APT Fan

3 hours ago, MattR said:

Thank you for the explanation, gentlemen. I shall weather away then!

Just curious, does weathering tend to add value to a loco when you move them on?

093 and 120 on extensive testing before introduction into traffic.

So I've just been going through my records and my 56 fleet was reduced from 4 to 1 a couple of years ago after moving on 3 Dapol locos which I'd converted to DCC and added lighting. The Hornby Rail-freight was £100 3.5 years ago and over £200 by the time I'd fitted sound. I was due to purchase a Hornby LL 56 in 2022 but didn't bother as I'd pre-ordered the Cavalex's, plus the price for a DC version had gone up to £218 and I really didn't want to put sound into another model which didn't have adequate provisioning.

I'm surprised but the 47 is now about 16 months old, it feels newer! It was £289 with sound on pre-order and disappointingly doesn't have working fans but still a great model considering it replaced a Lima 47 which was also moved on after again being converted to DCC plus lighting. So my 56 fleet is now at 3 with the arrival of the two Cavalex LL's, the 47 will have to fill the gap for now unless perhaps a Cavalex BR Blue 56 is still available when my finances stabilise. Once these have settled in, I'd like to try my hand at double heading (Consisting) I struggled to get it working last time I tried but might have a better chance with two identical locos.

5 hours ago, rob D2 said:

It’s interesting that most of the sound version are sold out . Thats £300 worth of toys …cost of living crisis ?….nah people will always find a way to get the GOODIES ….;)

Most people want DCC nowadays and if you want sound its normally more economical to buy the factory version. In terms of budget I get the impression that people are not spending as often, its taken a couple of years for these to turn up so the money is spent over a longer period of time. Once the price of a single loco regularly gets above £300 then that might be a bit harder to swallow in one go for customers. We'll see, I said earlier in the thread that these are selling well because Cavalex are providing the customers with what they want. We've had a few let downs from some manufacturers in the last couple of years. 

25 minutes ago, Davidjsmith said:

My 56008 did the same thing sounded like drive shaft? Ran hesitantly for ten minutes then stopped just making the noise .Sending it back for a replacement tomorrow. Lovely model just frustrating!

Yeah I was thinking either drive shaft or gears and it definitely isn't going away. Glad I had another model running in the opposite direction to compare it too. This was the one that had twisted slightly on it guides during transit, not saying it caused the problem but can't have helped. I think the packing could be improved as there is a void around the actual when screwed to the mount.

Oh dear I think I have a problem. I've been running in 56 093 and 56 120 this afternoon and whilst 56 093 seems okay, 56 120 is making what I can only describe as an intermittent grinding sound so I've stopped running it. I think it will have to go back which is the last thing I need after the week I've had, such a hassle. I assume the first port of call is the retailer?

But what could the noise be? Seems to be coming from the rear bogie and is more pronounced on bends or when there is a slight track deviation.

16 hours ago, SRman said:

I have only just been invoiced by Rails for mine, so it'll be a while before I receive it, but following some of the discussions over the last few topic pages, I have formed the following thoughts.

A1A-A1A as opposed to C-C drive for the models works fine for me. I have quite a few older Heljan diesels, such as class 47s, 57s, 52s, 58s, Falcon, Lion and Kestrel (there may be others I haven't listed), and all have the centre axle floating axles and 8-wheel drive, with great track-holding on uneven parts, and excellent haulage power - my usual comment is they'll pull the side out of the house given the chance!

For the dual function F2, one of the first things I'll be doing is popping it on the programming track connected to the LokProgrammer, which makes it easy to swap functions around, and how they operate. My intention will be to alter the F2 and F25 combination so that the horns are with F25 on, and the brake is with it off. Easy to do with the LokProgrammer, and probably almost as easy with JMRI Decoder  Pro. It can be done with CV changes as well, but that would mean reading the LokSound manual! 😅

 

I have a couple of the Hornby models, and they are by no means bad models, and still very presentable now, but the Cavalex one is quite a few steps above that, and I am really looking forward to receiving mine in due course.
 

Your definitely on to something here, having F3 and F4 set to momentary action provides a great playable two tone horn, just like the real thing. Not having the brake available all the time is quite annoying especially a s I'm so used to it. Be nice to know how make the changes via CVs.

24 minutes ago, SRman said:

I have only just been invoiced by Rails for mine, so it'll be a while before I receive it, but following some of the discussions over the last few topic pages, I have formed the following thoughts.

A1A-A1A as opposed to C-C drive for the models works fine for me. I have quite a few older Heljan diesels, such as class 47s, 57s, 52s, 58s, Falcon, Lion and Kestrel (there may be others I haven't listed), and all have the centre axle floating axles and 8-wheel drive, with great track-holding on uneven parts, and excellent haulage power - my usual comment is they'll pull the side out of the house given the chance!

For the dual function F2, one of the first things I'll be doing is popping it on the programming track connected to the LokProgrammer, which makes it easy to swap functions around, and how they operate. My intention will be to alter the F2 and F25 combination so that the horns are with F25 on, and the brake is with it off. Easy to do with the LokProgrammer, and probably almost as easy with JMRI Decoder  Pro. It can be done with CV changes as well, but that would mean reading the LokSound manual! 😅

 

I have a couple of the Hornby models, and they are by no means bad models, and still very presentable now, but the Cavalex one is quite a few steps above that, and I am really looking forward to receiving mine in due course.
 

So is the purpose to get easy access to the brake? A good idea, I think the F2 horn seems a bit redundant anyway with the playable being on F3/F4. 

7 minutes ago, RBE said:

The loco is better for not having all wheel drive as it allows all wheels to stay in contact withe the track for road holding, and pick-up. Having the centre axle powered give no benefit and in fact hinders performance sometimes because of it. 

 

I am planning a video explaining all this as some point so I'll post links to that when I have had 5 mins to put it together!

I think the poster was agreeing with you (3rd para).😉

1 hour ago, ac1874 said:

Nice one and thanks for the super quick response at 9:35pm on a Saturday night....Presumably on what has been a crazy busy week. FOMO kicking in, better put another order in....

Agreed that's dedication for you, maybe that's one of the reasons why these are selling out in no time. It is an iconic loco that has finally been reproduced in model form with the care, detail and quality and price that many of us have been searching for for years. We are finally seeing manufacturers deliver what we actually want as customers and I wish Cavalex every success with this project and future projects. I think they will be backed by us customers as they are actually listening to us and taking notice.

21 minutes ago, RBE said:

This issue with sourcing alternative decoders is whether the functions are set up on the decoder to control the functions on the loco correctly. The Loksounds that we will do will be set up properly with a list of functions.  No reason that you can't do the same at home if you have equipment that can program functions on the decoder.

Agreed I've fitted a couple of aftermarket ESU Loksound decoders with excellent sound projects but have often found them less than optimal and it is the main reason why I always opt for factory fitted sound where possible. I was answering on the assumption that the poster was mainly just looking to fit a DCC decoder, which is a more straight forward problem if you are okay programming CVs and comfortable with speed profiles.

3 hours ago, RBE said:

That's all well and good but every controller doesn't have the ability to choose. My Prodigy for instance only has momentary on F2 so that's that. All of the sounds except the horns and brake should be latching really though. The compressor works automatically anyway but can be put on constant using the function, the manual flange squeal will do it's thing whilever it's engaged but it's not a constant screech so works well as a latched function and is also loco speed dependent as to what sounds it plays, it plays none over a certain speed as well. 

 

To be honest though we just assumed that people would set up their equipment as they see fit after playing with how the sounds worked. 

As others have said, the point is all down to how the sound file has been designed. So the designer will know what the intended use should be, that's why I was surprised not to see it documented. Nearly all the sound files seem to use F2 for the brake function, so that fits in with the momentary action mentioned and perhaps it might be a problem with some controllers if it were not F2. For the door slam Hornby TTS use a momentary action which makes perfect sense to me, Bachmann use a latch but state it is on/off so at least I know I have to press it twice to reset it, otherwise I'd be guessing. Not a big deal but I'm sure this information must be available from the designer.

30 minutes ago, Marcoblanco said:

ok thanks.. I have a few decoders around and may experiment or one option is a HM7000 sound decoder which has Aux fcts on 21-24.. I believe

You'll need a decoder with a minimum of 8 outputs by the looks of it. Cabs x 2, head lights (4 off) x 2, Spotlights x 2, tail lights (4 off) x 2. In the past I've used the Dapol Imperium 3 for such an application but the LokPliot is a similar spec and price. I'd go with whatever the manufacturer recommends, so if that's a LokPilot then go with that - make sure its the correct version. I fitted the Dapol Imperium 3 into a Dapol O gauge 121 at their recommendation, they also stated that a v2 decoder did not have enough outputs for all the lighting functions.

It looks like the Hornby HM7000 has at least 8 outputs, I thought I'd read that not all can be DCC controlled, only Bluetooth which sounds a bit odd, so I'd check that as I might be misreading it.

27 minutes ago, Roy Langridge said:

No. For example, some horns are momentary, some latching, so the question is relevant as it depends on how the sound file has been designed. 
 

Roy

Exactly, air valves and compressors do they time out or are they continuous? Same with flange noises (manual), do you press every time you want the noise or is it a continuous random sound? All my Hornby and Bachmann factory fitted sound instructions define whether the functions should be latched or momentary. Hornby TTS instructions are very detailed explaining exactly what the sound function does.

3 hours ago, APT Fan said:

 

The function list does not show whether controls should be momentary or latching?

Anybody?

1 minute ago, spamcan61 said:

The way I read that is with F25 on then F2 is brake.

Yes I read it that way but why combine it with notching? I want the brake available at all times, its quite important. Hopefully it will make sense when I run it, I'm speculating a bit with this. The main thing is I need to know about momentary / latching which is also quite important.

Two arrived yesterday, not run them yet but first impressions are that they are up there with the Bachy 47s and a significant step up from the Hornby 56. I like the fan grills, much better than the Hornby concave version which I always found a bit odd. The rail guards are the same as the Hornby one's that always snap off, so need to be careful with them. Doesn't normally bother me but I wasn't impressed with the packaging, one of the locos had twisted slightly off its guides in transit and the magnetic roof piece had become dislodged. Luckily it doesn't look like there is any damage to paintwork etc. The package hasn't been knocked about but I think this could happen quite a bit given that there is no contact packaging around the roof or sides.

The function list does not show whether controls should be momentary or latching? Also I find it odd to have a function like F2 controlling two completely different types of function horn/brake depending upon the mode. I don't think I've seen that before but the manual brake is an important function that I use a lot - so which one is it? Normally F2 on Bachy Zimos and ESUs.

10 hours ago, BritishRail60062 said:

Get one mate. You won't regret it! They are nice models. Although from my observations from the performance when I reviewed mine tonight. I feel that all wheel drive would have been a better option to have gone for. Not moaning, just some constructive feedback. 

There are advantages to not having all wheel drive on a co-co. From 11:00:-

7 minutes ago, IRC said:

Getting jealous as well. I have two on order from Collets so hopefully Leigh can get them out to customers early next week.

I am wobbling though. Is two enough having seen the fantastic images?!?

Does anyone know when 074 lost its beacon and gained the NRN aerial? It seems to still have the beacon in late 1988. I run 87 - 89, so any help would be appreciated.

One of these? Now that would be something!

This is a great picture of it. A lot of horsepower in that yard.

4 minutes ago, Roy Langridge said:

Those A/S Class 37 lights are just as they should be in my opinion. They were not lit up like Christmas Trees. 
 

Roy

We had this discussion in the Bachmann 37 thread, I have two both with Domino head code boxes in which the lighting is 'spot' on! The cab lighting on the 37/3 is quite a bit brighter than the 37/0 and I prefer the latter but neither are in your face. I vaguely seem to remember being able to dim lighting within reason by changing some CV settings, but I haven't messed around with CVs for ages. In the thread we also discussed painting the LEDs with clear orange paint to reduce brightness / change the colour. A bit like some car indicator light bulbs!

Incidentally I went for the Bachmann instead of the A/S as I just wanted a plain old BR Blue which A/S didn't do plus I was picking up SFXs for less than the A/S Sound versions and a 37 as isn't a must have for me but I'm still delighted with them. I only really like the 37 in BR Blue and think LL livery really doesn't suit them. The Class 56 on the other hand is perfect for the LL livery. 

7 minutes ago, Dicky L said:

Yes and no input from me, it's automatic. 

Its' this feature isn't it?

automatically provides the characteristic screech as the wheels enter sharp curves. Not having to activate the sound manually only adds to the immersive effect whilst driving the locomotive. 

I believe that's what the Hall effect sensor is for, it's very realistic.

4 minutes ago, Dicky L said:

A short video of 56055 with sound. 

 

 

Is that 'flange squeal' I can hear as it rounds the bend?

7 hours ago, blueeighties said:

Looking at that prototype roof picture, they may well be spaced off the roof, but I can't see it. And that earlier Loadhaul model image looks as though there is a 'space' of a good 4 or 5 scale inches, that is simply not correct. And regarding the roof colour, I'm not judging from a photograph, I'm judging from experience of the real thing in all conditions, weathered, ex works, and everything in between.

Congragulations on an excellent model, it's just a shame a few of the details let it down. And let's turn the clock back a few years pre Cavalex Models, when you were only too happy to point out miniscule deficiencies with other manufacturers models. It works both ways!

Wow how bitter are you? Proper keyboard warrior stuff that! 😀

On 24/01/2024 at 22:53, RBE said:

That was as soon as it was announced. It's been just over 2.5 years from sending the CADs for tooling to delivery which we feel is very good going especially with the issues in China.

It was actually a very timely announcement as I had placed a pre-order for the Hornby version, which was late but had just started to arrive. Anyway I managed to cancel that pre-order and move it over to the Cavalex version. Being able to order a model with factory fitted sound is a significant differentiator for me provided its reasonably priced. I'm quite surprised how buoyant the analogue market still is, unless people are fitting their own decoders, be interesting to see the figures in terms of how many models actually end up being run on DC.

1 hour ago, richscylla said:

Seen a few people say the wait has been worth it, but I don't think it's been that long since it was announced. Feels like it's come together in a fairly normal timescale!

My Pre-order went in June 2021.

5 hours ago, The Fatadder said:

For me it is the tail lights I find particularly annoying on older stock vs the latest models where you can turn them off at the press of a button.   All of my Bachmann / Heljan / Vitrains stuff has been rewired now to get rid of it, but the Hornby 60s remain a frustration thanks to Hornby's stupid wiring...

 

 

On that very subject, I had the two 37s hauling loads the other day but being driven from cab no.2 end. The purpose was to give the locos some running in the reverse direction. Anyway there doesn't seem to be the capability to turn off the tail lights whilst having the head lights lit, unless I'm missing something?