are fitted to the footplate.
I am going to part build the scoop assembly then I might skip straight to the tender body construction so that I can see how the frames can be attached to the footplate with the body attached, with the brakes and scoop assembly fully installed. This is very difficult to show everyone but if anyone (Dibateg?) has experience of this it would be useful to share their knowledge.
In the meantime the scoop actuating lever is made up of a 30mm piece of steel rod with the balance weights and other elements slid on.....(Why this is in so many pieces when the brake actuating lever is a single casting is not clear!).
They all go together like this but please note that as yet I have not fixed everything into position.
Note the stretcher below the chassis assembly....
That's it so far.
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Good luck with it Iain...I can only say that if you haven't done one before you will have a pleasant surprise.
In the meantime, I have now finished the RHS frame, and I have fitted the bearing covers and what MOK call 'S-Nuts' which are tiny plates for soldering to a small shelf on the reverse to thicken the metal......the holes are tapped 14BA for future bolts I assume! I have also added the rivet detail along the top. The axle box looks a bit askew probably due to camera parallax.
Next will be the brake gear fitted to the underframe.
Ray
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Not much more to add.....just a slow stroll through the rest of the LHS side frame. I'll do the final bits and start the RHS tomorrow. I'' leave the guard irons until later as a pound to a penny I'll break them off!
Ray
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Hello Ray -
Back from holiday on an island with no railways...
here is the link to my thread - it might be of help, I'm looking forward to seeing your progress. I don't bother painting mine now ( unless they are plain black ). it's less stressful to get one of the pro's to do it, and they do a far better job than I can.
Regards
Tony
My thanks Tony
I have seen some of your stuff....very impressive! I noticed you rolled the boiler.....I am going to send mine back to MOK for them to do it....I don't have any rollers and I don't want to spend that sort of money for one boiler....on top of which it is nickel silver, and I don't want to make a hash of it. So Dave at MOK said it was better to send it to them.
Ray
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Can't remove thread so I have deleted it.
Ray
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Ray, I watched the school being built and also being demolished, for a short time, our eldest daughter was a pupil.
Attached a picture of the 4MT's little sister passing Springbank North. If you would like more pictures of the area contact me.
Thanks again Mick. I didn't expect this series of posts to become a trip down memory lane, but I am quite enjoying it.
Ray
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Ah yes, that’s one of my locos on the box cover! When I get home I’ll find the link to my build for you Ray.. Although by your progress you probably won’t need it!
Regards
Tony
That's very kind of you Dibateg....thanks.
Hope my effort looks as good as yours....even if I build it properly I will have to make sure my painting skills have been upgraded!
Ray
Ray
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Of 16 pages, I am now on Page 5! I made a start on the footplate by soldering webs on. The tab construction method makes the act of setting up and soldering these a doddle. Note the reminder which is the top side. The other bit is described as a drag beam adjuster. I assume that I will find out what it is used for later on.....
Putting the side frames together.........
Then on to one of my least favourite tasks: cutting castings off sprues and cleaning them up. I'm sure there is a good technical reason why the joins are so heavy........
The axle boxes and springs are built up from 6 components as below:
The axle box locates in a hole but is free to spin. The spring assembly is pinned through the securing brackets but the brackets are free to move. I thought for a while before I soldered anything and finally decided to drill a couple of 0.8mm holes in a wooden block and pin the pieces on that. The saw blade lifts the spring to keep i parallel to the surface as well as forcing the brackets to line up square.
After a bit of faffing, thinking and testing, the end result looks like this. I'm not displeased with it!
Ray
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Hi Ray,
If your price is right, the Acme one would be a good kit for an experienced builder who's budget doesn't run to the MOK kit. It can be made into a decent model, but it has many challenges. These are not the best of images, but it shows what can be done.
Cheers,
Peter
Peter
Looks pretty good to me. The problem is always getting the lighting right when photgraphing models....I wonder if a polaroid filter would tone such images down.
Ray
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Ray, here's a c1965 picture of a 4MT, taken from the window of Springbank North signalbox, I have many other pictures of the signalbox etc, my late father worked the last shift Saturday 4 May 1968. Your seat of learning is now an housing estate.
Mick
Thanks very much. I was aware that the school had been demolished.
Interesting personal history for you!
Ray
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Hi Ray,
Nice work on the tender chassis. If I read your original post correctly you also have or had, the Acme kit for the Ivatt 4F. Many years ago I built the College Models kit which Acme took on, so the same kit. Believe me you made the right choice in going for the MOK kit instead. The Acme kit is truly awful. Mine turned out OK in the end but it was a nightmare to build compared to MOK. I've not built the 4F but am close to finishing the BR 4MT, which has been an absolute joy. It's like comparing a Model T Ford to the latest BMW. I look forward to seeing how you get on. There's a build on Dibateg's thread that you might find useful.
Cheers,
Peter
Thanks PAD
The Acme kit is still in the box and I intend to sell it soon so I hope there are some Acme fans out there!
So far although my progress has been quite slow (mainly due to me checking and double checking that I have got things right) this kit is a beauty.. a pleasure to build. I've done a bit more this afternoon which I will probably post tomorrow.
Ray
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I have already started the kit and have built a little of the tender .
The construction involves locating tabs on one piece into slots on another. The pieces are a precise fit! I have not touched a square since I started. Everything appears to fit properly and squarely. The tabs once firmly located are twisted to lock th epieces into position, after which they can be soldered together. When the instructions tell you to bend a piece at 90 degrees....it means 90 degrees.....not 89 or 91!
The etched pieces are beautifully marked with the part number close by so there is no danger of getting the wrong piece. I marked the pieces with the relevant number anyway so I wouldn't make any mistakes later on!
Although the instructions are pretty comprehensive I still had to take a lot of time examining the photos closely to ensure I had things in the right place. The one thing that took a bit of thinking about was which end was which....front or rear. It wasn't obvious (to me anyhow).......
This is my starting point
The tender chassis has two rocking beams fixed in place by a box which is free to move in two planes. It took me a little while to get it freely rocking but it did in the end. These are the rocker arms and rocker beam
The axle bearings are fitted into special washers which in turn fit into slots in the rocking beams. They have to be spot on or there is a danger that the axle will not spin freely.
Here is my progress to date
Ray
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I have never built the kit so I can't comment, attached two local views.
Thanks very much....I haven't seen these.
My school was next to Spring Bank North Signal Box.........they are both no longer with us!
Ray
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The pictures were far too big and I couldn't work out how to edit them so I'll try again.....
Still too big so I'll have to work out what I'm doing wrong later.
Ray
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The contents of the kit are quite impressive. The nickel silver etchings are crisp and clean, as are the brass castings. There is an instruction booklet and some loose leaflets showing updated information. There are also updates on the MOK website.
The instruction book includes pictures of the castings with a key.......there are a lot of them!
The instructions appear to be superb. Loads of pictures showing lots of detail. Far superior to anything I have seen in my modelling life. It will seem unfair but there are still errors which I didn't expect. Anyway, here is a typical page:
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I am 'modelling' the BR period based around Hull in the late 1950s early 1960s. I watched many dirty freight engines pass by my high school playing fields and took almost no notice as I wanted to get to York and Doncaster to see the glamorous express engines. So, apart from memories and internet archives I have nothing to guide me except faded memories.
I have a J71, J94, B1 and Class 08 Shunter either built, part built or in the box. All are representative of my area but after seeing the excellent Railways of Hull video by Marsden (if I could only redub the narration) I saw 43079 arriving at Hull Paragon with a local stopper and I was hooked. The fascinating ugliness of the beast sort of epitomises Hull so I had to have one.
I found a kit at Acme and bought it. However, it stayed in the box until I suddenly had a rush of blood and decided that I would build the MOK one instead. The precision and quality of the kit seemed more suited to such a complex loco so I ordered one and collected it at Telford earlier this month. A quick visit to the ABC stand secured a motor and gearbox, and as I really love Walsall Wheels, I collected a set of them for the loco chassis. I decided to save a small amount by using Slaters wheels for the tender. I'm not overly keen on Slaters but the tender axleboxes all but hide the tender wheels so I compromised!
Over the next 10 years or so (that's how long the J71 took!), I will post updates on progress and my personal observations of the kit, instructions and anything else that influences the build. I also look forward to your criticism, comments, advice and anything else that you care to add.
Ray
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The Class 50 saga came to an end not too long ago. I finished 50043 Eagle in large logo livery and gave it as a present to my son. (it's a long story!)
The JLTRT kit was superior to the PRMRP kit in almost every respect although the JLTRT kit wasn't without issues. Still, I went through a steep and sticky learning curve, using runny superglue for example. I did all the painting myself which I have never attempted before - except grey primer out of a Halford's can..... It took a long time to get the yellow right and eventually it dawned on me that white primer was better than grey as a base....I had a lot of trouble keeping the glazing clear but at long range no one will notice. The Railtec transfers look superb and after a coat of Testors Dullcote.....it was finally done......which closes the thread for me and will allow me to get my garden railway track built........
Ray
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Ray,
Haven't got that far down the road of building the kits yet. I'd have vague thoughts of using optic fibre for the tail lights but that's as far as I've got.
Anthony
Thanks Anthony
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Couldn't delete....so I have removed the content.
Ray
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Fingers firmly crossed for you!
While I'm lucky I had no outstanding orders my whole 7mm plan was built around their products.
I have a couple of 50's under construction (with a LLC one on order too) with now only a Mk2 BSO to go with them.
Planned to order a 33 and a FNA nuclear flask wagon for collection at Kettering, etc etc
Plus much more I wanted to order in the next couple of years.
Not sure what to do with my 7mm stuff now to be honest.
Admiles
Have you been able to source any LEDs for the red running lights on the front of the Class 50 cabs by any chance?....I can find 2mm lighthouse types but not the normal domed type.
Sorry if this is slightly off the thread........I was going to ring Laurie and ask him, but like everyone else, I'm not getting a response.
Thanks
Ray
Modern Outline Kits Class 4F
in Kitbuilding & Scratchbuilding
Posted
I had a quick look at Squires website...the tool is called a Universal Work Holder....page 34 of their on line catalogue.....at less than a tenner I have found it very useful.
Ray