5Bel

Hi Colin,

The 4Sub looks the business in your latest batch of photos. I especially like the one next to the Signal Box. Good luck with the move to P4, at least you don't have any steamers to convert. Changing gauge is a big decision, at the moment I am giving serious consideration in moving up to 7mm and disposing of my 4mm models. Good luck again.

Cheers for now, Ian.

Hi All,

The DMBS body is now complete and back in the paintshop for it's primer. Whilst putting all the detailing bits on the model split at one of the joins then one of the window blanks fell out!! For a while I wasn't very happy as you can imagine. Whilst it has been drying between coats I have been trying to make my Replica cut and shut EMU modelling technique a little better. I now use the door lines to hide the joints, so the only join that needs filling is by the compartment nearest the Guards van. If you are careful with your cutting you don't lose any of the hinges and handles.

Standard SR 63' DMBS EPB/HAP

You can just about make out the filled join at the very extreme left. There is another join down the doorline of the second compartment from the left.

Class 501 DMBS.

Experiment to see if ER electrics are feasible. Class 304 etc;

For filling the small gaps I now use Superglue. The 501 is going to be for the Test unit 051 which was used for PEP trials. I have been asked to demonstrate some of my techniques at the Maidenhead show on Sat 17th May. It will be my first time so if any RMWebbers are going come and say hello.

Fresh from the paintshop!!

Thankfully there has been no lasting damage. The conduits and cable runs are 0.3mm nickel silver wire. They are glued in one lamp top only. This negates the spaghetti effect you can get due to expansion. Thankyou to Dave and Ceptic for their photos, they have been invaluable. I am leaving the DTS in it's basic form until after the Maidenhead exhibition to show just what can be done with the basic DC Kits model. The next thing for this model is to try and make a BR single bolster bogie from the Replica product and to finish the underframe.

Cheers for now, Ian.

Hi Colin,

Sorry to hear your news. Good luck and hope to see you back modelling again soon.

Ian.

Hi Colin,

The completed unit looks brilliant. I like the yellow handrails, they are quite distinctive. What we need as SR modellers is a supplier of good seated passengers, or even just the top half, to populate our EMU's. Once again brilliant work.

Cheers for now, Ian.

Hi Colin,

Thanks for the comments, you are right of course, the 1st class was in the DTC.

Cheers for now, Ian

Hi All,

After an enforced break due to work I have remodelled the DMBS. The old window was removed and a new piece from a Replica BS inserted. The difference is only 2mm but the look of the model is much improved. I have also put on the front window surrounds and the drivers side windows. The scale size smaller one was fitted and the big hole behind filled with plasticard and filler. The roof positions were marked and drilled using Dave's dimensions and photos as a guide.

Guards window now in the correct place.

The scale size NNK drivers window.

NNK window cab window surrounds.

Roof predrilled.

On the prototype, the ex first class compartment retained it's luxury seating when converted for use on the SR. I still need to do a bit more rubbing down the cab fronts around the windows then it is adding all the door furniture and roof gubbins.

Cheers for now, Ian.

Hi Frank,

Thanks for all the photos, I really have no excuses now do I!! Every little bit of these units has now been covered in these posts. This is why this Forum is the best there is.

Cheers for now, Ian

Hi Frank,

Thanks for posting the excellent photos, they will be a real help. I have the DMBS just about right and the photos of the trailing bogies will help me to do the BR1 mods. The unit at the moment is sat on the workbench with it's new guards van inserted and the joins filled. Unfortunately I won't be able to work on it until thursday due to work. Such is life!!

Cheers for now, Ian.

Hi Ian,

 

Re. the cab sliding windows: why not see if Pheonix-Precision have any spare etches from the NN Kits 2 EPB kit. Perhaps Ceptic would confirm that the Bulleid EPB and BR standard EPB stock were the same. (The Tyneside units were built before the Bulleid ones, so there is a good chance that the frames were standard parts.)

 

Looking at Dave's as always excellent photos, it has stuck that there is far more conduit on the roofs of these units than other EPB stock. It looks as though fittings such as lamp tops and roof ventilators are centred over doorways when viewed from the side. So the main calculation is to work out how far each item/conduit is from the roof's longitudinal centre line and the rest is relatively easy to work out.

 

Good luck with all that!

 

Colin

Hi Colin,

I have just looked in my spares box and I have a set of scale window surrounds, it is amazing what can happen if you look hard enough!!I had a look at the NNK website, they make some nice EMU buffers and a compressor and cradle. There is a lot of stuff on the roofs, but with the help of Dave's drawings I should be able to get it right. Dave thank you for posting the scans, I have also e-mailed you. I don't know why the big guards vans were kept, there is no explanation in any of the books I have.

Cheers for now, Ian.

Thanks for your comments Ian.

 

Re. the cab front grab rails, I had assumed they were going to be yellow, but will check prior to painting them as I don't want another 'right-facing lion' situation!

 

All the best,

 

Colin

Hi Colin,

I have just looked at some photos and the grabrails are indeed yellow, seems some of the BR standards had orange ones.

Cheers for now, Ian.

Hi All,

Thanks for the comments. There have been some interesting liveries on these units once they passed into departmental service, just a bit late for my period though. Colin, I haven't yet thought about how I am going to couple the units yet, probably using Kadee's as the Bachmann unit has the NEM pocket already. I am now off into the loft to find another Replica BS bodyshell to see if I can rectify that window position.

Cheers for now, Ian

Hi Colin,

The all but finished unit looks excellent. The commode handles are particularly nice. Well worth the time and effort. What colour are you panting the cab front handrails, I know some units had orange painted ones. Whether this applied to the 4Subs or not I don't know. I don't think you have to worry too much about your spray painting, the unit looks spot on to me. After all the windows and commode handles on this unit you deserve a lie down in a darkened room!! 

Cheers for now, Ian.

Hi Frank,

Any photos of the underframe will be gratefully received, particularly the bogies. I will be modifying Replica BR1's as there are no readily available examples. I am still looking into ways of modifying the cabside windows. I have some NNK surrounds which I may be able to utilise.

Cheers for now, Ian.

Hi Dave,

Those photos are brilliant, just what I needed.Thanks for posting them. The position of that window is noticeably different from mine even though it is only 2mm, I think I am going to have to re model it now I know about it. The roof photos are particularly useful showing the difference between the two types. Thanks again for the photos.

Cheers for now, Ian

Hi Dave,

Thanks for the info. I have measured mine and it turns out I am 2mm short! I am too far in to change it now. If I remember correctly I started this conversion before I got the Goulding book, so worked from photos. The book isn't correct on some things but in this case he was right. 

Cheers for now, Ian

Hi All,

The next project onto the workbench is a DC Kits 2 Epb that I am modifying into a Tyneside version.

The extra long guards van is taken from a Replica suburban Brake second and grafted into the DC kits body.

The smaller route indicator is a piece of plasticard fitted in to the original aperture. I have some front window surrounds from NNK to fit, this will give me the correct dimensions for the indicator box.

The underframe is cobbled together using Southern Pride bits and scratchbuilt boxes. The resistance boxes being a combination of both. I got all the positioning details from copying the Bachmann model as they share the same 1951 pattern layout. While no where near the standards of Mr Parks' masterpieces they give the general impression.

The dummy motor bogie has been detailed with various brass and plastic bits, with the shoe beam from NNK.

The model will be unpowered and will run coupled to my Bachmann 2Epb. I am going to finish it in green with a full yellow end as 5783. Next up is putting all the roof gubbins on, photos of which are quite rare. 

Cheers for now, Ian.

Hi All,

Ian, a question not a criticism, wouldn't it be better to strip the original paint off the bodies before you start sticking things together?, I find it helps when repainting/adding details that getting rid of the gloop that passes for paint these days gives a finer base to work from, or are you doing that anyway and I'm getting a bit previous?

 

Mike.

Hi Mike,

I will be using the Precision Paints stripper to take the paint off for exactly the reason you have stated, I have run out of it at the moment.

Hi Ian,

 

The Augmentation trailer of that 4 LAV would be fairly conventional to make as it had a cant rail, unlike some later trailers built for the scheme which were of all-steel construction like a 4 SUB.  The only down side to modelling unit 2926 would be having to set the composite aside that you have already started, but then again you have a 2 HAL motor coach...

 

 

 

All the best,

 

Colin

 Colin,

Thinking about it, if I can muster enough Kirk parts to make the compartment composite I may as well go the whole way and model a standard Lav. However the Hal motor coach will not go to waste, I am thinking of a 2Pan or making the departmental unit that had a Hal motor coach and an Epb trailer for a period. Just so happens I have an Epb trailer in the loft! It is a shame I cant get hold of any Hornby Maunsell coach bodies as spares for the conversion. I have several complete coaches, but there is no way I am taking a saw to those.

Cheers for now, Ian.

Hi Colin,

The Sub does look excellent in it's green coat. I wonder how long it will be before we can replicate the Hal/Sub photo with RTR products from Hornby, we are half way there.

Happy Christmas, Ian

Hi All,

Thanks for the comments.

As Gwiwer says the fleet did undergo some changes: There was one 4 LAV, 2926 that lost its corridor composite with the two lavatories in an accident in 1961 and ended its day as effectively a 4 LAV with no lav..   (It had a 2 HAL motor coach as an accident replacement  in 1947.  (The damaged composite coach was replaced with an Augmentation wooden-roofed trailer coach).

 

Now that would be an interesting model!

 

Colin

 I already have a Phoenix 2Hal motor coach that I was going to refurbish, I may have to look into cutting my scratchbuilding teeth on an augmentation trailer!! It would be quite a unique model. I have seen at least one photo of this unit, I think it is in the Bradford Barton Southern Electric book, though I will check later.

4Nol?

 All the way back from Brighton with no lavatory, that would take some will power!!

Cheers for now, Ian

HI All,

Thanks for the comments. I will look into getting a Mike King drawing before I do any further major work. The Goulding book does have it's anomalies!! For the moment the unit will have to stay as a two car unit  (2Hal!!) as I need to get parts for the other two coaches. My modelling has to stop for the Christmas period as my workbench gets transformed into a serving table for all the festive goodies!! This is on the orders of Mrs 5Bel who is visible in the background of the photos.

Merry Christmas to All, Ian.

Ok, it's time to decide on the shade of green for the 4 SUB

 

On the left is Phoenix-Precision P.118 BR Multiple Unit Green (pre- 1954). On the left is a tin of the same maker's P.124 Southern Electric Stock Green with some black added to it (the patch on the lid being over-painted).

 

IMG_7272.JPG

 

Well, what does anybody think?!

 

Colin

 Hi Colin,

To my eyes the one on the right of the two lefts in your post looks good to me, but as Mike says SR green is a complicated shade to capture. Go with what you think. 

Cheers for now, Ian.

Hi All,

With the announcement of Hornby's 2Hal and inspired by Colin Parks EMU builds I have embarked on a slowtime project for the winter. I have had a number of Kirk Maunsell coaches in the loft for years and never got round to finishing them. I have often wondered about converting them into an EMU and when Hornby released their 2Bil I was half way through building a Kirk one. So armed with razor saw and plenty of photos I set about the conversion. The motor driver utilises the ends and roof of the 2Bil and the corridor composite various parts of the Maunsell coaches. 

For some reason I removed the vents above the doors on the composite but they are easily replaced. I started out by using the Goulding plan book for measurement but the composite ended up slightly short. Then when it came to the DMBS the doors to the brake van are in the wrong place. Always get photos of your project!! As yet I am not sure whether I m going to power it with a Hornby 5 pole class 25 motor bogie or the new 2Bil bogie. I have still got a lot of filling and filing to do to complete these two coaches, but the start has been made. I need now to source some Kirk 1st and 3rd class coaches to make the other two vehicles. I don't think there is much chance of the 4Lav being done RTR, but these days you never know.

Cheers for now, Ian. 

Hi Colin,

Excellent work as always. The end steps really look the business. I had my doubts about the size of the NNK ones, they seem to be nearer the BR standard size. I can't wait to see the commode handles. I like the look of the pseudo composite, it is amazing the difference the lack of one compartment has on the look of the coach. Looking forward to seeing the unit in it's green coat. Once again excellent work.

Cheers for now, Ian.

Hi Colin,

I like the look of your workbench, so neat! Mine is always a mess! I am looking forward to the 9 compartment trailer coming together, I don't think I have ever seen one modeled before. 

Cheers for now, Ian.

Hi Chris,

Very impressive work, especially on the FK. I have a few of these coaches and the remnants of a MJT/Lima 4Vep, you have put me on the road to doing this conversion myself!! Looking forward to grabbing some more tips from you.

Cheers for now, Ian.