Kirby Uncoupler

We all know that HS2 and it's originally planned northern extensions, was partly designed to make accessing the Warley train show far easier, but alas for the time being, our cousins up north will have to carry on using the Victorian rail network, although trains from the NW already run through to Birmingham Int., like from Abu Dhabi on the Cambrian Coast. Up until the advent of the NEC, national shows were mostly based in or around London, which had excellent transport links to all parts of the nation, even Lincolnshire.

     Ancient Britons had a similar idea 5,000 years ago, they opened a national conference/leisure centre on the fringes of Salisbury plain, everyone walked or rode a horse to the venue, so some would have to take a week off work, just to get there, plus another week for the trip home. A big advantage with this location, was that the ground could be returned to agricultural use, between events. The food and drink could be supplied locally, oxon and hogs for roasting, mead from the local friary, thus providing much needed jobs in the area. From an environmental prospective, lots of smoke from all the roasting, increased methane production from eating root veg, and both River Avons (south and west) contaminated, due to lack of loos.

     Now in the present day, we make an annual pilgrimage to a collection of large sheds in central Mercia, which until the 1970s, was beautiful pastoral countryside, where Shakespeare went for picnics. Looks like we're stuck with that lot now, although being able to fly in for the Warley show is handy, apart from the added pollution. Maybe the answer is for the shows to come to us, rather like a travelling circus, although to a degree we have that already, with the string of leisure centre venues, except in Lincolnshire.

      I think what we've all learnt from this discussion, is that if you want to attend nationwide events, whilst relying on public transport,  don't live in Lincolnshire, although it's very pretty, the houses are cheaper, and it's flat, so less pollution from exhaust and brake dust.   

                                                        Cheers, Brian. (Who used to live in Islington)

3 hours ago, Vecchio said:

 The Waterman layout had a few issues with short circuits, 

Sorry to hear that, for Pete it must have felt like P4 Acton days all over again ( If you're old enough to remember that one? 🙂 )? But then if modelling the WCML, it's accurate and prototypical, for trains to stop running for a period, whilst the power supply is restored, at least the catenary didn't come down, just like the real thing.

    Seriously though, it can't be easy setting up a 150ft plus layout in yet another different location, a layout so big that it can't be tested  in it's entirety back at base camp, so the odd gremlin is bound to creep in? As a whole the layout is very impressive, particularly the station, with it's modern office blocks.

                                                      Cheers, Brian.

8 hours ago, Michael Edge said:

I have actually built the Jidenco W, in 3mm scale but I can't find any photos of it. I have built two 7mm ones and the steps over the motion are a real pain, this is the most recent one.

 

The steps on this are more or less where they should be, 

 

Very nice, and you've managed to make those valve gear steps, into real foot pockets, whereas I cheated and just added a flush backing plate.    BK

I can think of two Jidenco kits, that I built for other people, roughly 30 years ago. One was a LSWR Beattie Well tank, the other was a SR W class 2-6-4T. Both were a challenge, even for a seasoned loco builder, lots of wraps formed things like the smokeboxes, you had to think ahead and make sure the final external wrap, had the join at the bottom, so it could be hidden. 

    The real Beattie Well Tanks had quite large diameter boilers, for a small loco (2-4-0 WT), and quite large driving wheels (originally for suburban passenger use), the result being the flanges were about an inch away from the boiler cladding on the real thing. There was the first problem, the customer wanted it in 'OO'. So after rolling all the etched layers, to make a sound boiler, I then had to carve out false recesses, to accommodate the 'OO' wheelsets. The SE Finecast kit was much easier.

     The really tricky part of the W 2-6-4T kit, were the steps (with foot sockets, to stop 4mm toes being chopped off), which sat either side, over the valve gear. There was just enough room in 'OO', I wouldn't fancy doing the same in EM or P4? Another trait common to both original Jidenco kits, were the instructions, which started off well detailed, then became briefer and briefer as the build progressed. They finished with the immortal lines "assemble brake gear." (full stop), and "assemble valve gear." (full stop) 

      I got the impression, the person test-building/proof building the first kits, had given up halfway through. I managed to avoid other Jidenco kits, and their re-packaged successors, although I was very tempted by their Class 50 diesel kit, before Lima came to the rescue, in those dark old days.

                                                                        Cheers, Brian.

I've found one: Spotted a black B12, and a Caley Single doing well with a heavy load. There may be other clips? My kind of restaurant.   

https://www.google.com/search?q=youtube+thunderbirds+restaurant+trains&oq=youtube+thunderbirds+restaurant+train&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUqBwgBECEYoAEyBggAEEUYOTIHCAEQIRigATIHCAIQIRigATIHCAMQIRigAdIBCTIyNjQ1ajBqN6gCALACAA&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:62c871cd,vid:m8O7mVCcs-o

BK

Unless i'm dreaming, I have a vague recollection of a scene with the Tracy family off-duty in a restaurant, and instead of waiters, the food and drink was served by model trains (Tri-ang Hornby?). Not sure if it was one of the TV episodes, or perhaps more likely, one of the film spin-offs, like "Thunderbird 6"? Does anyone else recall this, or know of a link for a video clip? Knowing the scale of the trains, will indicate the size of the puppets.  No need to (financially) tip the train after the meal. 

                                                                                            Cheers, Brian.

Having given up on my Google maps search for The Guns Of Navarone, I needed a new challenge.  The new task was to find and locate Tracy Island, using Google aerial images and Instantstreetview, there were various clues like palm trees, and lots of water. I have now narrowed the search down to the Pacific Ocean or the Isle Of Wight, of course the latter did have a rocket base, and the rockets were constructed on the island (clue?), but I haven't seen a volcano? Both of these establishments closed down around the same time  as the Thunderbirds set in Slough, which is roughly 80 miles away.

      I do know that Jeff Tracy retired in 1968, and was surgically separated from his desk, whilst suffering from bad health problems, brought on by the gravelly voice. Although born in Tunbridge Wells, Jeff had gone to work for the Americans as a pioneer astronaut in the 1920s, hence his mid-Atlantic accent, designed to be accepted by audiences, on both sides of the pond.

       None of the sons wanted to carry on with the business, there just weren't enough major disasters on a weekly basis anymore, and the fuel bill was horrendous.  Sadly the brothers went their separate ways, Scott got a job in Manchester as the new mayor, Virgil became a Buddist Monk, Alan got a boring job, because he was boring, John lives in a remote mountain shed, where he finally got to build his model railway, and Gordon went for gender re-assignment. Brains went to work for the North Koreans, and built their new rocket base, whilst Tin-Tin and her Dad opened a brothel in Bognor Regis (since raided).

       So Tracy Island was abandoned, as soon as I have found it, it can feature in the Abandoned Engineering tv series, although the end location in the latest OO7 film "No Time Today" looked strangely familiar?

                                                                                             Cheers, Brian Tracy. (clue?)

10 hours ago, RJS1977 said:

 

Although John is identified as the "space monitor", and all episodes have John on the station, he and Alan worked alternate months on the station - there's at least one episode where Alan is on his way up to relieve John when TB3 needs to divert elsewhere.

Wouldn't it have been better to send Tin-tin up, to relieve John?  Tin-tin was the Tracy Island bike.      BK

I always thought John Tracy was the weird one, up there in his space-station (Tb5?), what did he do all day? He must have done some long shifts, being on call 24/7, how did he relax in his non-existent spare time? He couldn't get pissed between episodes, whilst in charge of a moving vehicle, and since he was a nerd, his attempt to build a model railway was thwarted by zero gravity. His dad Jeff Tracy wouldn't even allow him to inflate his pneumatic girlfriend, due to the dangers of a pressurised vessel in outer space. 

      I bet members of Greenpeace still have nightmares, about THAT episode where the road-building machine cuts a new dual-carriageway through the Amazon jungle, ripping out trees at the front end, and laying fresh tarmac at the back end (complete with dotted white lines), before going out of control and making the M25.     

                                                                                                 Funderbirds Are Brill   BK

It's yet another PMP v The World argument fight!🙂

And while we're about it, spot the difference. 

A new Bachmann Thompson CK now with DIY yellow cantrail stripe (made from sliced-up electrical tape), plus external window frames represented by black drawing ink. Yellow stripes were applied to ER ist Class coaches from 1962/63, but much of the stock was being withdrawn during the mid-60s, so it didn't last more than around five years, if that, and some never got it. The window frames were added to square-windowed stock from the early 50s onwards.   BK

Hi Everyone,

     Mention was recently made of the original 1990s Bachmann BG Full Brakes, and how improvements can be made.

Here's my re-worked Bachmann blue BG, re-profiled roof, new roof vents, reduced height gangways, painted gangway doors, cantrail now blue instead of grey, liquid clear glazing, recessed battery boxes plus extra box re-using cut out Bachmann mouldings, new metal centre truss section, no boxes other side, re-numbered to E145E (survived until 1976, then preserved, now scrapped) re-sprayed with satin varnish, new Southern Pride solebar steps added, bogies shortened to 32mm (8ft), new narrow couplings, underframe painted brown. The roof has been patch-painted, but still a bit scabby, suits the vehicle so might leave as is. Still running on it's original black plastic wheels!

    A note about the original 1990s Bachmann Gresley/Thompson bogies, regular Gresley bogies were 8ft 6in (34mm), BGs were commonly seen running on 8ft 0in (32mm) bogies, the old Bachmann bogies have a wheelbase of 33mm (8ft 3in), i'm now not sure it is worth cutting plastic to remove 3 inches. It would be easier to add thin strip under the frames, to make the bogie look chunkier/shorter, in the same way that I add 1mm strip to represent the Heavy Duty type bogies. Decisions, decisions!

                                       Cheers, Brian. 

Many Thanks for the replies, and links provided, i've got some studying to do.

     By bizarre coincidence, I caught a repeat showing of "The Architecture The Railways Built" on Yesterday TV channel last night, which was mostly about St.Pancras station, but mentioned the goods yards in passing, and that initial traffic arrived via the GNR, who apparently charged extortionate rates, and held up Midland traffic.

     The building of a second yard at Somer's Town (Euston Road) makes sense, to cater for expansion, the original St.P {Agar Grove) yard site could not be expanded, but both yards closed around the same time (mid-to late 70s). At the Agar Grove site there was also the curved viaduct link up on to the North London Railway, which was still in use until at least 1975, or perhaps closed at the same time as the two yards, and then demolished. The arches under the NLR show the width of the yard's northern throat, some arches are now garages and storerooms, one has become an access road. In more recent times, the modern concrete HS1 flyovers have restored the link to the NLR. At the south end of the AG yard, the canal bridge and retaining walls are about the only survivors.   BK

Hi Everyone,

    To the west of St.Pancras station, where we now have the British Library, previously stood the Somers Town high level goods yard from the 1870s, which itself replaced an area of slum dwellings. A mile to the north stood the original St.Pancras goods yard, which the Midland Railway constructed prior to the arrival of the MML from Bedford via Kentish Town, initially the yard was served from the east via the GNR and Hitchin. 

     Both yards were very busy for 100 years, both survived until the mid-to-late 1970s, but why were there two yards so close together, with potential duplication? It has been suggested to me, that one yard was for despatching goods by rail, and the other was for receiving goods from rail, with transfer of empty wagons between the two, but in which direction?

Besides these two large yards, there were also various coal drops on both sides of the passenger lines, including the later extension north of, and over Phoenix Road, which used traversers and pulleys to move the coal wagons. After this high level coal yard closed c.1968-70, in it's disused state was used for the RAF Harrier jump jet race to New York stunt, plus it hosted at least one preserved bus rally. This part was flattened soon after, replaced by modern housing, although the base of the perimeter walls survives in places.

      In their day, all these areas were difficult to access or observe, due to their elevation and security, apart from looking down from the NLR rail or Agar Grove road bridges at the north end. Photos are few in number, although I have found various cine film clips from passing trains, plus the odd aerial view, and i'm told it was covered in an edition of BRILL magazine, which is yet to be discovered?

      St.Pancras yard near Agar Grove was cleared by the 1980s, and became an industrial estate by the main line, and a housing estate on the west side, the pub still stands between the road entrance, and the canal. One long siding was reinstated, for block cement trains, ironically serving a plant in the former GNR yard/Top Shed, via aerial conveyor belt eastwards over the MML. Somer's Town depot fronted on to Euston Road, and had suffered bombing during WW2, half of the brick facade had collapsed, and was covered by ugly advertizing hoardings, until demolished about twenty odd years ago. After the new library was constructed on the southern half of the site, further construction followed on the northern half, the last surviving remnants of the 1870s yard, were the NW corner entrance, and part of the west side curtain wall.

      Does anyone have memories of these yards, and/or know how they operated?

                                                           Cheers, Brian.

On 21/01/2023 at 17:17, markw said:

The conflat P had fixed corner pockets for one A and one BD container and eight fixed attachments for shackles, there is no safe way to carry a second or third A container. I don't think they would ever run with only one container as the axle loadings would be very uneven.

 

I think the wagons were run as a fixed set, once there were enough bookings to fill the train no more would be taken, it would then be up to the customer to decide whether to book for the following day or book a container for another service.

That sounds reasonable to me, so the fixed brackets on the Conflat P would only accept 1 x A and 1 x BD container, which would probably mean the train always ran with a full complement of containers to load the wagons evenly, even if some were empty? I can't believe the despatch office always got the balance of loaded container types the same every night, unless they held some back for the following night, or resorted to adding empties for completeness?  

                                                                                 Cheers, Brian.

At the London end of the MML, there was also the 1960s Tartan Arrow service (yet another dedicated freight initiative), based at Kentish Town west yard, which may have also been involved with the Condor service at some stage?When Hendon is quoted as the London departure point, do they really mean the north end of Cricklewood yard? Hendon station had it's own modest set of sidings, but they disappeared under the M1 extension to Brent Cross, in the 60s.    BK

I doubt the Condor service was often seen with empty flat wagons, though perhaps the odd part-loaded one may have been seen, where an unequal quota of long and short containers  were on the train that night, most likely a BD type container on a Conflat P, without it's A type partner? When there were even more A type to carry, I suppose they could load 2 x A type (balanced at each end), there would be space for 3 x A type, but were there sufficient chains and shackles carried, or could they just add spare shackles from the depot?

Another reason you'd be less likely to see empty wagons on the Condor services, is because these were individual wagons, so train lengths could be adjusted, but then again sufficient conflats and containers would have been required in London (Hendon/Kentish Town) or Glasgow, for the following day's requirements, it was probably a bit of a juggling act? Empty containers were no doubt added to the trains, to restore the stock balance at each end. At the London end, the LMR could also call on containers from other goods yards, for example from Broad Street, Somer's Town and Agar Grove. The later Freightliner services mostly used fixed 5-wagon units, and three or four of these would make a semi-permanent rake, so depending on demaind, you'd be far more likely to see half-empty rakes, due to the reduced flexibility, but it's probably more economical?

                                                                                      Cheers, Brian.

Sorry to hear this, Ian was a supporter of the TR in Wales, and the Leighton Buzzard narrow gauge line, near where he and his family lived. He commuted to his London job, based in one of the then most exciting office locations, the GPO Tower (showing my age, read Telecom Tower), where he worked for GPO/BT supply admin. Via his connections in the MRC, he did occasionally join us operating Frank Dyer's Borchester in Palmer's Green.

                                                                               Brian Kirby.

Sorry to hear this news, Chris was a nice chap, and he helped me with much information on DMUs, especially their deployment. A friendly face at shows, he will be greatly missed.

                                                                         Brian Kirby.

2 hours ago, Ian Hargrave said:

Have just summoned up the courage to outwit both rheumy fingers and dodgy close vision to fit both sets with Hunt Elite buckeye couplings.A slight but nonetheless perceptible improvement IMHO.I am impressed with the fit and quality of a product new to me . Tribute also to the NEM on the coaches.They withstood my interventions with ease.I shall invest in more of these ..well both couplings and of course coaches.

 

I'm impressed with the much neater compensated coupling frames, now part-concealed inside the chassis.   BK

19 minutes ago, Mallard60022 said:

Can anyone confirm this 'recladding'?

I always thought the Horizontal and sometimes Vertical Strapping was to deal with failing joins in Panels? However I'd like to know if the whole sides were actually replaced? I did read about it somewhere ages ago, but just can't remember where. Thanks

Phil 

Phil,

The standard reference books mention "re-cladding", and the associated added joining strips, without going into great detail. I doubt it involved the whole side and windows, just the panels below. Either rain water was getting in around the window bottoms, and causing corrosion of the steel panels, or causing the wooden framework to warp? Some were probably worse than others, some were never dealt with.

By the mid-60s, BR was keen to get rid of the Bulleid stock, partly because of the above problems, and also because of their lower crash worthiness, particularly when coupled to the stronger all-welded Mk1s, although as we know, mixing of the types was widespread.  BK

On 06/11/2022 at 21:22, RFS said:

 I took a screen snapshot of the 2nd and 3rd coaches. The 2nd (as was the first already past) seems clearly still in varnished malachite as late as this date. You obviously can't tell the exact colours, but the contrast is remarkable.  

 

 

Looking back at this handy 1966 screen grab, from the previous page, I notice this coach in malachite has gained the horizontal strips, which suggests the body has been re-clad. This probably happened in the 1950s, but obviously before the c.1959/60 switch to the darker shade, as seen on the coach behind.   BK

Thanks Robert, it's a shame there's been a printing error on the malachite compos and brakes, that'll be an expensive mistake, but we're all human. I removed the factory printing by just careful scraping, I didn't use any chemicals.

   Since the SK re-numbering has worked for me, I will look forward to the eventual arrival of the other two types, so I can repeat the exercise with a three-coach set. It's usually best to keep coaches within a set the same shade, but overall I welcome a variety of livery shades, which can include weathered stock.   BK

When SR green was revived in 1956, it does seem to have been a very similar shade to the pre-nat. SRly malachite, with a bluey-green appearance. Around 1959/60 there seems to have been a switch to a deeper yellowy-oily-green, similar or closer to the late EMU shade, probably in the hope that it would wear better? In my opinion Bachmann's BR green on the new 2-coach sets, is spot on for the 1960s repaints, and their SRly. malachite SK looks appropriate for the late 1950s paint jobs, which of course survived into the 60s, alongside the new darker shade, as seen in recent posts above. Lots, but not all, of these Bulleids had their bodies re-clad in later years, indicated by the horizontal (and sometimes vertical as well) beading strips, which covered up the joins, full marks to Bachmann for adding these to the BR green versions.

    So I took the plunge, and bought one malachite SK as a guinea pig (btw, there were only five, 1932-36), removed the factory lettering, and re-numbered it with Fox's BR yellow numerals. I'm happy with the result, this will be a "loose" add-on coach, apparently the matching brakes and compos are delayed?

                                                         Cheers, Brian

Sad news, lovely chap, always ready for a chat and a laugh at shows. It was a cruel twist that one so creative and productive, would succumb to Parkinson's, yet he carried on, where others would have just given up. He inspired me in my humble efforts, I adopted a lot of his ideas, like sound insulated baseboards, loco chassis mods, and countless scenic techniques.

     Who could ever forget about 20 years ago at Scaleforum, he popped up with his "Challenge (Anneka) Rice" point building roadshow, complete with banner (the title was a play on a topical TV show with Anneka Rice) where he was trying to encourage more people to build their own track and points, the challenge was could you build a point in less than half-an-hour (he could, and wanted to show everyone, how straightforward it could be). I turned up with my quick and easy fiddle yard version, a chopped up and re-gauged Peco point. Anneka, I mean Iain, stared at it in stunned silence, then broke into a beaming smile, while he quickly grabbed some wagons to try running through it, whilst we all got the giggles. It didn't matter how crude or terrible my effort was, he always welcomed new ideas.

      I'm from North London, I have a feeling Iain was from North-East London, maybe Chingford or Loughton, but I can't be sure? Chingford to Chagford?

       He will be greatly missed.

                                        Brian Kirby