Mel_H

4 hours ago, Martin.M said:

Interesting points here, there was not much in the Hornby 2020 stuff for me but I like the look of the rocket and  i had one back in the day so I tried to pre-order a set with my usual supplier but he was sold out so I tried the next one i use and he was sold out so I have given up. Hornby have lost a sale of £179-189 and I am better off. Agreed if it was more of I my interest I would have made an effort to chase round more shoe to pre-order but it look like Hornby have lost my sale.... There is still 2021 to see what comes out...

Martin

 

I had an email today from TMC saying they still had some of their Rocket allocation available for order (not the Limited Edition version). Just checked, and they are still showing availability. I suggest you be quick!

https://www.themodelcentre.com/r3810

11 hours ago, truffy said:

 

Not strictly true. I have several items on 'pre-order' with Rails.

 

Some are standard manufacturer catalogue items, if cancelled there is no loss to me.

 

But Rails' special commissions involve a deposit of around £30. Unless there are extenuating circumstances (such as the price increase of the 812), if I cancel those orders I lose the deposit.

 

Whether these are pre-orders, expressions of interest, or something else is somewhat bandying semantics.

You are quite right, of course! I'd forgotten that. Without too much semantics bandying, I'd suggest that it's a deposit - same as putting down a deposit on a car etc. Anyway, I'll pop away now before it all gets out of hand....

Typical! The answer's of course. This one turns up. What's interesting is that the 37 only appears to have half an orange cantrail stripe. Maybe it was needed in hurry?

So...

'Want to run your BR blue 37 with an orange cantrail stripe on one side only'

37222 passes Hebden Bridge with 6E80 11:00 Preston Deepdale to Healey Mills Speedlink Coal empties. 24/2/88.

Only got four coal hoppers and want to run a Speedlink? No worries. [I suspect there's too many examples of these types of workings. RIP wagonload]

From Flickr:

Claggy Class 47 On The Speedlink Coal (Michael McNicholas)

47237 erupts through Hebden Bridge station on the morning of 8th September 1987 at the head of 6M27 08:11 Healey Mills to Preston Deepdale Speedlink coal. [Pic Michael McNicholas]

I have to say they are absolutely exquisite! And even more so when you consider the price. Good value (by today's standards) I'd say.

I'm a first time Accurascale buyer too, but was drawn in the all the previous posts and failed to resist! Even though I had to apply Rule 1.

As a previous poster said on this thread, on the DRS ones a frame is fitted (in real life) on which the container sits to raise it up to clear the wheels. The Cawood containers (in real life) had indentations in the bottom to clear the wheels. The frame (accurately modelled) is easily removed should you want to run them totally empty.

I took some snaps on my phone earlier (so sorry about the poor quality) - I only realised I'd put the container on upside down just now; please be gentle...! (Old age eyesight)

The finesse is truly remarkable.

My only question is what is the best way of removing the coupling from its pocket? It didn't seem obvious to me, and I didn't want to do any damage.

Accurascale's otherwise excellent history and information sheet (fab - well done) is silent on the subject. Advice please!

On 12/01/2020 at 18:42, 66738 said:

Hmmm. Running facing road through Hebden Bridge, or for some reason these have hooked on the rear, and are going to go over the signalled main to main cross over back towards Milneroyd Junction. Great picture.

66738

The caption by photographer Michael McNicholas posted on the Flickr page with the photo explains this:  "A pair of Grids on the Ellesmere Port to Blyth Cawoods empties was very rare. Even rarer was the fact that they were running wrong line through Hebden Bridge station - presumably due to engineering work. 56118 and 56135 were captured on Saturday, the 7th May 1988 at 17:40."

On 09/01/2020 at 09:35, JohnR said:

I think my wallet is now completely blown.

 

My 7 year old son (always been a massive fan of the APT) has now discovered the Hornby catalogue I bought. He also wants to add more Class 66's, and even the 50s in GBRf have intrigued him. He also wants a GWR HST set. And by set, I mean a full 2+8 set with all the coaches Hornby are listing now. 

 

Pray for me. 

We are happy for you!

The next step, in my experience, is wanting a layout that resembles Clapham Junction on steroids!!!

On 09/01/2020 at 14:39, wasabi said:

Referring to Kato, my impression is that they have been looking at the sort of trains that Japanese tourists might encounter on visits here and buy as 'souvenir' purchases.  It will be interesting to see if a series develops.  I had also wondered whether Kato might one day acquire Peco as a way into the UK market, but a group which has two sets of track systems (not that they are incompatible) would perhaps cause confusion in the market?  That said, Peco's distribution network must have a lot of value and B----t has meant that there has never been a better time to snap up UK assets.

Unless or until Peco’s ownership changes, nothing is for sale. I can assure you that any such approaches are very firmly rebuffed.

7 minutes ago, mdvle said:

 

Lets be clear about a couple of points.

 

One, as far as I am superficially aware Hornby is not currently paying out any dividends, so that is a non-issue.

 

Second, Phoenix owns 75% of Hornby and as such is the only shareholder that matters.  Stock price is currently irrelevant, as it won't significantly change in a meaningful way unless the company returns to profitability.

 

 

Again, to repeat, the threat of unsold inventory in a warehouse is a far greater financial threat to Hornby's future than being unable to meet demand because they underestimated the popularity of a new product.

 

 

The current shareholder that matters put the current management in place in part because the previous management was losing significant amounts of money paying for production of items that sat in expensive warehouse space, and then had to be cleared at below cost.

 

The current management team, by doing their best to eliminate those previous over-productions, has reduced the significant yearly losses and put Hornby in the right direction.

 

So for now at least, I think it is fair to say Phoenix does not see wasted market opportunity but rather reduced losses, and that presumably makes them happy (because if they weren't then they will also toss the current management).

 

 

Get real.  There is exactly one item that is currently (by second hand info but seemingly confirmed as a possible issue by Phil) unavailable to order and that is the two versions of Rocket.  I don't think many people new to the hobby based on a train set under the Christmas tree are running out to purchase a £190 limited edition Rocket, or even the £180 regular Rocket set.

 

Everything else in the catalog is available to order, as well as any stock that the retailer has on the shelves being available to purchase then and there.  So the rest of your theory is nonsense.

 

 

Hornby only has so much money, and thus can only produce so much product (new or otherwise) in any given year.  Remember, all production in China has to be paid for in advance.

 

 

Incorrect.

 

Yes, collectors buy models (good for us, more models sold!)

 

But 80% or more of the market does not care about accuracy to relevant operating periods or other stuff that many of us on RMweb care about - all they care about is whether they like the look of the model or not and they are quite happy to have a mish mash of eras and regions on their layout as they have fun.

 

Thus it is entirely possible that Hornby knows more about choosing liveries that sell than those of us worried about accuracy are willing to admit.

 

 

 

Again, covered extensively.  As more models get released each year than the past, the unit numbers per model must inherently go down.

 

 

Stop the presses - model train company wants to make a profit.

 

 

This is not unique to Hornby, this is how every model train company works (unless they have a wealthy sugar daddy to cover the bills).  The high upfront costs, combined with only getting paid months after paying out the money, means the companies in this hobby are constantly needing cash flow to keep the pipeline running.

 

 

We don't know how Hornby is financing this, though their financials do show they still have credit available to them to use if needed.

 

But like any business, you have to spend money to make money.

 

 

Why can't it be both?  Buy something else this year (either from Hornby or others), and then use next year's funds to buy from the second release.

 

But that is assuming that they can't get what they want, which again is all rumour based on some non-Rocket items possibly being in too short supply - because they other alternative is that Hornby have judged the market correctly and 95% or more of the people who want those Class 50/60/mk2/3 actually end up getting what they want.

 

Well said on all those points!

9 hours ago, phil-b259 said:

 

But I still don't see the problem.

 

If health issues mean you find you do not wish to go through with your purchase then pretty much all retailers will let you cancel said pre-order without charge. If on the other hand things work out well then you are not denied a model you want through it selling out by pre-ordering.

 

As I said before - if the time frame between ordering and delivery gets too large then the price will probably have gone up - and retailers are legally obliged to get your consent before taking payment. If paying by card then card expiry issues may also come into play.

 

The only real issues with extended delivery times and pre-ordering is where non refundable deposits are taken but the product takes ages to appear - but such arrangements are rare and even where they do exist (such as the D class from Rails of Sheffield) then many retailers will exercise their discretion with refunds if the worst were to happen.

 

In short all this worrying over pre-orders is a smokescreen - at the end of the day you are simply worried that you may not be able to enjoy an announced model due to the length of time it takes to reach the shelves. That has NOTHING to do with the process of pre-ordering models, but is rather the natural human desire to not miss out on something you like.

 

 

For various reasons I’ve just cancelled two long-standing so-called ‘pre-orders’ with Rails (not due to any issue with Rails, I must point out). Cancellation was easy and simple 

To be pedantic, they are actually  ‘non-binding orders for stock yet to be delivered’’. 

A ‘pre-order’ is surely an ‘expression of interest ‘, NOT any sort of order.

There’s no such thing as a ‘pre-order’. You either place an order’ (even if there’s no deposit and it’s  non-binding) or you don’t.

You are in one state or the other.  Eg you are either pregnant or you are not. You are not pre-pregnant, and then expect to receive a child!

Some shops operate a non-returnable deposit when you order.  That’s a business decision for them, and a customer decision for you. 

I really hate  the term ‘pre-order’.  It is an ‘order’. Shops could dress it  up as an ‘advance order‘ , or do what sofa tv ads do: ‘order today for (expected) delivery in December 2020. Nothing to pay now!’

I’ll get back in my box. Sorry to have bothered you 

21 hours ago, dibber25 said:

Mel, you'll probably remember those meetings where we were told you had four seconds in which your cover had to attract someone to cross the shop floor and pick up the magazine. (CJL)

Certainly do! 

You learn something everyday. I hadn't appreciated this fact (from http://www.loveless.co.uk/hushhush/index.html):

"Union of South Africa, 60009 runs today with the tender that was behind Hush Hush for the whole time it was numbered 10000. The W1 got another tender, by coincidence, when it became 60700. The original tender was in store when 60009 was purchased for preservation, the purchaser chose the tender in the best condition to go with it, and the one ex 10000 was the one."

On 09/01/2020 at 17:14, Pandora said:

i simply "cherry pick" and buy a  magazine only if the issue  strongly engages with my interests. that applies to other magazine subjects  too,  motorcycling/cars/electronics, as for newspapers,  I cannot recall buying a newspaper for several years,  although I read them in the local library when I call in. At the back of my mind is the build up of clutter in my home, too many magazines and books, rarely consulted, but too hard to part with.

That makes you a 'typical' magazine reader then... And, I confess, that's me too for those mags that I don't have on a subscription.

For consumer (fun) magazines covering specialist interests, many people will buy it if there's one article they absolutely want to read (at home, not in the shop). Or, if not, two or possibly three articles that are of interest.

Once someone has picked the magazine off the shelf, in theory you (used to be) halfway to making the sale. That's the main reason for the cover lines being so varied in the hope of appealing to all potential readers, to at least get them to pick it up.

There's much more to be said about covers (a huge topic in itself), but next time you're in WH Smith, just glance at the women's magazines. You'll notice that 99% of them all have the same word on the cover.

Those who love a particular magazine normally subscribe, although there is a significant number who will use their local newsagents for a variety of reasons. 

After 30 years in magazine editing I still remain fascinated about the psychology of readers' choices.

11 minutes ago, Colin_McLeod said:

That's the second wannabe moderator asking for this thread to be closed.  To give a countra view, I (not a Mod btw) think it should stay open for as long as it attracts posts, complies with the rules and does not become a duplicate of the other thread.

I don't want to be a Mod! It was just a polite suggestion...

There is now a new 'Hornby APT' thread running since Monday's announcement, which is here

Now that the APT-P been 'resurrected' (as per this thread's title) perhaps it's time to close this thread?

3 hours ago, ruggedpeak said:

Here's a scene that can be readily modelled....if you max the resolution and full screen it and pause the video you can see the vehicle numbers. I did post a list previously but can't find it at the moment.

 

 

If you're on a phone with a small screen, then the formation is 37099+977969+977983+5381+6264+37116

4 hours ago, Robin Brasher said:

The 2020 Hornby Catalogue and the February 2020 Hornby Magazine were in W H Smith at Swanage but they did not know anything about the combined offer so I ordered mine directly from Key Publishing for £10.69.

You need to look in the 'specials' section to get the bundle, here, https://shop.keypublishing.com/department/productList/department/SPEC

And, if you search very hard (under 'Rail', not 'Modelling' - a listing error) you'll find the 2018 Hornby Catalogue for just £1.99

16 hours ago, ThaneofFife said:

at the pretty decent prices we have seen I would not build up any hopes of interior lighting being a feature on this model.  certainly nothing listed in the spec but I dont feel its doable at this price point.  Be great if Hornby didas more models come along with interior lighting but with all the gubbins (pick ups, inter coach connections and light bars etc) on a 7 car set I would be thinking the price would be considerably higher.  exterior and cab lights at best I think.

Given the very dark tint of the passenger windows, I'm unsure that most buyers would want to pay the extra. Just interior cab lights would be fine for me...

17 hours ago, gwrrob said:

A heads up that the 2020 catalogue is part of a bundle for £10 with Hornby Magazine if bought from Tesco from tomorrow or W H Smiths next week.

Not in Tesco Wisbech (and it's still last month's HM too).

17 hours ago, Mike Harvey said:

Just a word of warning about the new Hornby catalogue. Its 244 pages weigh in at just over 1 kg. The flimsy carrier bag my wife put it in was in tatters before she got back to the car park. Great value read even though there is not one of my preferred N scale models in it. Maybe the Arnold announcement will perk me up a bit more.

 

Mike's warning is wise - keep your pets away from the letterbox! I was genuinely surprised at its monster weight when I checked out the copies on sale in Tesco at Wisbech. I guess Hornby must have paid for 'prime placing' as they are at eye-level in the most prominent place, whereas all the other railway/model magazines are tucked away at the back corner at floor level. 

For those on here wanting to understand about the Railroad range, what's on offer buildings-wise etc, then the catalogue answers all those questions in a format that's much easier to use than the web.

I have to say, it's a magnificent beast that's worthy of the anniversary and, IMHO, well worth the £9.99 (especially when compared with the price of a typical magazine at around a fiver).

2 hours ago, classy52 said:

 

 

Crikey I thought with the massive price jump on the HST set and with the tooling being a few years old now they had stuck a motor in the other car 

Will still buy the NR HST Set since I have all 3 Mk3 coaches from last year which I only got this week from Kernow & now pre-ordered the other 2 so this will be my first HST purchase but £260 for 2 loco's & only one powered seems pretty steep even by today's standards...lol I honestly thought the price increases were due to sticking a motor in the dummy car  

Basically we're paying just over 200 quid for a powered car considering the dummy car would no more expensive than the DVT to make...oh well.

While I can't comment on Hornby's costs, Rapido have previously stated in their videos and newsletters that the cost of a 'powered' loco, verses a 'non-powered' loco is very close, which is why it doesn't sell non-powered locos as they wouldn't be any cheaper.

10 hours ago, Coryton said:

 

That could be interesting. Some actual modelling?

Surely not!

1 hour ago, JSpencer said:

 

That is what I was thinking.

 

I also looked closely at their analogue proposition for my main DC layout to replace old equipment there and its not really useful for me personally. I'd need at least 3 of the main controller ports and 36 accessory ports (up to 12 per main controller part by buying 3 additional accessary things per controller) but even then that would not be suffice to replace the cab (like) control panel I currently have and all its switches. I'd need relay switches triggered by accessories to be able to make certain sections of track dead (like the loco depot). And all that for a cost of at least £300.

 

I then thought maybe hybriding it. Using Gaugemaster for the cab control switch board and running a 2/4 of circuits while one of these devices runs a pair of other circuits with a speaker to add a bit of noise. There seems to be back emf on this things too (for gentle acceleration etc I guess) which makes me wonder over its compatibility with a DCC fitted unit (under my cab like control, any controller can control any part of the layout, so I can have a section with locos running via DCC).

For the new layout, DCC is still far more flexible.  

Certainly, for the size of layout DCC will be more flexible. I suspect that the Hornby offering is aimed at smaller layouts - which are more likely to be found more often. Those with 'big' layouts are probably in the minority

I don't think this has been posted elsewhere on this thread (if it has, please delete), but a little more information about some of the background.

11 hours ago, wirey33 said:

And still no Fell diesel…

 

Forget the Fell !  And still no Super Clayton...