60526

Briefly going back to past manufacturers, can anyone remember Loddon models. I'm currently resurrecting and converting this E1/R tank to EM. I've also parts from their Terrier tank kit.

On 29/07/2023 at 09:15, LNER4479 said:

All I can say is that the day I had a ride behind 'Deltic 9', it had an exhaust fire down your end of the ECML. It somehow seemed to survive the experience and duly pitched up at York (where I was due to board) some 45mins late. The scenes of rejoicing on Waverley platform amongst the support crew when we eventually arrived was like they'd made it to the moon.

 

Tornado took over for the run back south (the real reason I was there), which it accomplished all the way back to 'The Cross' without the slightest fuss or bother.

 

All that being said, I know how much goes into these things so, for the sake of all the unsung lads and lassies involved, I sincerely hope it shows up on time and everyone is having a grand day out.

 

I was in the rear coach of the train. From what we were told the Deltic had been idling for some time before it came empty stock into KX and stood there for a while. Oil vapour had accumulated in the exhauster? We were on the down main local to Stevenage and came to an abrupt stop.

You could see flames coming out of one of the exhausts followed by a creamy colour which looked like some extinguisher system was being used, but the faulty engine was shut down and then restarted. We soon realised that the way to put the fire out was to put the regulator into full throttle while standing still and blow it out. After this little event the loco seemed to fly, the diesel enthusiasts in the coach must have been monitoring the speed because there was a round of applause every time the Deltic topped the ton. There was a slight hick-up at Doncaster when some modern day electronics wouldn't talk to control. This eventually got sorted out and I know we arrived in Waverley a couple of hours late, but enough time to visit the Guilford Arms.

Tornado was quite impressive on the way back. We arrived at Stevenage too late to go straight down the ECML because of a possession on the line, so we were diverted down the Hertford loop at Langley junction, although on greens there was rapid deceleration for a phone call. I think probably to check that Tornado was passed for going down the loop and through Ponsbourne tunnel. From memory we arrived in KX at 01:15. A cracking day(s) out.

On 22/04/2023 at 12:00, Buhar said:

Are you sure?  17mm is 4'3", 4'8" is a little more than 18.6mm.  56 inches at 1:76 is 0.736" x 25.4 gives 18.7mm.

 

Alan

I did say 17mm ish, ishhhh could extend to 18.7mm 

13 hours ago, 60526 said:

I decided to buy the Hornby wheelset because they come with brass bearings. I'll provide some diameter dimensions when the set arrives.

The parts arrived from Peters spares this a.m. The driving wheels are oversized at 18.6mm diameter, O1/8K=4'-8" 17mm ish. 14 spoke, tick. The axles are 2.9mm dia, the brass bearing that come with them are 5.07mm dia/3mm bore. These would normally fit in slots in the Hornby chassis, aside from one on the drive axle they don't have any flange. Longevity of the tyre plating, who knows. The coupling rod set I bought X6548 look ok to use, includes the rods and threaded pins. The loco chassis bottom X6551 which includes the brake shoes looks ok, but will probably need some cutting to fit a brass chassis. The buffers X6557 are metal and look ok to use, includes tender buffers and are complete with springs.

3 minutes ago, Buhar said:

RTR axles seem to vary in diameter and not many (if any) are either 2mm or 1/8th which are the sizes of bearings for use in kits and not all RTR wheel sets have bearings in the original model.  With a lathe or drill press you might be in with a chance of opening a set to the right size.  There is a huge saving to be made, I'd be interested in hearing how you get on.

 

Alan 

I decided to buy the Hornby wheelset because they come with brass bearings. I'll provide some diameter dimensions when the set arrives.

Just now, Tony Wright said:

Good evening Charlie,

 

Probably worth a try. 

 

Since I buy my wheels in bulk from Markits, I don't know what individual drivers cost. Probably over £6.00 each?

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

I looked back at the GK article and noticed that he used the Bmann O4 as a donor chassis. I hadn't realised that Bmann had improved the spares on their website. A set of O4 wheels and rods is £22. https://Bachmann-spares.co.uk/category/2-branchline-steam-parts/robinson-04-2-8-0/chassis?page=1

On 15/04/2023 at 13:03, Tony Wright said:

 

 

 

Truly old fashioned frames, but an excellent runner. 

 

 

In updating or modifying older kits, has anyone experience of using the likes of Hornby or Bachmann wheels instead of Romfords or Gibson etc. In buying the buffers for my 04/8 from Peters Spares I was drawn to the other spares they provide for the O1. I'm impressed by the smooth running of my Hornby O1, so I've ordered a set of O1 driving wheels to try out, at £10 it must be worth a punt? I don't know how much a set of Romfords would cost?

On 18/04/2023 at 15:59, cctransuk said:

 

The downside of these etchings is that the resulting buffer-heads are flat.

 

A suitable sized ballbearing, or similar rounded end tool, lightly hammered into the back of the buffer-head when laid on a piece of softwood, may well produce a more realistic, curved face.

 

CJI.

The brain cells have been asleep for a while, of course the ex GC/ROD 2-8-0 became an O4/8, but also became an O1. Another source of oval buffer head is from the Hornby O1, sold as spares by the likes of Peters Spares - part X6557

Thanks for the ideas on the O4/8 front buffers, I haven't enquired further but 52F produce an A5/2 kit, so perhaps the buffers may be available separately, I don't think Sonic Models do spares for their A5. Like others I've collected bits and bobs over the years and after reading Graeme Kings article on the Bmann 04/B1 merged in Model Rail June 2012 (I've a scanned copy) it became another item on my to-do list. I've given up on a Bmann B1 that is already on its 2nd chassis, so that will become a donor and I bought the attached off of fleebay for £28 which is enough for me to make the O4/8 with a bit of scratching. But a bit of a quirk, I have parts from a Nu-Cast B1, so might end up using that as the donor. Perhaps a Comet chassis for the B1? 

On 15/04/2023 at 13:03, Tony Wright said:

The O4/8 is now almost complete. Just brakes (to source), rear sandboxes (to source) and balance weights (to cut from Plastikard), and it should be there.....

 

 

I used the Bachmann B1's backhead and cab interior, hacked about to suit. Yes, the splashers over the rear driving wheels are still present, but these won't really be seen behind a crew.

 

 

Truly old fashioned frames, but an excellent runner. 

 

Any 'scabby' bits should disappear under painting/weathering.

 

 

 

Final layout-testing this morning proved itself entirely capable of handing over 40 loaded minerals (all the spare space in the boiler is filled with 'Liquid Gravity'). 

 

This is definitely a 'layout loco', but, I hope captures the 'look' of an O4/8. It's definitely a 'budget' loco, too. 

 

The basic K's kit I bought for £20.00. It had been started (not very well, but fortunately glued-together), had some bits missing and came with no instructions (so what?). I obtained the Portescap in a 'gummed-up' condition, inside a partly-built GEM MR 4-4-0 (total cost, £40.00). I un-gummed the Portescap, and sold the loco body and tender for £20.00, including the wheels (old Romfords). Obviously, the loco wheels for the O4/8 were new (Markits), but the tender wheels (old Jacksons) were in the K's kit. The Bachmann B1 body was give to me (as were two others), so there was no cost there (thanks again Graeme, Graham and Andy). Even so, I don't think Bachmann B1 bodies are that expensive, even new. Other bits? Buffers and brass/nickel silver sheet came from stock, and there were just a few handrail pillars and wire to complete. Graham King's donation of the chimney and dome also helped considerably, so, thanks to him again. Other than the loco's wheels then, a pretty cheap loco? 

 

Ebay had nothing to do with this, of course. I obtained the bits from collections or at shows; you just have to look beyond the second-hand RTR! 

 

It's certainly superior to............

 

 

My original 45 years old O4/8, made from a mixture of K's, Jamieson and scratch-building.

 

But inferior to............

 

 

This Little Engines O4/8 (builder/painter unknown). This came from the estate of a deceased modeller, but didn't run very well. I made it run properly, and it's now the property of Sandra Orpen (and will be re-gauged for use on Retford).

 

Why did I not retain the best O4/8 of the three? Because I didn't build it myself! 

 

 

Any idea who sells the oval brass buffers?

I got the impression from the Bluebell guys posting on their FB site that they had enough to do with the loco while it is at Eastleigh and that the intention over time when at the Bluebell would be to do something with the more modern marker lights and perhaps add back the indicator box/panel

I'm told that it is electric blue, not BR blue? Would have been nice to see a green 73 but this loco never was green. Looks nice. Can anyone confirm that there is another 3 73's at Eastleigh, all stored I understand. 

No, not owned by the railway, it will be on a 10 year pay as it is used deal.

I noticed some words in the latest Bluebell Times concerning the use of the new HK carriage shed, implying that after the recent carriage cull there might be more. Perhaps to make space for the DEMU?

Charlie

Interesting read in the November Bluebell Times, "Firstly, the Bluebell has been offered an Oxted DEMU 1305 at no cost to the Railway. In fact, this unit formed the very last working by DEMU between Uckfield and Oxted in 2004. It is in sound mechanical and electrical condition but requires some bodywork repairs. Secondly, there may be the opportunity through a generous donor to be able to acquire an ED locomotive, which is already in regular use in the South East"

Scotsman is currently running with 60041 Salmon Trout's boiler.

4 hours ago, Dragonboy said:

I was at GETS on Sunday as I usually am and while there were undoubtedly some fine layouts on display on the ground floor I yearn for a good pre grouping layout where shunting takes place rather than the block train roundy roundy layouts that are beginning to dominate with their toothpaste box liveries and where the same train appears 4 times in 3 minutes.

 

As with many things in life these days I know I’m probably well out of step with the masses here.

 

Because the lift was out of action I was unable to get to see the layouts on the balcony’s this year due to mobility issues which make stairs too much of a challenge now so there may well be some gems I was unable to get to which would have been more to my taste.

I was exhibiting up on balcony 1 with my friend Ian's Holly Bank Grove layout, lighting up there was no better than in the main hall and to boot we had a flickering light above us at times. To exhibit I believe that the majority of layouts at the show would have appeared in Hornby magazine and probably selected by Mike Wild, might be wrong but I only saw only one EM and one P4 layout, both very nice, but the latter was very small, might have been one of the minimum space competition layouts, but everything at snails pace and far too high. Just as well that most disabled visitors could not access this area (broken lift). Two traders interested me, no problem with Isinglass, but C&L sell track and he didn't have any EM track and not for the first time. I think that he was more at home there talking to his mates. Unfortunately on the circuit there are others just like that, even when your trying to buy something off of them.

Out of step with the masses, you're not alone. There are some RTR models that you can easily get hold of, a Kernow GW 1361, I've managed to buy an etched chassis so I'm rebuilding an old K's model. A RoS J36, I didn't realise that PDK also made this model, but Paul has supplied an etched chassis and this is going under an old GEM J36? A Heljan class 21, no, converting a Hornby class 29. As much as I would like say a Hornby A2/1, the light green and the company ethics has put me off, so if I want one it will be via the PDK route. Only 2 current models interest me, having seen at GETS how it runs without its matching truck for extra pick-up, the Hornby 48DS, the other is a Hattons 6W tool van, I've just ordered it. A comparison with the Hornby model is like chalk and cheese, I'm paying £33 from Hattons, a similar Hornby model on a stand at GETS was £44, but the latter is rubbish in comparison. If you get a chance, look at how the centre axle on this Hattons model slides across , perhaps somebody else might take a photo on here. This purchase is a quick fix, I'd prefer the black 6 wheeler that appears on LB.

I'm bonkers but not totally, the 1361 is for an EM BRW layout I'm building, the J36 and cl21 are for a club EM BRScr layout. Anyone remember Sutherland models, I've an untouched ex LMS Stanier 2P 2-6-2T kit with the original solid brass milled chassis, probably need a scratchbuilt chassis, but this could be next in line. So I'm totally out of step with the masses.

Tony,

I can't see it mentioned in WW anywhere, but congratulations on Little Bytham winning the Hornby Magazine layout of the year award at the GETS exhibition. I just happened to be there when 2nd place was given to Pete Watermans cathedral layout, but sense prevailed when Little Bytham was announced. A shame that LB is not exhibited, a wider audience would appreciate it. The cathedral layout was worth a view just to see the tensioned overhead catenary, but looking at a Hornby LSL blue pullman derailing on straight track turned me off a bit. 

I don't know if anyone else on this forum visited GETS at Milton Keynes, I was there as an exhibitor, some very nice layouts, ok if you were after the latest model from the numerous box merchants but very little specialist trade for me to get enthused about. I obtained a loco drawing from Isinglass for a Nu-cast LNER E4 that I bought the other month, I've just read in the latest BRM that NC and partners have just released the E4 as a new kit. I wanted to buy some EM track, C&L were there, I think that it might be for 3 exhibition running, he didn't have any, what is that all about?

So sorry to hear that Iain Rice has left us to a better place, my preference for good reason has been to compensate loco chassis and I'd put it all down to Iain showing off his skills if I remember correctly at one of the old Chatham dockyard exhibitions. His articles were always a good read

All the best

Charlie

Pity that somebody can't help fund the restoration of the railways very own 80100.

I see that the Dukedog is due to go into Atlantic shed once Beachy Head moves to the main works. Always good to see some old Bluebell videos, here's one off of UT of the dukedog story. 

14 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Apologies for the late response Charlie,

 

I've been away tutoring for three days. 

 

The reference to 'disguising mistakes' was more to do with my own mistakes in painting finishing - piggly numbers and wobbly lining for instance. One should always ensure these are true before any weathering takes place.

 

You're right in thinking that Hornby's Thompson Pacific BR green is 'questionable'.

 

And, weathering certainly altered it.

 

 

Weathering by Geoff Haynes.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

No need for an apology, you mentioned previously your tutoring. I've watched this latest Hornby model railways program on the Yesterday channel and they, Hornby, have this specialist who looks after such things as liveries. Along with Simon I assume they gave the nod to the models being release. Perhaps it was the Kent air that day, or lack of knowledge, from memory the colour is different from the pre-production model, your HD City shows what they can do, so what was going on? I like your model weathered by GH, but it looks to hide a lighter green. Still a cracking model.

I seem to have a resistance to paying high prices for these newer models, if you can afford it all well and good. This might go back to a reluctance after buying the original B'mann A1 and WD, both had faulty motors from new, the A1 went back under warranty but I let the WD slip and replaced the motor myself. But I don't think that it is the primary reason. Whilst I like seeing good models cruise along, such as on your Little Bytham layout, I get more satisfaction out of making the models, closely followed by modifying RTR. So whilst looking at the Hornby A2 and the B'mann V2 recently, I went and bought an old Nu-cast V2 complete with wheels for £55, I already have a Branchlines chassis for it, perhaps somebody might comment on the Nu-cast model, the firebox shape looks ok to me, the tender is a 1980's whitemetal casting, could it be improved?

Can I give a bit of a danger warning to especially any BR(E) modeller who has not yet visited LB, I've had the delight of visiting Little Bytham twice and both times I've come away with a "that would be nice" feeling, all those lovely rakes of coaches and wagons, Pullmans especially? I already had an unmade DJH A3, so that came out of the box when I got home, so did a SEF A3? Then went into overthinking mode, why are there differences, which one is the best, will the other need modifying? I've not been for about 5 years but from the visit I still have on my list to buy a SEF A4's, it will end up well over the price of a Hornby RTR, but seeing properly made models like this leaves a lasting impression; and a hole in your wallet.

Charlie

Tony,

There I was enjoying a nice pint of Black Sheep listening to the BRM panel discussion between Phil Parker, Chris Mead, Graham Nicholas and yourself, when I choked somewhat, I thought that I heard you say that "weathering should not be used to disguise mistakes". A quick reverse and yes you did say that. Now, the other day I was looking at buying one of the Hornby A2's, it would have been the most expensive RTR model that I have ever bought,model costs have caught up with me somewhat, I'd previously decided not to spend that sort of money on a model which I consider has the wrong colour green. I can understand you waxing lyrical about some of the newer Hornby models in the BRM videos, I'd agree the B1 is particularly good, but do you really believe that the A2 out of the box is the right coloured green? I'm not totally convinced, but the weathered A2 you have shown photos of seems to cover it up some what?

Charlie

On 07/10/2021 at 08:21, Tony Wright said:

A fascinating summary Andy,

 

Please thank Richard.

 

Borchester? Though none of my locos ever ran on Borchester during Frank Dyer's day, some did after the layout was bought by a group of friends to continue its exhibition life. I photographed it for BRM, and the group was a little short of locos at the time, so I took some of mine down. They ran the 'conventional' way when power was applied (as did the group's locos), which suggests that Frank had wired his locos the 'right way round' to begin with. 

 

What has happened to Borchester now, I have no idea, but I don't believe my friends had to alter the control system when they bought it (perhaps a comment from 60526?). 

 

Borchester, one of the most-influential layouts of all time.............

 

Well we were not actually short of locos, we just didn't have all the right types that we were looking for or those we had were misbehaving.

Here is a photo of your J6 64234 leaving Wellow East Tunnel, taken when you came down to Borchester Towers for the BRM annual photo shoot. 

Again one of your locos, K2 61738 at the Southwold show in 2015

 Control system? I've written before on the extensive re-wiring we carried out. On the main station board we only replaced the yard controller with a like for like H&M mechanism. For all the point polarity switching we replaced Franks mechanical system with microswitches for reliability. We had a bit of a problem on the station approach, couldn't immediately solve the problem so replaced two relays and the problem went away, they looked in good condition, put it down to a life expired soldered joint. Frank had made two large relay boxes for controlling sections, points, signals etc from outside the main station through to the GN fiddleyard or Wellow Park, these were located under the GN fiddelyard. We had the original sketches which showed the logic of what was going on with the wiring around this area, an amazing bit of work, spent some time looking at what this trying to tell us and we eventually made some sense of it. We had to start from a point of view that it was right in the first place, don't fix it if it doesn't need fixing. We replace all the wires going to or coming out of the relay boxes and then sorted out the odd wire that had been soldered into the wiring loom at a later date, we either traced it back or remove it and looked to see what didn't work, that was the solution.

 All the GN fiddleyard was rewired and the existing controller replaced by a Gmaster unit. We added a small board off the end of the turntable to store some loco and replaced the rear storage sidings, added an extra one which incidentally was in Franks original plans and lengthened them slightly.

 All the GC fiddleyard was replaced, boards, track, wiring and controllers, it had to be made simple for casual users and it worked well.

Apart from a chat with the owners son at Railex Aylesbury a few years ago and me posting the detail about the signal indicator battery we haven't had any feedback.

Charlie

Ken, thanks for the information and suggestions. Ironically, one of the ends was loose and has come off fairly easily, so I might consider shortening the coach to suit the overlay, sacrilege to some but I'm looking to see if this can be sold for club funds. It was at the bottom of one of our stock boxed along with a Mallard brass etched 70' coach and a Falcon Brass 6W fish wagon? I think that the club has had them for sometime but some perhaps didn't know what they were? I think that the overlays will have to be taken off anyway because I can see some air bubbles. I'll see how I get on.

Charlie

Can somebody identify exactly who's manufacture this coach is. It is a model of a GWR H28 Restaurant Car, not shown but it runs on BSL 6W bogies, the floor, ends and roof are plastic, the sides are clear plastic or perspex looking very much like Southern Pride and the sides are overlaid with the GW format/livery, unfortunately over time the side overlay has shrunk. I've never come across a SP GWR coach but then I'm an Eastern modeller. MAJ?

Charlie

Ok thanks for the detail. What is the plan for the blue 47 that has come up from the WSR, is it going to be fitted with some clever electronics so that it can run up to Whitby?