WillCav

There were five diagrams of bogie loco coal wagons:

N1 with top doors

N11 with top doors

N14 Cambrian kit option

N15 Cambrian kit option

N17 Taller doors than the Cambrian kit

There were only 27 built total - 26 in use after 1915.  All 6 of the N11 type were used for the Torquay gas works traffic (not sure if for all their lives).  The ones used for loco coal would have been a drop in the ocean compared to about 3000 10-12T and 2800 20T wagons.

Will

20 hours ago, dibber25 said:

It was a system used by the GWR to mount wooden poster boards. The lines you can see are timber battens attached to the brickwork. They would probably have been removed when they became rotten - certainly, I don't think many survived long in the BR era, though they probably got removed piecemeal as they became unusable. (CJL)

 

Thanks Dibber25.

That's really useful information - I'll probably omit them from my model.

Will

Hi all,

I am planning to build a layout based on Cheltenham Spa Malvern Road.  The station was opened in 1908 and closed in 1966. I have found some differences in photographs of the island platform buildings.  Early pictures show vertical lines on the brickwork, whereas later ones have smooth brickwork.  I have a couple of questions:

1) What are these lines - I wondered if they were some sort of rails for mounting posters and timetables etc on the walls?

2) When were they removed? 

I've looked at other station buildings and can't see any evidence of it on any current buildings - or even in books.

http://www.archive-images.co.uk/gallery/Archive-Images-of-Gloucestershire-Railways/image/119/Cheltenham_Malvern_Road_Railway_Station_c1908

shows some - under the 'gentlemen' toilet sign on the left

Now in the 1960's - no vertical lines

https://thetransportlibrary.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=164818&search=31808

Any ideas?

Thanks

Will

10 hours ago, Michael Hodgson said:

...

  Whilst not unknown, you don't usually have a stop signal immediately on exit either, because a tunnel is not the best place to stop a train, especially if an emergency arises and evacuation is needed. 

...

The other problem with signals just past the exit is that it takes a few seconds for the driver's eyes to adjust to the increased light levels when exiting the tunnel.

Thanks Stationmaster,

Lots of useful info - I don't think the reversal troubles the West signaller if done in the bay?  I didn't think of the station being closed - that seems like a likely reason.

Seeing as my scenic break is going to be the Malvern road bridge, we might only see the nose of a 14xx during that move!

Are engine diagrams available anywhere for me to research further?  There seems to be a only a few light engine moves shown in the STT - I'll need to send a few off shed to St James in the morning and back in the evening.

Will

Thanks for that really informative reply Johnster. 

The reversal part is only Malvern Road to st James - about a mile ish. If the autocoach is starting at at James with the loco at the front, the driver could be in the autocoach cab ready and the fireman drives the 1st mile?  I can't understand why it doesn't just continue to Malvern Road to reverse - less than 200m further.

How do you find out what is rostered on a service?

Thanks 

Will

Hi all,

I've been researching the Working Timetable for Cheltenham Malvern Road 1948 and there are a number of trains reversing in their journeys and I've got a few questions. 

1) Autotrains St James to Honeybourne and vice-versa usually reverse in the bay but some reverse at Malvern Road East Jn - would the driver change ends on the ballast or would they propel to/from St James?

2) Class B passenger St James to Honeybourne and vice-versa - would that be able to run round in 4 minutes available? Would that be a tank engine or tender? Any suggestion on class?

3) One Goods train reverses at Malvern Road and St James then continues west - I assume it runs round. Would it have 2 toads? Again tender / tank / any idea of class?

Thanks in advance

Will

Can you see the castle used recently for "I'm a celebrity... " from Abegele and Persarn station?

Will

Most GWR stations from 1923 were... I'll get my coat

Joking aside - Windsor & Eton both stations can check if the Queen is in residence

Will

56 minutes ago, Welchester said:

 

Great photo. It looks as though the end of the former goods sidings has been turned into an extension of the engine shed.

 

I was hoping there might be further information on the Gloucestershire Railway Memories website, but it seems to have disappeared. Pity.

If you look on at later maps, or in the E Lyons engine shed book, the shed extension fits in the gap south of the two goods lines.  The weird thing is that the lines between the station and the coal stage seem to change from 3 to 4 at some stage.

Thanks all for your input on this location.  I've been looking at timetables etc and it looks like quite a busy station.

Will

37 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

The 1920 OS 25" map shows a couple of spaciously laid-out goods sidings at Malvern Road, in addition to the long-established facilities at the St James terminus. Perhaps more convenient for country traffic. The Midland's goods facilities look surprisingly cramped. 

There is no goods shed unfortunately and all photos seem to only be opens in the goods sidings - but I can have the pickup goods with more interesting wagons going onward to St James.

In 1947, one of the diesel railcars was shedded there - I'll also need to find out how they were fuelled (but that's off topic for this thread). It must be a rare GW shed - it has no panniers based there in 1947.

Thanks for all the assistance everyone

Will

@Compound2632

I thinking about Cheltenham Malvern Road about 1947-8.

16 locos + 1 railcar based there

It's 31 chains between two overbridges, with a depot, 3 platform station and some goods. It's asking to be modelled.

Thanks

Will

Hi all,

I'm thinking of building a modest engine shed with coal stage as part of a layout (we've all got too many locos haven't we).

The shed I'm looking at would need to receive up to 100tons of coal per day.  How were Loco coal wagons sent to the depots?

Did it get added to regular goods working or was it in specific loco coal trains (perhaps dropping off wagons to each shed on a route).

Looking at photos, it looks like both 10ton and 20ton wagons were used in the same locations.  Where were the 40ton bogie wagons used?

Were a few of the wagons used for ash when empty - where did the ash go?

Sorry for loads of questions - happy to read up myself if people can recommend books etc.

Thanks

Will

24 minutes ago, Miss Prism said:

 

The chassis in the line drawings for the Cooper-Crafts are fictional. DCI didn't get introduced until c 1903.

 

Thanks for that info - I should have known not to trust Cooper Craft - the brake gear isn't great on their 4mm GW wagons.

Does that mean that no 3 plank wagons ever had DC brakes? The last ones built (2 × O35) were Morton braked.

Thanks

Will

The line drawing on the box and for kit 7015 shows DC1 brakes - don't know if it can be built with single sided lever instead as I work in 4mm so I've never built that kit.

Will

Could it be the Cooper Craft / Slaters one? If so, it is an undiagrammed early one.

Will

3 hours ago, M.I.B said:

Sorry Will - only just seen this reply.   Mo early photos I'm afraid - the Taunton one is the only early GW set of photos I have seen, and it's posed - no tank of "nasty" and no Mess van nor pump van.

 

I have a BR Blue Dapol FRUIT D to hack about and make a pump van.  Add a grille or two, grey paintjob......

No worries MIB,

I think I've seen the same photos.

Looking forward to seeing your pump van

Will

20 hours ago, The Fatadder said:

I’ve had much the same thoughts, so will look forward to seeing how you get on.  I will need to do at least one.  (As well as adding a couple of the road trailers)

I've had a go. It was one of the Lima ones and the plastic was quite easy to carve. I used a craft knife and files.  I added some plasticard straps over the tank. Here's the result - still need to put some transfers on and weather it.

The DC brake gear was a spare Parkside one that I saved when I built a Z2 as a Z3 with Morton brake.

It's not anywhere as detailed as the brass kits but hopefully gives the impression of a different milk tank.

Will

1 hour ago, Karhedron said:

I suspect that the nameplates were added later on after the tanks were pooled during WW2. All the tanks that I can positively identify as Express Dairy tanks seem to have the nameplates mounted at the left hand end. There are other tanks that have them mounted on the right hand end but these are either Unigate or unidentifiable.

Thanks Karhedron,

Left hand side it is then.

48 minutes ago, The Fatadder said:

Will, is this going to be a DC braked example, would be interested to hear how you are tackling it if that’s the case 

I'm planning to carve off the long levers and add some spare dc levers and v hangers from kits. It won't be perfect but hopefully it'll pass the 3' rule!

Hi all,

I'm trying to build a number of GWR milk tanks for a milk train. I've got some really nice tank owner plates from Rumney Models and I want to get the wagon as correct as possible.

Luckily, there is a photo in GW Wagons Appendix by Russell of the very wagon - but when built.  It had vertical sections between the solebars and the base of the tank with the number, G W and tare weight.  This doesn't appear on many later tank types.

1. Do the vertical 'boards' stay the whole life of the wagon?

2. Which side if the ladder did Express Dairy put their plates? 

Thanks

Will

1 hour ago, Andy M said:

Will,

This enlargement from a slightly different angle, I think shows it to be a 4-wheel van. There is no evidence of springs below the centre of the solebar.

 

Andy.

 

Agreed - got to be AA2 or AA3.

Just checked Atkins Beard etc. AA2 was the same body as AA3 but with heavier axleboxes and springs. Difficult to spot on these pictures.

Andy,

It looks like a 20' toad from that angle.

The ten diagrams that were the 20' toads were AA1-6, 9, 10, 12 & 14.

I think we can discount tunnel, P-way and ballast Van's, which leaves AA1-3.

AA1 6w goods brake van 62 built 1900-02

AA2 4w goods brake van 278 built 1902-10

AA3 4w goods brake van 840 built 1889-1901

I'll have to dig out some books to see the difference between AA2 and AA3 which it is more likely to be by numbers built.  I'm not sure if I want to call it as definitely a 4wheel van - that platform is right in the way.

Hope this helps

Will

2 hours ago, The Johnster said:

It purports to be a C63, a 57' 9 compartment all third, but close examination reveals that there is an uneven spacing of the compartments where the original Airfix first class compartments intrude, and it sits on an unalterd 60' Airfix chassis, so is overlength by 12mm, 3 scale feet.  It is very much a 'layout' coach and looks passable so long as you don't run it coupled to 57 footers, in which chase it's 'longcomings' are highlighted.  It would, I think, be even more obviously overlength in GW choc/cream as the compartment spacing anomaly would be highligthed more as well.

 

...

 

 

Johnster,

Just looked in Russell and it says it should be 61'2" (60' + bow ends) so your coach isn't 3' too long.

You could make one easily with 3 b set coaches cutting at the door lines, but that would be a waste unless they were dirt cheap.

What were those coaches used for? And which bogies did they sit on? There's not much info in Russell.

Thanks

Will

1 minute ago, Mark Forrest said:

I must confess that I edited my post after checking the photos in LMS Wagons Vol 1.  I'd initially assumed the Morton braked wagons would have 4 block brakes but photos confirmed them to be of the 2 block type (with the brakes on the same side of the wagon as the clutch).

 

(Also noting that I made the mistake of saying shoe rather than block adding to the confusion around terminology!).

On the GWR, they quite often used 2 blocks on unfitted and 4 blocks on vacuum fitted wagons. This practice was not 100% adhered to but generally applied to both Morton braked and earlier DC braked wagons.

Did this apply to other companies?

Will