john dew

That is curious..........just for greater certainty and my apologies for asking the obvious:

Do you alway start programming with the house at Track 1 and do you always finish programming from the direction in which you started....ie start clockwise..last movement before finalising should be clockwise with the house at the new track ?

Even though you dont have spurs opposite the entry tracks do you separately programme the house to the non existent spur aligning the non house end to the entry track? You should have two separate commands for each entry track..

Have you tried deleting the non house track and reprogramming?

Your modification looks great......far better than the HO house

Time and space are very curious.......many many years ago I lived in Formby!

Has anyone had any alignment problems like here?

Not me.

Some questions

[1] If you calibrate does the problem go away or is it always there after a 180o turn

[2] How many tracks have this problem?

[3] Lets say the track with the house is Track 4.........is the reverse a separately programmed track# or are you keying in Track 4 or the DCC equivalent 

Off topic....I like your replacement for the house could I ask where it came from?

Regards

  Thanks John.......but I think it is glass for my paint water! Proper glasses next post

Best wishes

This post is mostly a record of progress.......the shots are not great but hopefully tell the story 




The final baseboard is now in and secured. All the remaining tracks radiating from the TT are in place, wired up and indexed.


The roof has been finished on the partially completed GWR shed covering tracks 4, 5 and 6









The drains between the roof segments are Woodlands scenic I profile painted mucky brown.......I am still fiddling with both the quantity and the best way of fabricating the ventilators




 Next to the shed are track#s 3, 2 and 1..............these will eventually be covered by a continuation of the GWR roundhouse shed

The road with the tracksetta and pit is for the wheeldrop and a small workshop  (actually the Scalescene single road shed from which I got the main shed entrances)

Next to that are the two LMS roads......I am a little undecided about the curve.....it was a saw off between having a decent straight run off from the TT and getting the tracks parallel for the 2 road shed.......its somewhat sharper than I would have wished...... its not a huge issue operationally because that road will be used by smaller locos......I just need to convince myself it is visually ok

Finally the big operational plus that will result from this project.....between the shed roads and the existing mainline I have managed to squeeze in 3 carriage sidings......more of this in the next post

Here is a close up of the Ratio wheel drop ex Granby II



I will set dummy track for it between the hardstanding


I plonked a couple of buildings on just to see how it would look....imagining the GWR shed is extended by 3 more units




The Scalescene Workshop needs some detailing....Chimney/Doors etc but otherwise looks the part. I am less certain about the Metcalfe unit



Its another survivor from Granby II (but only just!) It will need a lot of TLC but even then I am not sure how it will stand up against the Scalescene finish.......perhaps a temporary stop gap until I run out of things to do!



I am not going to be able to place all the buildings that I think would be associated with this size of shed but I will try and scratchbuild some small structures at the back to suggest a booking in office and maybe a mess room. The aim is create a sense that the complex has developed, over a number of years, in a rather haphazard fashion in response to everchanging techniques and demands........which is what I imagine happened on the prototype

My apologies for a somewhat dry and dusty post......I have had my head down beavering away......even been running locos on the reception track and TT.......and I kind of got behind with my correspondence!

I havent done any intensive operation yet but I have done a lot of testing..................the indexing is accurate and consistent...........I calibrate as a precaution at the start of a session and whenever the bridge is replaced. I have only had it lose indexing once and that may have been driver error and calibration fixed it

The teeth of the bridge track are much more narrowly placed than Fleischmann (I have a very old manual version converted to DCC/RR&Co)  and as such subject to collecting debris.......they appear to have magnetic properties for single pieces of loose ballast......so in addition to calibrating I have a morning brush out  

HTH

Try locking the left hand entrance to 70.2........that should work........and then unlock at end of schedule

We seem to be at similar stages with our Heljan...............I havent tried any schedules yet....hopefully tomorrow.....but I have done a lot of testing on the laptop using the simulator and for my purposes (which are, I think, slightly different from yours) I have come to the conclusion it is better to run a schedule from the entry block to the bridge (having first ensured the bridge is there!) and then move the bridge and then run a schedule from the bridge to the service road (at the conclusion of this schedule I return the bridge to the entry road.

Regards.

Hi Kent

It sounds like a TT quirk TC has reserved the route to 69-4 - 36 and I am guessing that because it knows it is a TT route it locks the Turntable (note the reference to the TT and not the block in the error message) then it attempts to reserve the next block (36 the Bridge) which is already locked by virtue of being part of the TT

A couple of work arounds occur to me.....remove the rule that is causing the problem and then either:

 [1] make 36 Bridge a critical block ie the route and 70-2 must be clear before 36 can be reserved

or

[2] Make it a schedule condition that Block 70-2 is empty or its associated contact indicator is inactive

Hope this helps

Regards

Thanks Kent

That is broadly the same as the method I used......I rather wish I had removed the pre programmed tracks but I didnt think it through so my 6 round house tracks straddle TT track 2.............the numbering is so confusing with 4 discrete sets of numbers......Heljan/Lenz/RR&Co and actual.......I had to construct a spreadsheet to keep track (sorry!) of them all

I havent thought through the direction of leaving yet.....I will have to deal with that once I start scheduling!

Regards

Thanks Mikkel.................glad you like it. I have to say progress doesnt seem that fast to me and I am not spendng any time at all running trains. Hopefully that will change pretty soon.

Best Wishes

John

Originally this post was to be a celebration of the last spike but that will have to wait until next week.

I have been diverted by John Flann my modelling neighbour (he lives in Utah about 2000 miles east of Vancouver)

For the past three years John, in addition to entertaining us all with his tales of Little Hintock, has been, to me, a constant source of advice, assistance and encouragement. 

This time he has surpassed himself........after my comments/concerns about the shed roof in my last post I received the following:













Pretty impressive and amazingly helpful. 

So I discarded my previous fuzzy concepts and attempted to put his idea into practice.


Here are the three sub rooves cut out



I can see there is already an advantage.....I will rig some sort of drain between each roof  leading to a grating in the unplanned notch that has appeared between each gable

Coping stones will eventually finish off the tops of the walls and gables

Adapting the North Lights was more than a little tricky

The North Lights for the kit comprise 4 rows each with two lights that completely span the two roads........our plan is 3 rows each with a single light
 
These components probably give a better idea of the standard layout




These have to be cut down to a single light for each roof




These shots are of my second batch by which time I had learned the importance of prefolding the cover sheets (at the bottom)!

Once the openings are cut out the side pieces are added and the units joined together in a sub assembly



Corner pieces on light card conceal the butt joints

The unfinished strip on the side is where, on the original kit, the sub assembly is glued to the sidewalls

The next shot shows the individual rooves fitted and an aperture cut in the main roof to accommodate the sub assembly




The sub assembly sunk into the roof with flashing added




The roof is clad with Scalescenes Pebbledash which I think suggests the the granite chippings one finds on industrial flat rooves


Now actually installed......the paper is wrapped around in true Scalescene fashion and as the original card was cut to size creates a nice snug fit.



There is a little touching up still to do and eventually some weathering.

The kit comes with some rather flimsy cut out ventilators.....I need to do a bit more work on them to make them more robust.




Overall the effect is exactly what I had in mind (and hopefully what John had in mind) so I am pretty happy and more than a little relieved..........thank you again John

The gables are perhaps a little redundant......I built them when I was thinking of a pitched roof and subsequently changed my mind......its kind of late to change so either the GWR architect also changed his mind or he opted for a decorative facade!

One down.......... Five to go

Although first I have to build 3 more sheds........and before I can do that we need the last spike!

Hi Kent

I had exactly the same experience as you with the + and - functions using Lenz DCC. The only way I could get consistent results was to use one address for the house and the next address for the separately programmed opposing track (even if it was passive) to get the non house end to the running track

The system I have devised for RR&Co is more than a little Heath Robinson. The TT is set up as Generic and I use a toggle switch set up with the address say 225 to actually move the bridge (I ignore the the +-). Thus there are two toggle switches for each track................one for House (225) and one for Non House (226).     Obviously where two tracks are facing, the two switches for one track serve both

To update the the mimic TT on the switchboard I have an On/Off switch set up for operations......again two for each track House and Non House.......

The on off switch will be activated by schedules as required. The operations for each switch are :

Matching Toggle Switch ON

Turntable ......the command is changed to 'Move bridge with house to Track x

On/Off Switch   OFF

I have 12 tracks (only two facing) so I have just finished setting up 20 switches and 20 toggle switches.

I am busy building the Engine Shed area so I havent yet written any schedules but the switches themselves are tested.

I will be interested to hear how your set up works I suspect it will be a far more elegant solution than mine.

Once again thank you for the "likes" gentlemen!                Lots of progress with the Engine Shed.

Its being built using components from the Scalescenes two road north light shed. The outer walls are standard Scalescene.........2 x 2mm card core, window apertures cut out.....  covered with printed paper..... laminated together.......  and then finished with buttresses and plinths.





There are no internal walls in the kit so I modified the external walls by cutting the window spaces to the floor creating passage ways between the units

The kit entrance spans both roads.......this would not work with 6 roads radiating from a TT so I used the gabled entrance from the small engine shed that John introduced last spring






Although I didnt start this project until late fall I have had a sort of grand design for some time.

I printed out a load of components for the shed, cut the card to size and took it all away on the boat.........amazing how much can be done in a marina or sheltered anchorage

Net result I came home with 7 almost completed walls and 6 entrances......almost because I forgot to print the windows!

With most of the components all to hand, assembly was surprisingly quick




I started off with the centre road and made sure the entrance was exactly at right angles to the track (and central.....I made a template and for greater certainty tested with real locos)

The first wall was attached exactly bisecting the "Pie slice" between the tracks.....buttresses on both sides provided a solid base for glueing and overcame both visually and practically non 90o joints

Only when completely dry (somewhat late in life I am learning to be patient) did I secure the second wall using the same approach.

Once dry the end piece was cut to size and fitted in place

As I suspected there was a variation in the angle of the roads resulting in the end pieces varying in length.......it wasnt quite as bad as I feared although it may haunt me when I fit the roof

So here are 3 of the six units completed





Rightly or wrongly I decided to only have two of the six ends with windows.......I dont think I am going to detail the interior and the windows are pretty grimy anyway.


The small shed comes with exterior vents so I may make some up and put them on the solid walls





The outer wall is at 90o .......primarily to save space .


And from the front:





If I hadnt been taking progress photos I doubt if I would have been able to correct the alignment of buttress #2.......fortunately the glue hadnt dried when I previewed the shot!

In truth the roof is haunting me already......the Scalescene kit has north lights made up in modules that are parallell to the entrance and spanning the two side walls.......clearly this will not work with the shape (whatever it should be called) that I am constructing.

I have played around with a couple of ideas but wont come to a decision until the other 3 units are built..........but I cant do that until the second board is secured and the balance of the service tracks laid

The good news, now that I have the first 3 units built, it is relatively easy to mark out the exact location of the remaining 3 and then check the clearances and mark out the carriage sidings and final point...............tomorrow's job




 

Thanks for the "likes" guys!

This last week I got myself, not for the first time, in a Catch 22 situation

All the work so far has been on the one board......which is wired up and screwed to the joists.......




In addition to the Entry and Exit Roads the TT has a road for the Sandhouse and six roads for the GWR Shed

I am hoping to add a road for the Wheeldrop and if I can 2 roads for an LMS Shed......which would,I believe, be similar to Birkenhead.......joint site but separate Engine Sheds.

None of this can be done until the second board is in position.



 I decided against inspection pits for the shed service roads but I do want one for the Wheeldrop siding.......so this has to be marked up and the aperture cut out off site............I also need to install the tortoise for the carriage sidings

Geometry is not my strong point .......right angles I can handle but the GWR shed will be pie shaped and although I was pretty careful setting up the service roads I was not comfortable that each angle was identical........a difference of 1/8" at the TT extrapolates to something significantly greater at the end of the 24" service road.

In short I wasnt absolutely certain where the right hand outer wall of the shed would finish up......................so instead of laying track I decided to build half the shed so I would have a better visual handle on the space available..........not exactly City and Guilds draughtmanship! 


So the first job was to get the foundations for the shed set up.......I had already been playing about with levels and determined that two layers of Matt Board (Mount in the UK?) would keep the level just below the code 83 rail

I had thought of covering the top layer with Scalescene paper like I did for the Warehouse but the concrete is more suitable for street scenes....lots of tyre marks

So I decided to try painting the boards a mucky grey......it took a while to get it adequately covered  and despite a lot of effort tended to look flat.......rather like painted matt board

My wife suggested they lacked texture.

So I lightly scored the boards and then with the back of a scalpel made the cut a little more obvious .......creating expansion joints






Then using my wife's pastels I highligted the cuts



Rubbed the black into the cracks and added touches of brown and grey




And here it is in position........The lighting is different but hopefully you can see the effect




I know I should have inspection pits but doubted my ability to cut out the apertures after the TT was calibrated and in any event the track here is code 83 not the 100 on the pits I saved from Granby II........similarly I decided against check rails. I spent forever doing them on the warehouse but once it was in position (a) you couldnt see them and (b) the slightest error messed up the operation









Half of the area will be covered by the shed....but all in all I am reasonably happy with the effect

Now that I have a level (?) surface I can start assembling half the shed 

 

Hi Harold

You havent exactly been overwhelmed with responses! Stuff sure gets buried quickly here.

I had a similar problem with Lenz DCC. The Heljan documentation isnt good and instructions on paper differ from those published on the web.

You may have already done the following in which case I apologise

[1] Programming for each new track should always start with the house at Track 1

[2] You can move the bridge back and forth using the two arrow buttons while you zero in on the new track but the direction of the final movement should always be the same as the initial movement from Track 1 ( I go clockwise)

[3] The house must always be at the the new track# when saving

[4] If you have a track at 9 oclock and another immediately opposite both must be programmed

[5] Even if you have a track at 12 oclock and no actual track at 6 oclock you should still programme a notional or passive track# at 6

[4] and [5] above create duplication in that you double the number of accessory numbers  but I was unable to get consistent results using a single accessory# to control whether the house was or was not facing the selected track

Using the above concept of a dedicated Accessory# for the house for each track# (including passive track#s) I can achieve consistent bridge orientation. using either Lenz alone or Lenz with RR&Co

Hope this helps

I have got a little behind with my posting.......I like watching Rugby and there is always a delay re playing in Canada......so when the Six Nations are on I switch off the computor in case I see the result!     All is well I can now continue:

I have been working on the ramp that serves the coaling station.........

This shot shows the issue I had with the surface mounted Tortoise.......It was both higher than the coal ramp and closer to the service line than I wished



 

The shot show how little clearance there is under the base board for the mineral trains......hence the 1/4" ply mounted on the normal 3/4" baseboard and the surface mounted Tortoise

Ply supports for the ramp and card formers set out the shape of the embankment





Add some walls and pillars rescued from Granby II and repainted.


I have been struggling with how to handle the space behind the coal station and indeed the continuation beyond over the window sill and I have finally come up with this solution





In an abundance of caution the foamboard above the tortoise is removeable!

The embankment and retaining wall have been extended to the edge of the baseboard

The white card on the main baseboard is the underlay for the "concrete" infill





The formers are covered with masking tape and tissue paper soaked in PVA


You will probably recognise the Metcalfe Warehouse that has been modified to low relief........it was originally destined to hide the storage yards on the other side of the room.......but I was never really happy with it there.........I think it has more potential over here




Green/Brown acrylic paint roughly applied.

The front retaining wall completed



Woodland Scenics grass added

A hand point lever has been added to give some sort of purpose for the Tortoise alcove. 

The intermediate retaining wall completed

Wills wood fencing tops the embankment .........as you can see I ran out but supplies are speeding their way across the Atlantic from Cornwall

In the foreground.... a tentative attempt to replicate concrete


Shot cropped to remove the fence gap.........the foam platform will eventually be extended, as will the low relief factory, behind the coaling station.

Finally a distance shot to show the project in the context of the layout as a whole

It also shows the start of the next phase......the second baseboard is loosely in position along with some more service roads  and I am now fiddling with the initial placement of the Engine Shed

Hi John

 

I think the overall look you have got there is good, even the close ups are nowhere near as bad as you seem to think they are. Remember if you don't point things out people never notice them. That shot of the lamp is particularly good.

 

Looking forward to seeing even more now.

 

Jim

Thanks Jim......thats very civil of you........your layout was one of the ones I had in mind when I repeated my "broad brush" caveat. I am still recoverig from the shock and awe at seeing the exquisite truss and tile work on your shed and continue making unfavourable comparisons with my own attempts

You make an interesting point about the writer drawing attention to defects before the reader has noticed them. I know that I, like many others, am frequently guilty of this. I dont think it is entirely false modesty..... I thinkabout one is so close to the model and the fault is perceived to be so glaring (albeit not glaring enough to be scrapped)  that one feels obliged to tell the reader about it in advance.......when in reality it is so minor it would have gone unnoticed!

Thanks for the positive comments and all the "likes" guys ........much appreciated

Kit-bashing and a 43xx again. What is there not to like? :-)

 

Thanks for the tip about the stanchions, John, they could save a lot of fiddly work.

Thanks Mikkel........they come in a one or two rail version....I tend to use the latter. They are great for guard rails on gantry signals.......much quicker to do and look far better than super glueing horizontal and vertical wire

COALING STATION and WATER TANK

This can be seen lurking in the background of some of the previous posts.......lurking because it was built some 7 years ago for Granby II and incurred a certain amount of collateral damage while the layout was demolished, we moved house and it was "stored" in the railway room until now.

I spent a few days last week on TLC repairs and improvements


Its a scratch built/ kit bashed attempt at modelling what I believe was a GWR standard design for medium sized depots.

I based it on these two (rather poor) photographs that I took on my one visit to Didcot 16 years ago






The main components were obtained from two of these Ratio Water Towers plus Wills Brick Sheets etc




This is a completed model that is North of the main station and services the Panniers and Prairies that provide the frequent local trains to and from Chester and Birkenhead




Back to Newyd Shed itself, South of the station........here is the renovated building in position

 




Some of the close ups that follow to show the detail are not for the fainthearted.......I have always claimed to be broad brush, coarse gauge and I think that caveat/warning is worth repeating.....particularly as I have been browsing the threads of some of the guys who are following this one....................even the poor focus cant hide many of the bodges

In my defence the viewing distance is over 3'........twice CJ Freezers 18" rule


Whatever......here is the right of the building




Protective railing using Ratio stantions........really handy item

Notice telling staff to ensure Wagon Brakes are on......there is another out of shot at right angles "No Engines beyond this Point"

Fire Iron Rack and Grounded Van Body.....(for Cotton Waste?)



Next .......the actual Coaling Point









The scratch built tub isnt really correct ........they actually had a very ingenious system that acted both as a stop and a tipping fulchrum............I have a slight clearance issue so I invoked the 18" rule (incidentally there is a guy pushing the tub.....but you will have to believe me!)



The lights are a hotch potch of bits and pieces





Exceptionally cruel closeup of the inspection hatch......Ratio Stantions again make life a lot easier










More flattering long shot showing start of the access steps and also  how the building fits over the coal ramp






The platform is from a Ratio Signal Box as is the staircase


The original model had a very unlikely brick staircase I decided to scrap it and build a proper wooden staircase like the prototype






For those of you who havent built one of these it is a right pain with each tread having to be cut out and fixed at precise right angles to the riser............doing two of them is even worse!

Fortunately the total rise of two sets  plus a little landing just covered the rise from floor to door and with the addition of a hurriedly built storage hut makes the area look reasonably credible








To finish.......how it hopefully looked in 1948





 

Hi Jules

Spent an idyllic morning yesterday, before the Rugby and Super Bowl, reading your thread from start to finish..........absolutely fascinating.........dont understand how it slipped off my radar!

I didnt want to clutter your in box with too many "like" notifications but I was sorely tempted. Despite the relatively small layout you have created a very spacious feel.......exactly how I feel a sleepy GWR country branch should be. I do admire your use of detailing.....not overdone but sufficient to clearly stamp time, place and company.

I also admire the way you strive after accuracy........after the post about hand point levers I rushed downstairs to check mine.....I fear Mike will not be totally impressed. 

Wonderful layout......thank you for sharing it

Hi John Cambrian Kits do a nice 40 tonner it would be a bit more in keeping with the amount of loco's you would have on a six road shed.

I like your layout I've been keeping an eye on the thread for a while and enjoying it, so more pictures please.

81C

Good point and thank you for suggesting it. I did think about it but the GWR link I referred to, implied that not too many 40 tonners were actually built.......I agree for the size of the depot 10T is probably too small......but  I already had 4 Wagons and before I had worked this out I ordered a few more Cambrian kits which are now about to wend their way from Cornwall to the Pacific North West

Glad you like the thread.

Regards

Hi John 

 

Some great shots again there, especially that shed again.

 

I usually prefer the B&W pictures as they look like real old photographs but in this case the colour shows how much work went into that shed with the weathering detail and it looks great.

 

Keep the posts coming.

 

Jim

Thanks Jim........ much appreciated

Like you I prefer B&W shots if only to see how I am measuring up against my various sources which are, of course, all B&W. In this case though I think you are right somehow a couple of the colour shots have captured the atmosphere better

Kind Regards

I have got somewhat behind with the updates......last week end I spent a happy morning detailing

I confess I like detailing......it marks the end of the section of a project......but in truth.........I like detailing

The charcoal ash got distribuited (literally...........one unintended sneeze had dramatic results).........I think it has worked pretty well.....maybe a little light in colour.....certainly in density......the usual practice of dampening with a squirt from the scent spray required a little modification










Pretty comfortable these are the correct wagons for the ash (and the right colour!) In a previous layout I used wooden bodied wagons.......not the best choice for hot ash!

I have a feeling they should be labelled "Ash only"




Closeup......manual shovelling from pit to wheelbarrow




Water Hydrant.....not that frequently modelled although they appear frequently in shed shots............and water hose



Sorry about the angle! Levers for the triple point with guard.......Booking in clerk outside his office

This is obviously for locos booking into the depot.........there will be another set of booking in offices outside the sheds for engine crew.........have I got the names correct or was there some form of differentiation?





Flagman  and rather dusty Mogul




Finally a couple of Black and White Shots:





Couldnt resist the Pannier.........apart from the fact I like Panniers........ 5773 is sporting, for the first time, etched number plates! Well there is a limit to how many 5775's you can have on a layout......apart from the confusion it causes RR&Co








Next post the Coaling Station


 

Compromise, as you say John is the answer, I have no problems with it nor would I with a mixture of grey-it comes in all shades- and black.

This is the thread I was looking for!......  http://www.rmweb.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=12322

John, I had a look at that site, however this is not a wagon but a crane and likely held in Loco Departmental stock in the plant and machinery category..

 

And by 1948, your period, black colour I think more appropriate. That is also probably true of the coal wagons.

I agree about the crane.......black it will be.

I dont particularly want to repaint and re-transfer my existing loco coal wagons if I can avoid it.......maybe I will just paint the new ones black.......a classic Canadian compromise?

 

Regarding its colour as the crane would, I think, be on the Loco Department's books most likely it would be painted black as were engine coal wagons.

 

I do wonder a little about the bucket and think maybe a crab like grab was used. The bucket might be more prone to damage the ash pit walls. But I don't know.

 

 I'm sure, however,  someone will come up with a definitive answer.

Thanks John............glad you like it

I think you are right the crane would have been Black (well dirty black). I am not quite so certain about the loco coal wagons.......I researched and googled this a couple of times and the answer seems to be "the experts continue to disagree" Thats a direct quote from http://www.gwr.org.uk/liverieswagon1920.html ! I have to build a few more shortly so it would be nice to know what is most likely correct in 1948. Talking of loco coal wagons I suspect I am incorrect to be using 10T wagons and that for a depot of this size 20T would be more appropriate.......but I am not aware of any kits and I am not convinced the Dapol 20T RTR is right.

You are right about the risk of damage to the ash pit wall from the shovel........at Newyd Shed they have to hand shovel it out......well thats my story!

Regards