Mike_Walker

Having heard first hand from those actually involved in the fitting power doors to two Mk3 fleets I can tell you there was serious corrosion in the bodies particularly at the ends and around the toilets.  This was cut out and replaced as part of the work.  Unfortunately thanks to the DfT changing its mind, others are getting the benefit of this not us - the trailers being exported to both Mexico and Nigeria all have power doors.

Similarly the power cars have corrosion issues which had to be corrected alongside the power door programme.

At least on a HST power car the driver isn't in danger of putting his feet through a rotten cab floor like is happening on the IETs!

For a short time around 1978/9 the ER loaned some of its 254s to the WR.  One day I was presented with the sight of two PCs in adjacent platforms at Paddington sporting the same number on their noses.  No camera of course in those pre-phone days.

12 hours ago, rodent279 said:

Not first time use today for me, but first time on business. I travelled from BPW on an IET, baled at Paddington, used Crossrail (I can't call it Elizabeth Line) to Whitechapel, then H&C to Aldgate East. Short walk to Leman St, under 25 min from leaving Paddington concourse to walking though the door of the office.

My main problem was the lack of signage at Paddington. It was not obvious which way to walk, the signage for Elizabeth Line seems rather thin on the ground. Apart from that, it all works, and seems to be a fairly good example of when it's done properly it works well.

I found similar issues trying to find Thameslink from the Liz Line at Farringdon.  Judging from the reaction of staff, I wasn't the first!

8 minutes ago, Not Jeremy said:

 

You'd think so, but the instructions make it clear that I am to use my booking reference and my payment card at a machine only.

 

Maybe I'll ask the very nice people in the ticket office first to check this out, whilst congratulating them on having been "spared". They are all and without exception knowledgeable, helpful and jolly!

 

 

They would appreciate it more if you'd actually bought the ticket from them rather than on line then pick it up.  That way it is an additional sale counted to the BO.

4 hours ago, phil-b259 said:

Thus the DfT / HM Treasurys plan was to shut ticket offices and by making former ticket office staff just regular station staff then proceed to get rid of them in large numbers!

That's unless those redeployed staff hadn't left already of their own volition.  I know that's what would have happened at my local station and it would have saved on redundancy payments.

9 hours ago, adb968008 said:

I note Hastings diesels also has 60019 numbered as 60119 to avoid clashing with 60019.. the 60 that is, not 60019 Bittern.

 

confusing should those 3 ever meet.

Off topic, I apologise, but several years ago I was chasing Southern Pacific 4449 up the Feather River Canyon on its way back to Portland.  BNSF had provided a brand new GE also numbered 4449 as helper right behind the kettle - I understand it had been rushed to California from the factory especially.  Anyway, with both crews talking to the dispatcher over the radio, the latter was getting totally confused handling messages from BNSF 4449 and SP 4449!

56 minutes ago, Reorte said:

Wouldn't that have been a Pendolino too? They seem to predate the current ironing board seats.

Except they've just been through a refurbishment so perhaps the seats have been replaced to match the forthcoming Avanti IETs...

I also understand that the Rolling Stock Library that manages the allocation of class and vehicle numbers operates a moratorium system that permits reuse of numbers but only after a set dormant period.

They most certainly were Class 43s throughout their lives.  Classes 253 and 254 were the numbers given to the complete sets and were originally applied to the power car noses but this was soon abandoned when it became obvious that the power car maintenance cycles differed widely from that of the trailers and therefore keeping them together was inefficient.  Likewise, attempts at keeping complete sets of trailers together didn't always work.   Laira for example would usually reform at least one set a day to switch out a defective vehicle and replace with a spare; hence the the regular sighting of odd liveries in sets during times of livery transition.

Classes 253 and 254 continued to be used in operating publications such as the Sectional Appendix up to the present as a convenient way of identifying the different length sets and where they could or could not be used as an example.  GWR refers to its short "Castle" sets as Class 255 although I'm not too sure how "official" that is.

Other class numbers have been reused.  The D600 series Warships were, on paper, allocated Class 41 although their demise in December 1968 coincided with the introduction of the TOPS classifications and Class 41 was used for the prototype HST power cars 41001 and 41002.  These later became W43000 and W43001 in the carriage series (pre-TOPS for those) which were then followed by the production power cars starting at W43002.  When the power cars became regarded as independent locomotives in their own right they became Class 43.  And, of course much in our thoughts at the moment, the Southern "Booster" locos were Class 70 now reused for the Freightliner and Colas GE locomotives.

Don't need them, they've got "boosters".

Hat, coat...

I've heard a lot of criticism of Chiltern's TVMs.  They appear to be particularly poor. 

2 minutes ago, 2ManySpams said:

 

Did NHY Minor not appreciate that Bentleys have right of way at all times in all situations?

Along with Audis, BMWs and Mercedes...

4 minutes ago, The Stationmaster said:

Something which a lpt of people don't know about or understand is teh difficulty and insecurity many people - of all ages - encounter when trying to  cope with a travel environment which is outside their personal control.  It doesn't just affect the railway but airports are a major example and in every case what the intending user of the place wants is reassurance from a competent human being.

 

I suspect our local booking office probably  has almost as many people asking questions as there are tickets issued (because many of those buying tickets also ask questions),  They want a knowledgeable and helpful person to reassure them and guide them on their way.   Many of the questions I have heard people ask in recent times could be answered in a a matter of seconds if you put the right question into a search engine.  But lots of people don't know what is the right question to ask although they know the answer they need.  That is the value of a competent human at a booking office window because they can get to the answer even if the initial question iw not quite right - machines can't always do that.

At our local station, on the next branch to Mike's, the clerk in the BO says he has an average 5-6 enquiries every day (only open Mon-Sat mornings) from folk who've encountered problems trying to book on line or with the TVM.

8 hours ago, MidlandRed said:

They obviously got the wrong message and implemented it early at my local station (joke - the booking office was closed owing to staff illness).

 

 

Lots and lots of staff - wrong side of barrier - not able to assist intending passengers - and no way to pay at the station by cash at that time!! Revenue protection by siege!! Sort of demonstrates the priorities of the TOC!! 
 

I think you may be on to something @The Stationmaster - I got the feeling the whole booking office closure thing started from a simplistic political level - on the basis Khan got away with it on the Underground so let’s apply it to the railway to save money - my theory is it would have had to have come from someone in a senior position with no clue whatsoever about the railways - my guess is, in my opinion, the most badly informed SOS of all time, G Shapps!!  

It was easy to close ticket offices on LU because of the simple fare structure which can be handled effectively by TVMs.   This does not translate to the national network with its huge range of destinations and complex fares.  Same goes for tap in tap out contactless payments.

Of course a dim witted SoS or civil servant wouldn't be able to grasp that.

Hey guys, relax.  When Mark said "seaworthy" it was with tongue in cheek and was a reflection of his frustration at the trains not doing what was claimed.

In his weekly staff address this week Mark Hopwood related that he was going to dig out the 2016 paperwork from Hitachi where they gave assurances the IET would be, in his words, 'seaworthy'. They're not.

But this case has nothing to do with removing route knowledge.  I understand the driver involved still signs both routes.  The issue was that the train was being misrouted without prior warning so the driver correctly stopped and challenged the route.

Mark told me once that when he arrived at FGW he found trains leaving Paddington late because drivers couldn't be bothered to drink up their tea and vacate the mess room on time.  He said you can't condone such practices but if you treat your staff like s**t don't be surprised if they take that attitude.  His approach is that every member of staff is there to perform a vital role in the company from deputy MD down to cleaners and you treat them all equally and with respect.  In his time morale has soared at GWR.  By contrast, after Adrian Shooter retired from Chiltern that morale their is on the floor.

1 hour ago, woodenhead said:

When it suits the PR, the railways have been renationalised and, when they need to do anything nasty, it's those darned private TOCs penny pinching.

 

The other one of these is of course the Avanti mess on the WCML and the cancellation of multiple services at weekends on the Manchester-London route plus everything to come in December.  How long will it take for Avanti to resolve all the disputes, train more drivers and sufficiently crew it's trains or is is also possible that because it is now in Government hands they are asking for savings to be made and not running quite so many Pendolinos at the weekend and in December saves them a pretty penny.  How long before in general the number of trains running up and down the WCML is reduced permanently to fill the remaining trains rather than have them run half empty.  And if you don't run your Pendolinos quite so intensely then there are maintenance savings, energy savings and the units may last longer especially now as HS2 trains beyond Birmingham are clearly going to be delayed.

Avanti has not been absorbed into the Government's Directly Operated Railways although it is micro-managed by the DfT just like the other  TOCs.

23 minutes ago, phil-b259 said:

It doesn’t work like that

 

Because the Government line is these proposals are something train operators have come up of their own accord and has nothing to do with them, any closures / reductions which do happen will be organised on a TOC basis and not the boundaries of parliamentary seats.

But, as we all know - and not just us enthusiasts, this plan originated from within the DfT not the TOCs.  They were just the fall guys and are reported to be "furious" as a result.

2 hours ago, Kris said:

Apparently a GWR train from Penzance to Paddington was misrouted yesterday and had to reverse. It had started heading towards Bristol. I assume that this happened at Taunton. I suspect there are some red faces somewhere and an investigation happening. 

 

Sorry about the dire page the story is on. 

https://www.cornwalllive.com/news/local-news/penzance-paddington-train-reverse-along-8866914?fbclid=IwAR3mn0rgu6YaP_7YqnxpmEsi9OHXbNv7xwqJrrIOQMxdBv1-iQpYd6qE0rc

I thought we only did that at Swindon Panel!  Don't feel so bad now .  😀

This example was at Wallingford a couple of years ago but I think it might have been scrapped since.  I was told it was ex-Royal Navy.

1 hour ago, rodent279 said:

So what happens when a TOC is merged/demerged into or out of another? How are drivers all placed on a level playing field?

 

Or are they? Are there drivers out there still on T&Cs dating back to the first TOCs set up after privatisation?

 

As an aside, one of the unspoken aims of the original privatisation of BR was to reduce the power of the unions, yet they seem to be if anything more able to dictate terms now.

(Any diehard union members please don't take that the wrong way, it's just an observation, not an anti-union rant).

In the case of GWR as an example, until recently they had three grades of driver:  HSS basically those originally employed but GWT/FGW;  LTV, the former Thames guys and West, the former Wessex guys.  They all basically retained their former T&Cs.  The latter two have now been replaced by a new, single grade called "GWR Driver" with enhanced conditions but HSS lives on although no new drivers will be appointed to the role so it will eventually die out although I'm told that might still take 30 years!  As HSS vacancies occur the roles are filled by GWR Drivers.

4 hours ago, Robert Shrives said:

Unlikely in its present format.  Removal of route knowledge means drivers only work regular work routes and can do more frequently so less required. From the operator`s bean counters this is a win - win as most diversions are a result of NR issues- direct failings or been the fall guy for external issues- bridge bash by HGV driver , suicidal person and trespass as most common problems.

 So trains stop and await timetabled route, operator wins delay minute revenue and can off cost bus cover if trains terminate short.  Operator saves on non remunerative driver pay as well. 

 

The only person who suffers at the time is the passenger or freight customers and they suffer again as the compo comes from our tax pot - either directly or due to loss of resources another vital service is compromised. 

As an operator it is very frustrating to see trains standing with fully available diversionary routes for on the day incidents and worse for planned engineering works seeing the profit grab by road operators, when a viable route is available but crews no longer sign.   The  rail driver is in a win as well - stood spare and not driving means can do no wrong, bar put on weight perhaps, while road driver moves passengers in a more stressful environment.  Also his pay clock clicks on while standing waiting NR to restore route.

 

The old adage a moving train is a happy train and an empty station is a happy station  is still true today.      Robert 

All very true but in the case of GWR it's the result of a rare incidence of the DfT getting its way over the operator.

15 hours ago, CWJ said:

Just the weight I believe. They're RA5, so the effect on any unsuspecting elderly underbridges is like a string of speeding Class 37s several times a day.

The braking curve of a 185 is inferior to that of the other DMUs covered by the SP restrictions due to the extra weight which is why that doesn't apply.