wasdavetheroad

I could do that but there is no site width restriction in the real world site which is a country area. The maximum baseboard width is 36'' which is just about reachable as I am less than 5' 5''. Overall design constraints on the layout mean I can't find an extra few inches here without causing even worse problems elsewhere. The Metcalfe box is being recycled from a previous layout as well.

Thanks for the info. Due to the inevitable depth constraints with baseboard depth it looks like there is not enough room. My alternative is to move the yard track closer to the running line and locate the box behind it whilst maintaining the line of sight to the various signals if possible.

I suppose it is OK to have the point rodding etc running under what is the access road to the yard. When I get round to the rodding in a year or so.

I am trying to squeeze an old style signal box between a main running line and a goods yard track. Is there a specified minimum clearance between the box wall and the centre of the running line allowing for the point rodding emerging from the box etc. The model is a 00 scale Metcalf kit with a width of approx 13 feet plus a 18 inch walkway for cleaning the windows

large or medium radius point and what makes of wagon?

Medium radius points can have issues with some wheel flanges 'picking' facing point blades.

There are measures you can take to lessen the problem.

Have a read of this

https://ntrak.org/resources/Documents/tNt/T-TRAK TipsNTechniques/TNT Unitrack Turnouts.pdf

3 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

Do you absolutely want to avoid using upper quadrant signals because you are keeping it very much in LNWR days?

Not absolutely as the C,K&PR did have some signals replaced with upper quadrants. I have 4 lower quadrant and need 2 more of LNWR or LMS type. 

Thanks Mike for the comprehensive reply. I think I understand it all. The only problem is the DOWN signal at B. Dapol do a bracket home signal but with both arms full size although the left hand version has the arm set lower.

I do want to operate the main signals but ground signals etc are beyond my old hands capabilities.

edit, just found some images, it looks like I will have to add a non working miniature arm to a normal signal

This is the current track plan developed in AnyRail, just under 5 metres wide and using Kato HO Unitrack

Feel free to add signals to it

3 hours ago, Nearholmer said:

It might be, in that there were places where private locos were authorised to go onto the passenger railway within station limits, but that was unusual. 
 

Given that the quarry is lower than the main line, it might be better to have two sidings to the left, or one siding to the left, but starting as far right as possible, and put fulls in the siding and empties in the loop, or, best of all, two loops, which is how a lot of exchange sidings were arranged.

 

 

Good points, unfortunately as we all are I am constrained by the available space and the point geometry which has a 10 degree diverge angle. If I had another metre that double track curve at the DOWN end would not be there. and the idea of two stop signal less than 100 yards apart worries me. I like your idea of a run around loop somewhere on the quarry line as DOWN wagons could go in the right hand siding and UP wagons in the left. 

I will get the topic moved but may start again with a plain track diagram ask for advice on signalling given the constraints of the model.

This is getting interesting and I need to explain the quarry line working.

The quarries are at a lower altitude than the station and there is a steep graded section somewhere off the layout. I imagine the company loco as a 0-4-0 saddle tank  propelling several small groups of wagons into the exchange sidings with those for the UP goods going into the left hand siding and those for the DOWN goods being left in the exchange loop. There is enough room for 6 wagons in the loop without fouling the left hand siding. The loaded wagons are collected by the evening goods trains and the empties arrive in the morning. The company loco collects the wagons and pulls them down the quarry line in larger groups because they are empty. 

Still problems with the sequence though as I did not realise the company loco would not be allowed to run around.

Thanks, how do get a topic moved?

42 minutes ago, Jeremy C said:

 

Have you seen the signalling plans for Cockermouth and Penruddock on the excellent https://signalbox.org site?

Cockermouth 1965: https://signalbox.org/~SBdiagram.php?id= 887

Penruddock 1960: https://signalbox.org/~SBdiagram.php?id= 1178

 

The Penrith/Blencow end of the Penruddock plan looks to be just thing you are looking for, with a starter at the platform end (which happens to be a long way from the loop points) and an advanced starter mounted on the same post as the down home.

 

There are several pictures on the Disused Stations website: http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/p/penruddock/index.shtml. However, I haven't found a picture of the down home that clearly shows the up advanced starter arm.

Thanks, those diagrams are useful

Here is a more complete track plan. OO scale, 16 foot baseboard, Track is Kato Unitrack HO, not laid yet as railway room under refurbishment. 

I am trying to keep things as simple as possible as my old hands just can't deal with the fiddly stuff anymore. I am going to try Dapol GWR square post home signals, at least they are lower quadrant and I can mod the finial. Maybe I can get away with just 4 of them. BTW the UP and Down are reversed. Penrith is now in the DOWN direction

5 minutes ago, Michael Hodgson said:

You would put it at A, perhaps with a shunt ahead arm below it authorising a goods to pull forward as far as necessary to shunt the yard, but requiring the main arm to be cleared for the train to proceed.  A shunt disc might be provided instead of a shunt-ahead signal. 

 

Or you might have an advanced starter at X, although this would be relatively unusual.

 

You most definitely need a signal at C.  This could be a full size arm if trains are expected to enter the section from the yard.

However a shunt signal would be more likely as the yard would typically be worked by a train which stops in the Up platform, detaches vehicles to be dropped off and outgoing traffic is shunted back onto the main train before resuming the journey (under authority of the platform starter).  A shunt disc at C would not authorise a train to enter the section.

Thanks for the info and yes, the yard would be shunted using the UP platform road as well. However as there was several miles of steep hill to the west apparently mineral trains hauled by the small goods engines would sometimes split the load and  use a long siding in the goods yard as a refuge while they went back down the bank for the other half. Because of this there was also a water tank provided.

I am going to use modellers licence to include some pre war trains for operational interest.

I need to provide another diagram showing the complete layout with the quarry exchange loop and sidings behind the down platform

1 hour ago, Rivercider said:

I am no signalling expert, but in order for others to advise it will be useful to know

where the branch line is located and which company built or operated the line, 

and also the era you intend to portray as signalling policy changed over the years,

 

cheers 

Cockermouth, Keswick and Penrith 1950's

ITG - I have not included all the track and the goods yard has 4 sidings plus an additional head shunt which is not on the inspirational original Troutbeck. . There is other track on the DOWN side but I wanted to clear up the UP starter position first

This will be part of my next layout. A passing loop on a single track branch line. The loops contain up and down platforms. There is also a small goods yard with maybe 3 pick up goods per day.

My question is where to put the up starter semaphore. 'A' looks logical and 'B' probably dangerous if there are trains awaiting to depart the UP loop and the Yard. Maybe 'A' and another stop signal at 'X'?. The Yard will need a signal at 'C' and could this be a ground signal?

I have now added a plain image of the current AnyRail plan. OO scale, just under 5 metres long and Kato Unitrack

If you find the Faller onboard batteries work well and are easy to charge I would consider just replacing the onboard speed control system with a RC one. This would mean the overhead wiring would be purely cosmetic, IMO avoiding a lot of hassle!.

Question - what type of batteries are the Faller ones and what voltage is the motor?

Question - how does the Faller system steer the vehicle? is there a continuous  magnetic strip under the road and what about junctions?

10 hours ago, Smardale said:

Hi everyone! Out of interest, does anyone have a summit track plan on a single track line?

Or alternatively, have a guess on what perhaps Ais Gill/Stainmore would have potentially looked like if the line wasn't double track? I presume that it would look something like below, with a passing loop and maybe a refuge siding? I'm probably way off though. 

 

I don't know of any single track summit layouts. The double track examples I've seen have both up and down refuge siding with a crossover in-between them. ('The Summit' for example).

I'm asking this because the more I play with the idea of having a small station with an engine shed for bankers (like Blair Atholl on the Highland Railway) the more I think it'll be enjoyable to operate.

I could perhaps have a layout with a station, then a viaduct/large bridge with a weight limit, followed by a summit. The weight limit would create scenarios such as pilot locomotives having to become bankers as to distribute the weight, or mineral trains (with a limited length) being combined in the station sidings before continuing on. That sounds really fun to me, especially when I add further operations that Axlebox has talked about over Stainmore. I think I've come to the realization that Smardale Station, unless part of a grander layout, may get a little boring after a while.

Somewhat similar to Troutbeck on the CKPR. In the middle of nowhere but with a bigger goods yard than you would expect, sited where your refuge siding is. There is a long steep bank to the west and in the olden days the small locos tasked with heavy mineral trains would split the train and run 2 portions to Troutbeck. There was a long siding in the goods yard that could be used as a refuge. There was also a passing loop added and 2 platforms. Dualing to the East came later. This is my inspiration for my new layout, present name the BIG train set. For play value (operational interest) I have added another loop and some simple exchange sidings  for the fictional 'mineral branch'. Historical bridge weight restrictions allow for double heading on long freights and excursion trains. I am also planning on turning the fiddle yard into a terminus/exchange station, again to increase play value. Two layouts in one.

You just use the same procedure as the original binding of the Rx to the Tx

Switch off the Tx

Select the Selecta number you want to bind to

Switch on the Rx, the LED flashes for about 15 seconds followed by rapid flashing

Switch on the Tx whilst holding down the bind button

The Rx should flash slowly a few times and then come on solid,

The Rx is now bound to the new Selecta number

There is a way of getting a true consist for 2 locos with a Tx-22 but only one consist per Tx. Basically you need 2 Rx's which are factory fresh, ie not bound to your Tx or with a software reload also works. The Rx's are set to the Selecta with Tx change option. For the consist you must set both locos to Selecta position 6 as this overwrites the position used in the 'factory' for testing. Then after speed matching you set each loco to a different 2nd Selecta position. for example I have 2 Hornby 2P 4-4-0's. One bound to S4 and S6 and the other bound to S5 and S6. The locos are controlled independently with S4 and S5 and S6 controls both locos as a consist. Obviously S6 can only be used to control the consist and no other locos should be bound to it. 

You might try a small dab of Copydex on the underside here and there plus a track pin or two. If your layout remains level it should be OK and the track is easy to lift. I have 'blue foam' baseboards and drill 0.8 mm holes in the track (Kato HO) then use Sainsbury's finest Korbond dressmaker pins, they stick surprisingly well to the blue foam

That's what I found as well so all my tension locks are being converted to bogie mounted and all freight stock to Hornby wheels and medium tension locks if possible. Medium type tension locks! I like the train set look 

3 hours ago, StephenF said:

 

Hi there! Not sure I understand. Surely a big part of using RC is to not need to pick up from the track? Do these Bluerail thingies work via Bluetooth alone? That would be interesting...

All the control signals to the loco are via Bluetooth link. the loco power can be from the rails or a battery or a combination of both. I tested an earlier BlueRail board and it even switched automatically from rail to battery power and vice versa. the battery was in effect a giant stay alive but retaining full control of the loco.

ps - as I do not need sound so I use Deltang equipment plus some Lemon receivers for radio controlled uncoupling.

Thanks everyone, I think I understand it now and I don't have to add the extension leads etc until the new garage side door is fitted

That's an interesting suggestion. I have tested the output of the PSU's and they are stable at just below and just above 12V. I will have a go at extending the 12V output with good capacity wire, probably cable and check the voltage drop and whether it will still fire a pair of point motors.

Thanks again

Yes there are systems available. this one from Tam Valley using Bluerail boards can control any DCC decoder apparently including sound ones

http://bluerailtrains.com/tam-valley-dcc/

The layout is in a converted garage and has a supply laid on, the attached images may help. the armoured cable is about 14mm diameter.

Power needs in the garage are 1 or occasionally 2 x 1Kw fan heaters,1 used for frost protection and one to 'top up' if needed 2 x 4ft florescent tubes and 1 bulb with switches on the wall.  Four switched wall sockets and 3 extra lights from one of the sockets. I want to add the 2 power supplies . There is no track power as the layout will be radio control/battery powered locos.

No idea what the numbers mean on the circuit breakers. I think the 7Kw electric shower pinched the cooker circuit!.