Sjcm

well......companies are fiercely protective of their trade names, so somehow I don't think Hornby went "of course, take our name for XXX pounds. We're not worried that people will assume you are part of Hornby and if you want to print "Hornby's new black5 is a bit of a dog" on the cover, got for it!"

10 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

However Hornby Magazine is nothing to do with Hornby....

 

It's published by Key Publishing and they sell as much Bachmann, Dapol, Cavalex and Accurascale as they do Hornby.

 

https://shop.keypublishing.com/collections/kmw-limited-editions

 

I find the reviews and videos to be pretty good, with less of the bias that comes with some of the other reviewers. When they show a video of a locomotive or train they tend to be running it on a proper layout so you can see them running.

 

 

 

 

Jason

Wouldn't they need permission to use the Hornby name? I think its very unlikely that it would be granted if they are expecting any sort of critical reviews, especially as they seem to have close links to Hornby whether they own them or not

17 hours ago, Hacksworth_Sidings said:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?sid=atmodels18&_pgn=1&isRefine=true&_trksid=p4429486.m3561.l49496
 

Been looking at GraFar OO stuff, and I think I found out why it’s so hard to get a hold of… This guy seemingly has most of the supply*! Saw a good 16 listings for 8100s…

 

Some of his prices seem half decent… £45-£55 for Prairies, an early plunger prairie for £50 (plastic wheels, screwed onto their axles in similar fashion to a Keyser model, plungers between the rear and middle drivers), I’m honestly tempted to purchase one as 8100s are models I hardly see being sold…
 
Then there’s things like Merchant Navies going for almost three hundred quid! Are the BR blue ones really worth that much!?

 

*Well, him and that guy with the room full of GraFar stuff selling for £10k…

Mentioned it on here before but I sold a landfill grafar merchant Navy with no tender for 100 pounds. thought I'd get a fiver for it....

yeah that's about the size of it. I did think the lamp thing was a bit of a storm in a teacup, but after seeing them on the reviews they do look a bit big and lighted, a bit.....well naff. Maybe I'm turning into a rivet counter on the quiet. As for glueing lamp brackets into a new model as the one reviewer did, fine for you, but basically taking away a main feature if you ever try to sell it, plus you can see the lamp/brackets getting lost over time. I just have a bee in my bonnet about the QC on new models given the price, and the tender thing is too much of an unknown quantity for me. That said, some people are happy with it, and some people will still buy it whatever the problems mentioned on here. Some people just want it, which is fine. Even Sam's trains swore blind he wouldn't buy it but did. He claimed  it was for a proper review but as someone who spends 30 minutes per review going on about the lining, or the detail of the cylinder cocks, then it's obviously a model aimed at him.

1 hour ago, Johan DC said:

It seems to me that this new type of plug is better working, and closer coupling, on the previous locos like P2’s and A1’s. I have four of these, and not a single issue. And the gap between tender and engine looks smaller too. So it’s really a step back. 

Yep, the problem is no-one knows exactly what the problem is. Is it a mechanical problem where the tender connectors on this batch are not making proper contact when they click in. Is is an electrical problem somewhere in the loco or tender (faulty/corroded contacts). On the one hand Sam's trains got his working with contact cleaner which hints at electrical problems. On the other hand that didn't work with first one. Maybe it's a combination of both and the main difference between the P2 and the black 5 is QC or cost cutting.

27 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

Surely an EP model would have been on / off that Hornby test track, connected and disconnected enough times to test that and ID it as a weakness ?

 

some EPs ive seen have been through a hedge backwards, but thats part of the life of an EP is to find these things.

 

 

 

Apart from the colour, they remind me of the contacts you used to get on 90's game console cartridges which could oxidise and stop working over time. of course if they are the same, then the presumably hidden smaller traces that join up to the visible contact bars could be the real problem  as you can't reach them to clean them.

well........that tender connection.  he got it working with contact spray but you have to wonder how long that is going to last. I suppose the crank pin falling out is about par for the course😂

just seen it. Same problems and its fallen apart 😂

1 minute ago, 34theletterbetweenB&D said:

Bought the very lovely Hornby P2 as no 2003 'Lord President', and had it all in pieces after test running was complete, decoder now in Loco, tender wiper pick ups removed, etc.. It's way cheaper than a self build model would be. Does that answer the question? (Overall I rate it very good.)

 

The main motivation was assessing the mechanism for a future project acquisition. Gresley would so have advanced to a 4-8-4 had he been spared...

But you are not the norm. Plenty of people willing and capable to service and repair a rtr model. A complete rebuild with new pickups? less likely.

14 minutes ago, 34theletterbetweenB&D said:

This culture doesn't trouble me: before there was RTR OO worth purchasing as a model, everything had to be built by DIY using kit components. Now we get fully assembled kits, and happily an increasing proportion of these fully deserve the 'RTR' label: Joy unbounded, I don't have to run the loco, carriage and wagon works, more time for my real interest in timetable operation.

 

But all models that come my way get taken apart to some extent, because improvements and adjustments can be made. Hornby's product typically gets the most extensive treatment, because among the current brands it has the largest content of toytrainium in its offerings, which can be discarded: first to go are wiper pick ups on tender wheels. (They are only fitted to try to help the loco get over the dreadful design set track pointwork, completely unnecessary on a live crossing layout.) And there's much more besides.

 

As far as I am concerned, now that it is generally recognised that scale dimensions and appearance - insofar as that is possible within the necessary OO compromise for UK subject matter - all is generally well. The minor problems and deficiencies can be quickly fixed: HURRAH!

 

Once there's a plain and simple Hornby Black 5 in BR late crest on sale, it'll be in pieces on my bench the moment it's completed infant mortality acceptance testing.

 

Yes, they can in their RTR HO product, which is made to a long time well developed standard, with an extensive range of toytrainium input and performs impressively. And it is so marvellous that 'modellers that can' adopt P87 to get rid of the toytrainium and have true scale models, which  - surprise! - won't get around the minimum radius HO set track curves.

 

There's little point in making comparisons between RTR HO and RTR OO, which developed on very different paths reflecting aspects of national character, there ordnung, here gung-ho; the chance of any future convergence is so small as to be ignored...

Yeah, it was more an observation on how everyone seems reluctant to delve deeper with the problems and why? I don't subscribe to Sam's trains or watch a lot of his stuff, but I do know he's not adverse to taking apart new models for major surgery like many youtubers. Yet this time he's not touched it, even to look at the mechanism. Like wise the other guy posted on here who again has tried to fix new models before. As someone who would return a new faulty loco out of principle, I wonder if the people who would usually have a dabble, have gone "nope, not touching a 230 pound loco under warranty"

So far I've seen 3 you tubers with the tender problem and 2 people in the comments that had to return their models. Even the favourable class47peters' video posted on here mentions it didn't work out the box until he pushed the tender in properly - is that just a one-off or the sign of a weakness that will only get worse?

Trouble is there is a culture in our hobby of fixing stuff that you don't get elsewhere with new products for whatever the reason (don't want the hassle of returning/like the challenge/worried they won't get a replacement quickly?). Be interesting if someone posts a "how I fixed my black5" video on YouTube because given the price and complexity, Hornby may have reached the tipping point where people are prepared to start dismantling a new model rather than just sending it back.

He doesn't help himself with some of his fixations and his carpet layout, but some of his gripes about no proper bearings, flimsy parts, design faults, wheels out of scale, and glue all over the place in 200+ pound models seems perfectly realistic to me. End of the day no-one forced Hornby to go up-market and start charging 100+ pounds above inflation compared to the 2000's equivalent models. You can make an argument that the better detailing and mechanism is worth that price increase, but as fair as the quality and general robustness goes Hornby (and others) just don't get it. If I buy a premium product whether that's a top of the range phone or a tv, I expect it to work, be in mint condition when it arrives and the quality of it ensuring it has a long life. If I buy a cheapo smartphone I'll probably overlook the general cheapness and a scratch on the screen

While I understand the lamp argument on both sides, I would say on the realistic/prototypical stakes, a loco that doesn't move is much more of a bar to realism than the lamps. There obviously seems to be a problem with some of the release batch with the tender connection.How big that is is hard to tell, but seeing there is a fair number of YouTubers with this problem and those that have bought it and reviewed are not exactly everywhere, you have to wonder how widespread the problem is, and whether it's something that will increase with wear and tear in 3/6/12 months time. Suffice to say, it's the usual story with Hornby - Rolls Royce price, Lada quality control.

I have 3 of those duettes, one I use every day for testing. Hasn't blown up yet, touch wood, but I wouldn't pay 100 quid for one, or sell one.

One of my favorite YouTube channels is a guy who gets working pre-70s televisions and radios.. When I say gets working, he doesn't repair or restore them because they are too far gone, but finds them dumped by the side of the road or down mines and does just enough to get them working so no replacement of  leaky capacitors etc.. He's basically fearless of high voltage from being an ex repairman so half the fun is watching what will catch fire when he turns on a tv he's just jetwashed to get the mud out of 😲. He's actually very safety orientated and these are 1+ hour long serious tutorials,but every now and then he has a bit of fun - wired this microwave into one of those  retro 2000's Crossley record player stereos and the resulting smoke and fire had the neighbours phoning him up thinking his house was on fire. "No, I'm having a barbecue"😂

Another YouTuber with the same problem as Sam's trains

3 hours ago, 33C said:

No! If you ain't got the money, and it works for you, great, your modelling! Just get a hacksaw from the shed and some glue and all will be well. AND your taking the next step...

yep. With.the added bonus that your hacksaw and glue job will probably last longer and be more robust than the 200 pound super detailed model - if its not already broken when you get it.

1 hour ago, Hacksworth_Sidings said:

It is only the starting price for the bid, and with how sought after the Dublo Bulleids are I can easily see it going up, maybe it was a case of “I have the body but no chassis, but I have the parts to make a new chassis, it’ll be a fun project to see what I can toss together”.

yeah, it's hard to see if the body has been "got at" to fit the chassis which may reduce the selling price

3 hours ago, Hacksworth_Sidings said:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/116153948886

 

This here’s interesting… Hornby Dublo West Country body, but it seems to have a heavily modified Triang chassis, the main drive wheels seem to be from the later Hornby release of the BoB, modified with extended crank pins on the centre driver, fitted to a B12/Scotsman chassis block. Front bogie wheels seem to have been externally sourced, but a very nice conversion and a testament to the skill of the modeller who made it regardless!

 

 

Certainly not a “Britannia” as the listing states though…

Obviously a lot of work put into it.  You're left wondering why though... Still at a tenner you can't go wrong really.

If you look on completed listings he was selling them separately originally. Obviously can't be bothered anymore.

As President of The Enemies of Thomas, I've authorised a 20 pounds bid on the condition the seller destroys it with a hammer/sends it via yodel to get it out of circulation.

1 hour ago, DCB said:

How on earth is he getting the stuff so cheap.  Boxed wagons for £2 to £5   sold for £10 -£15.   A class 37  £12.50 sold for £40.  Buying well below  eBay prices.   House clearances?  The Yorkshire Auction House on TV gets derisory amount for models IMHO, so maybe that is the answer. Auctions and buy up anything cheap

yes, but did he actually pay 2-5 pounds for a wagon individually or is that what he valued it them as part of say a big 300 pounds joblot? he may have even paid less per wagon but needs a "bottom line" figure to work out where to set his profit.  He's sold those 3 unboxed Hornby wagons for 12 pounds each and claims they cost 10 pounds total so that's 26 pounds profit, but then he gave the buyer free postage so that's 21/22 profit. then you have his ebay fee's and  business overheads. At 12 pounds a wagon they were unlikely to have flown out the door so could have been up for weeks. Worth the effort?  perhaps, but a lot of work if you add in his time.

Personally I think it's pretty easy to sell at a profit on ebay, but that's different from making a living out of it by buying and selling. If you're buying stock and not that knowledgeable like this guy possibly (solarium coach?) then you have to go for joblots of boxed stuff in good condition which would add big time to buying stock and you'd need a hefty investment in stock to start off with (5k?) to keep things ticking over. The time aspect with research, listing, wrapping and posting stuff looms large so I doubt he buys stuff like non running loco's that he has to repair or gamble on them running so again any stock he buys is gonna attract top money on ebay with other dealers in competition. His mark-up seems to be at least 50% which isn't excessive on ebay but you'd imagine he has an awful lot of unsold stock in BIN listings running for months on end. Still if you can get 20 pounds for old Hornby controllers good luck to him.👍

I like how the paint is like "a car found in a barn".  Minus marks for not mentioning patina

Based on personal experience, my guess is he couldn't be @r**d.

Well the last 4 photos look suspiciously like he's glued it to his hand.😉