Rhydgaled

On 13/12/2017 at 13:04, Steven B said:

Farish:

Standard 5MT

Standard Class 4MT

WD 2-8-0

N Class

Duchess

64xx

LMS 4F

Ivatt 2MT

Jinty

Class 40 (latest model)

 

 

 

I believe the Dapol OO Gauge class 73, 121 and 122 have a coreless motor.

 

Steven B.

Does this apply to the Bachmann (OO gauge) 64xx as well? I'm avoiding coreless motors because I am led to believe by at least one website that my controllers have feedback, but was planning to get a 64xx if Bachmann does another batch of liveries with one I actually would want. Do I need to change my plan to avoid a 64xx (in which case my autocoach would be fictiously worked by a Model Rail 16xx - I'm assuming that they won't be coreless)?

21 hours ago, D400 said:

I too contacted Hornby about replacement wheels and after a bit of back and forth they arrived this morning. 

 

I quick measure up of the old and new wheelsets reveals the following:

 

Old:

 

Diameter of Face (excluding flange): 12.15mm

Overall diameter (including flange): 14.55mm

Flange depth: 2.4mm

 

New (replacements from Hornby)

 

Diameter of Face (excluding flange): 12.16mm

Overall diameter (including flange): 14.35mm

Flange depth: 2.19mm

 

Standard Hornby Wheelset  (as used in non-sliding door Mk3s)

 

Diameter of Face (excluding flange): 12.58mm

Overall diameter (including flange): 14.46mm

Flange depth: 1.88mm

 

 

Hope this helps,

Bruce 

Thanks for this. 12.15mm on the sliding door mark 3s is closer to the 11.5mm diameter of my Limby power car, can you post some pictures of power cars and mark 3s together to see if they look like they are riding at the same height? Here's what the standard Hornby wheelset looks like with a Limby power car:

https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/gallery/image/91035-ride-height-comparison-coach-e-and-power-car/

If the new wheelsets fix this problem, can Hornby sell them as spares for those of us with the slam-door mark 3s?

So... Showing my ignorance here; does the container get unloaded into lorries at Felixstowe, or does the whole container go forward to somewhere else? Might it even go by rail to one of the distribution hubs in the Midlands? I'm assuming there aren't enough models to fill the container, so does anyone here know what the little 4mm scale 16xx panniers are sharing the container with? Or does the container contain lots of somewhat stale air?

23 hours ago, InterCity80s said:

Wonder where Coach B has gone?

20 hours ago, Global said:

To do a 9 coach IC they’d need to add a R40156C I think?

The original (uncorrected) image listed an R40153, but the Hornby website is now showing an R40156C instead as you suggest.

9 hours ago, guarded said:

Thank you!So that A and B variation completes the coaches I take it?

Apparently yes; I was told earlier (I think in this topic) that there should be R40156, R40156A and R40156B which should give you three of the ten vehicles (nine coaches plus the DVT) needed to make a full mark 4 set. We think/hope that the descriptions given on the image are incorrect (coach letters were different and the SV (kitchen) was first class not standard) and the actual models will be correct.

On 24/08/2020 at 17:55, The Johnster said:

I think that what probably happens is that Bachmann make them available in cycles, so we are expected to stock up on each type long cranked short cranked long straight short straight, so that there are never full stocks of all types in the shops, which is annoying.

Oh dear...

I just found this topic after placing an order with The Model Centre (being the only place I could find with all the other items I was after in stock, and I'm keen to minimise the number of deliveries) which included a pack of 36-055 Bachmann OO Gauge DMU Couplings Straight (x10) which they listed as "On Order With Supplier". I was thinking they'd get stock within a few weeks. Is my order (5 items including these couplings) going to be stuck with them for months?

On 09/01/2021 at 11:57, fiftyfour fiftyfour said:

Thanks for at least confirming for me that everyone in the last five pages rabbiting on about Mk4 TSO, TSOD and TFO was barking up the wrong tree! I was 95% sure they were classified TO etc and I'm 99% sure the T stood for Tourist, not Trailer but hadn't got round to looking it up.

I knew the first class and buffet were (at least initially, I forget whether they still are) known as PO (Pullman Open) and SV (Service Vehicle) but do sometimes refer to them as FO and RFO either because of a momentary lapse of that knowledge, or because I'm not sure others would know what I was on about, or (in the case of the buffet), I want to be clear regarding the classification of the seating (they were of course changed from first to standard at the Mallard refurb, but SV doesn't tell you that). I didn't know the standard class vehicles were listed as TO (I think I've seen them listed as TSO or SO elsewhere, but that might be from listings written by people like me who didn't know better). Given the lack of an 'S' for 'Standard' and the lack of a 'T' for Trailer on the PO and SV then my guess is that you are correct and the 'T' stands for Tourist on the mark 4s.

10 hours ago, adb968008 said:

Given that between London and Carstairs the ECML and WCML dont touch.. it could be a fictional divert, due to some engineering works on the ECML north of York.

Is York to Northallerton double-track or three/four tracks? And has it ever been closed for engineering? My guess would be that, if it did, the obvious diversionary route would be via Leeds and Skipton and from there dragged via Settle to Carlisle unless there is a north-facing junction at Carnforth where they could join the WCML. To get a drag over to Manchester you would need the ECML to be shut further south still and either go Grantham to Stoke via Nottingham and Derby or perhaps Retford to Manchester via Sheffield if there are junctions facing the right way.

4 hours ago, TomScrut said:

 

 

Traditionally they used HSTs 91/67 as you say, now they either use 9 car 800s OR 5 car 800 with 5 car 801 with all 4 engines at it.

 

OTOH I cannot think of any WCML diverts going down the ECML other than the CS services you mention which has me flirting with some CS mk5s.

Interesting; I hadn't thought that they might use 801s via Carlisle. I'd have thought it would be exclusively 800s with the 801s restricted to London - Leeds/Newcastle. Going back to WCML diverts, assuming it is at least four tracks south of where the Northampton route rejoins the main trunk, there are effectively two seperate electrified routes south of Crewe which presumably means they can keep at least two tracks available throughout most engineering work. Unless there was an all-lines block at Rugby...

11 hours ago, Phil-Essex said:

Hi Rhydgaled

 

I've measured the wheel diameter excluding flanges on both the old and new wheels and they appear to be identical. The only difference I can see is the depth of the flanges.

Thanks for the reply, but how do they compare to the power cars?

What I found was that one of my Limby power cars (and presumably my other power cars as well) had wheels around 11.5mm in diameter (excluding flanges), on my lima mark 3 coaches this measurement is 11.3mm and the Hornby tooled slam-door scale-length mark 3 had 12.6mm wheels. I took the couplings off the Hornby coach and a Limby power car to remove the gap between the coaches created by the tension locks and the gangways lined up with the Lima wheels on the coach but not with the Hornby ones.

1 minute ago, TomScrut said:

 

Very good point. Looks to me like they have duplicated a coach in the pack. So I wonder if it is 5 car or 4 car, the standard Avanti pack is a 4 pack.

 

IIRC the real life set is a 9 car.

I did wonder whether to mention the duplicated coach in R30081 as well, because I searched Flickr for a pic of the real thing and that coach doesn't appear to be duplicated there. Seems to be an 11-car set though, which I think makes sense given the set number (if I recall correctly the 11-car sets are subclassed 390/1). Perhaps you're right and R30081 is a 4 pack, with Hornby producing it as a 9-car with two vehicles missing / to follow in 2022.

On 05/01/2021 at 21:51, TomScrut said:

 

Whilst the LGBTQ+ movement isn't something I particularly support as such (I definitely don't disagree with it I just don't involve myself), I do like the liveries it has resulted in. That pride Pendo is brilliant, and I am contemplating that at 5 or 6 cars and a same length normal Avanti one to go with it if I can work out a geographical justification for it!

 

I have always been somebody who loves bright colours so I really like the liveries. I am surprised it has taken until now for a Pride of GBRF, just a shame it is a Hornby one!

That LGBTQ+ Pendo appears to be a 10-car set (5-cars in R30081 plus individual coaches R40196, R40197, R40198, R40199 and R40200). What am I missing?

On 05/01/2021 at 19:10, fiftyfour fiftyfour said:

The Mk3s they did last year are WRONG for making up a buffer Class 43+Mk3+Class 91 combo for two reasons- the numbers depicted are not from a set which was used, eight TGS vehicles received buffers and drop head buckeyes for attachment of the Class 91's and 44055 wasn't one of them. Also, the Mk3's released last year feature Central Door Locking which wasn't introduced until 1993, by which time that set was on Cross-Country and the short-lived 91 replacing a HST power car combo had been consigned to history.

Have Hornby EVER released a scale-length mark 3 TS, TF or 3-window buffet WITHOUT Central Door Locking (CDL) lights? Does their tooling allow them to do that? The recent GWR train set one (the only Hornby mark 3 I have) appears to have the moulded detail for the CDL lights but these have not been decorated as such (they are just painted the same green as the rest of the body). If Hornby were going to produce it without painting the CDL lights orange you'd think they'd use a body tooling without them if they had the option of doing so.

On 05/01/2021 at 21:10, adb968008 said:

Hornby often falls into a trap of making enough coaches to make a full rake...

but not recognising that some cannot achieve a full rake.

people will buy what fits their layout, So they buy at least one of each type of coach... resulting in duplicate numbers being left and unique coaches selling out.

 

In this instance Buffet / end coaches will sell, but 1st/2nd will be in abundance.

in the Midland Pullman, the TGS will sell out, and lots of 1st may be spare (though with 2 buffets, most will buy one or the other).

Other than serious modellers or rail fans I'm not sure the need for TSO(E) or TGS will necessary be appreciated. If I recall correctly, for many years I was completely unaware that these vehicles existed so at the time if I had a layout big enough for a 2+5 set (but no more) I would have been perfectly happy with a TFO, a buffet and 3 TSO vehicles with no TGS or TSO(E). Thus those 'end vehicles' are likely to sell slightly less well than the buffet and DVT. Couldn't Hornby book production slots with the factories for another batch of coaches to follow a while after the intial release but with the ratio of coach types / running numbers in the follow-up batch not specified until sales figures for the first batch start coming in?

On 06/01/2021 at 00:45, BR(S) said:

Class 89 working with HST DVT:

 

 

Was the HST DVT broken or was the 89 incompatible with the DVT since all your pics show the 89 coupled to the power car and not at the other end. Also, I note that there appears to be a mark 1 or mark 2 at the rear on the last pic (retained above), might that be a barrier vehicle with a normal TGS used instead of the buffer-fitted version?

12 hours ago, TomScrut said:

 

There's a bird stuck in that grille!

 

I think the bird was there (breifly) on 91119 when it was restored to Swallow livery recently. Within a few weeks it had disapeared again.

On 05/01/2021 at 19:17, TomScrut said:

 

They typically have null A B C etc.

Ah, ok fair enough. In that case they have enough product codes for a full ECML set, still dubious about the TfW offering though.

3 hours ago, Global said:

Thanks for the replies above, I’ve been looking at some videos on YouTube and the formation in InterCity days appears to have been 8 coaches, at least at the beginning, and lettering for for First Class seems to be G/H etc

 

TSOE

TSO (one TSO likely to be TSOD)

TSO

TSO

TSO

RFM

FO

FO

Hornby ‘seem’ to be incorrectly producing a current day formation but in IC livery, as the Buffet should be First Class and not standard and they’re also showing lettering up to L/M which doesn’t seem to be correct. 

 

I may be talking rubish here; I'm certainly not old enough to have memories of the early days (and indeed I expect the only IC225 I ever saw in Swallow livery before the real things had received GNER livery was my train set one), but for some reason I think they were ordered as 8 coaches but this was soon increased to 9. I read somewhere that there were also a number of 'Pullman' sets to start with (same 8 or 9 coaches, but two of them were buffet cars rather than the normal one buffet). The 'Pullman' sets may have lasted until the Mallard refurb, but I've no idea.

As for the coach lettering, the same range of letters seems to have been applied across the range announcement, even the TfW set(s):

On 16/12/2020 at 12:56, AY Mod said:

Note at the top it lists coaches B, C, D, E, F, H, K, L and M, plus the DVT. If we assume Hornby will be producing two full TfW rakes, rather than a fictional 9-car TfW set, then there should be two DVTs (not one), two kitchens (not one) , four SOs (not five) and two FOs (not three) and so the announcement is incorrect here*. If so, the same mistake has probably been made with the Swallow liveried rake.

* Also, there is only one SO with an accessible toilet and one FO with an accessible toilet listed. Two TfW rakes will either need two of one and none of the other, or two of both (I'm not sure whether the TfW sets have a first class accessible toilet or a standard class one, or both).

On 06/01/2021 at 13:35, Phil-Essex said:

I contacted Hornby regarding the wheels on my XC rake of SD coaches and have received a full set of replacement wheels today. Mistakes happen but glad that Hornby have shown great customer service for me on this occasion. 

Are you able to measure the diameter of the wheels (excluding flanges) and let us know what you find?

I have found that my slam-door Hornby mark 3 (the GWR train set one) has different diameter wheels to the power cars meaning the corridor connectors are at different heights and don't line up properly.

14 minutes ago, TomScrut said:

 

That works then doesn't it?

 

TSOE, 3 SO, 1 SOD, Kitchen, 1 FO, 1 FOD, 1FO (which I presume is a unique number being at the end) and DVT which means 8 unique numbers and 2 additional on one (the SOs)

Oh, I've fallen into a null trap have I? I make it nine vehicles as follows

1. R40152
2. R40153
3. R40154
4. R40156A
5. R40156B
6. R40191
7. R40159
8. R40160
9. R40161

If there is also a R40156<null> (ie. neither A nor B) then you are correct that there are enough vehicles to make up a rake but I assumed that the product with A and B versions would only be two running numbers not three.

I've now managed to identify Hornby's version of the Bachmann DMU couplings, X10632 Electrotren NEM Close Coupling, but still cannot find a cranked version for the HST power cars. Does anyone know whether a) the Hornby Electrotren couplings are compatible with Bachmann's DMU couplings and b) whether there is a cranked version of the Electrotren couplings for use with Hornby's IC125 power cars (if not, what are modellers supposed to use with the R4780 and R4852 TGS coaches, which appear to be supplied with Electrotren couplings?)?

Regarding the Ratio wagons, I have now found Hornby X6879 (Class 67 Accessory Bag) on Peters Spares. Apparently, this includes X2 Large Couplings, X2 Small Couplings, Dummy Hooks,  Vacuum Pipes plus other small parts. Does anyone know the part number for the large couplings as I think they might be what I'm after for my wagons? I have no need of the other items in the accessory bag so don't want to have to buy the whole lot.

6 hours ago, G-BOAF said:

Will these have close coupling mechanisms fitted as per the sliding door Mk3?

And what about the TSO(E) - I can't see this mentioned/specified....

It mentions coach B (which I think for recent liveries at least is the TSO(E)) but then again there appears to be only 8 Rxxxx numbers for each livery (one with A and B versions) when there should be 10 vehicles for a full rake (9 passenger vehicles plus the DVT makes 10) so maybe the TSO(E) is indeed missing.

5 hours ago, JackB95 said:

A very welcome decision by Hornby to announce the Mk4s and DVTs, both in their 91 days and indeed their upcoming 67 days - fantastic.

Very strange that 8 Rxxxx numbers giving nine different vehicles seem to be listed for the TfW mark 4s as well. Since I believe TfW will have 12 coaches and 3 DVTs it is in theroy possible that Hornby are releasing enough to have two full rakes with only one duplicated running number but it seems odd to do that for TfW while modellers wanting the ECML liveries will need to renumber (or omit one coach) to get a full rake without duplication.

2 hours ago, MGR Hooper! said:

Well as you'll all probably know by now, Hornby has announced re-tooled Mk4 coaches and a Mk4 DVT.

There's a dedicated topic for them here - 

 

No new running numbers / liveries for the upcoming retooled 91s though (eg. 91110)?

21 hours ago, fiftyfour fiftyfour said:

And regarding the Limby re-worked four window buffet- yes, its a hacked about Lima one with the following deficiencies; 1) if you take the roof off you may find the body is bowed as the roof was strengthened to hold the body straight and 2) the "fourth" bay window (actually the one nearest the kitchen both sides) is slightly bigger than the rest, Lazerglaze do a separate pack for this and 3) the roof is a horlicks most similar to loco-hauled RFM, so if using it for a HST it's so far wrong you are better off finding a beaten up coach with an OK roof on eBay and using that as the starting point and adding the vents.

Blast; that sounds like the 4 window buffet is a right bodge job which is a shame as I wanted one in a Swallow or Merlin IC125. Shame there wasn't a Lima 4-window buffet for Hornby to use as I could then look for the Lima one 2nd hand. At least you've saved me some time looking for one by letting me know that Lima never made it in the first place, so thanks for that. Maybe I should try blanking off windows on my Hornby TSO to make a 4-window buffet (I'm unlikely to do so though as I've never attempted anything like that before, although the coach is essentially a freebe since the train set it came in cost me no more than a pair of Railroad power cars).

All points to the need for 'one mark 3 range to rule them all'...

5 hours ago, hellotojasonisaacs said:

Forgive my pedantry, but the Mk4 buffets were altered significantly during refurbishment. The existing tooling is only suitable for Intercity and early GNER. A TSOE is also needed. 
 

I do agree though about bogies, couplings and the DVT. 

Sorry, I assumed the buffet changes were just interiors and livery, I didn't know any external changes were made. As for the TOE, I tried to steer clear of that by saying that the existing TSO/FO and buffet were reasonable - that implies the TOE isn't (because it doesn't exist) but, as fiftyfour fiftyfour said

Quote

With a clever bit of design a Mk4 TOE ought to be possible from a normal standard class coach, surely the only difference is a blanked off vestibule end?!

I don't know whether that would be straightforward production-wise though.

2 hours ago, fiftyfour fiftyfour said:

Lot to come back on there! Lima never did a four window buffet, only the three window one, but they did it in every livery they ever existed in upto and including 1999 FGW "Fag-Pack". The only four window buffet that has ever been done is the Limby RFM which is really only any good as an RFM as the roof vents/hatches are totally different to those found on any HST four window buffet (or indeed on any low numbered RFM which were converted from HST vehicles). This product was only ever manufactured by Hornby but re-worked the old Lima buffet tooling

So the Hornby 4-window RFM is actually Lima's 3-window buffet hacked about a bit; meaning Hornby could no longer produce the original Lima 3-window buffet?

Quote

I use scale length Hornby and Lima in the same formation and think they are fine, but probably best to flushglaze the Lima ones otherwise they stand out too much (and of course install one of those replacement interiors in any TSO/TS vehicle post BR blue- I need to make more sales, type "Hornby Mk3 interior" or "Lima Mk3 interior" into eBay!!) . I think Lima with flushglazing is unbeaten for a Mk3, the underframes are so uncomplicated on the real one that no super fine detail is ever going to give us a leap forward in appearance in my opinion.

Where do the Lima ones win out over the Hornby scale-length ones? Is it just that Lima did the TGS to allow a matching rake? One of my concerns with mixing Lima and Hornby in a rake is that roof ribs might look different (if I recall correctly Oxford's are rather under nourished) and gangway connection floors/rooves may ride at different heights (although flushglazing is something I probably would notice more if I were to mix them). If you are concerned with correct interiors, I think my Lima TSOs both shipped with 2+1 (FO) interiors, so they aren't correct for any TSO are they?

Quote

Wish list? Mk3 sleepers are scarce, they could bring out more blue/grey, more InterCity and more early private liveries and still sell out, the world and his wife models loco-hauled trains and they have been unavailable for a while now. Didn't Kernow do some "day" coaches to go with the Night Riviera current style and how good were they?

My comments on the Mark 3 sleepers weren't a 'wishlist'; I'm not particularly interested in a model of them and probably wouldn't buy. What I might buy mark 3 wise is correctly done Swallow mark 3s with a matching TGS and a re-run of DVT 82146 in EWS management train livery (without the coaches and 67 that it was bundled with last time).

I'm just thinking that a 'one mark 3 range to rule them all' would ultimately require alot of models so I was wondering whether it would make sense to start with the sleepers; how many different vehicle types are required? A full mark 3 range would need (I'm no expert on mark 3s, I've probably missed some and misplaced others):

• Mark 3a (SO/FO, Buffet(s), SLE? / SLEP?, etc.)
• Mark 3b (DVT, FO, BFO?, etc.)
• Mark 3h (TGS, TSO/TFO, TRUB/TRFB, TRSB/TRB, etc.) (IC125 coaches)
• Mark 3p (DVT, FO/SO, Buffet) (Chiltern Plug Door coaches (and modified DVT))
• Mark 3s (TGS, TSO/TFO, TCC, etc.) (sliding door coaches)

You'd never get all of that in one year's range, but which vehicles do you pick out to start the ball rolling? In terms of quality, the Lima and Hornby scale-length coaches are adequate in themselves, but the lack of consistency between them (and missing variants, and the DVT looking out of place with it's different (although probably better) gangway connection) is a cause for concern.

2 hours ago, Gibbo675 said:

Modern branch lines have little or no goods traffic to speak of with just the same unit or possibly two trundling backwards and forwards. Modern mainlines have hugely long goods trains of 18 plus bogie wagons plus locomotive and the passenger trains tend to be a couple of types of identikit units. To me this spells branch line boredom or huge and expensive main line layout.

Depends on the branch line. Some are operated with through services to far flung destinations, rather than forcing passengers to change onto mainline services at the junction. In this case, rather than the same unit or two shuttling back and forth you need a whole pie of them with different running numbers (which makes Hornby's 153 rather expensive, shame they don't have a Railroad version). That's part of the reason I've picked the era I have (end of BR and early days of TOCs); rather than just different numbers I can have Regional Railways and various different Wales & West advertising liveries.

On 09/12/2020 at 21:46, fiftyfour fiftyfour said:

I'm still one of those lunatics that think that the Lima Mk3's have yet to be beaten as slam door HST trailers. Add the Lazerglaze flushglazing, and install one of those great new interiors* in the TS vehicles if doing any livery post blue/grey and tidy things up a bit around the end beams and couplings and to my eye a very good standard of HST can be produced when sandwiched between a pair of Hornby power cars. Having come at the TRSB problem from both directions my conclusion is that hacking about with a Lima Mk3 buffet to create a four window version is a better starting point than the Limby RFM (you need a donor TF or TS to rob two full window bays and the "blank canvas" of a standard trailer roof to add the correct pods to, but the RFM is miles away from a TRSB when viewed from above). 40619 (to which you refer) was a three window bay buffet with first class (so not far off the Lima or Hornby buffets) was only ever a short term spare in the Cross-Country fleet on and off during the 1990's and is a bit of a hybrid/freak show to trial "cuisine 2000" which fell out of favour almost before it began.

 

*declaration of personal interest whilst stocks last!!

Lima's mark 3s certainly beat the Oxford Mark 3a hands down; the underframe skirt on the Oxford model is the wrong shape.

Regarding buffets, is the 4 window buffet something Lima made in a range of liveries (I asked this before (in a specific topic) but have no answers yet)?

On 09/12/2020 at 16:33, wombatofludham said:

The Oxford and Hornlimby Mk3s don't sit well together in a rake.

Of course. The Hornby (scale length) slam-door and Lima mark 3s I have are far more similar to each other than either appears to be to the photos I've seen of Oxford's mark 3s. Even so, I'm not sure Hornby mark 3s and the Lima TGS will sit well together in a rake (the Hornby is a different livery). I'm not sure whether to stick my Hornby TSO on Ebay and try and source 2nd hand Lima items or whether it would look ok if I resprayed it into to the desired livery (which the Lima ones are in).

On 13/12/2020 at 20:14, RyanN91 said:

Also a BR MK3 Sleeper coach could be reintroduced the prices for second hand and old new stock at the moment well I...

What are/were the formations of the Night Riviera and Caledonian Sleeper with mark 3 stock? I know the Night Riviera has a mark 3 BFO (which if you had the CADs for a TGS and an appropriate LHCS mark 3 (3b I assume, or is the BFO mark 3a?) would probably be only a minor job on the CAD front) but what else do you need? What mark 2s did Caledonian Sleeper use; 2d, 2e or 2f?

On 14/12/2020 at 17:07, adb968008 said:

i’d class mk4’s as historical at this juncture, but equally think a revamp of the old ones would suffice, people would buy LNER mk4’s on an old tooling just as much as they would buy them on new. They could spin the wheel on that old tooling one more time and get away with it, so save 6 figures to invest in something else later. I suspect beyond LNER many will pause for thought once they see the price tag, before going wild replacing older ones (GNER, IC etc), what people say they want, what they actually need and what they do are different, especially when faced with a wide choice of models competing for a smaller slice of the wallet... 

I'd agree that the existing mark 4 TSO/FO and Buffet are probably ok with a revamp (mainly bogie changes, eg. NEM pockets and remove parts that should be body-mouted instead) but the cab end of the DVT needs alot of work (the inner end needs to match the coaches).

I'm trying to work out what replacement couplings to order for my Lima and Hornby (Railroad) IC125(s) and Ratio kit-built wagons.

With the original tension locks supplied with the kit, my Ratio kit-built wagons appeared to hate 2nd radius curves (including Setrack points) which I think was a least partly due to the couplings (which were rather stiffer than the tension locks supplied with modern RTR).

On the advice of this topic I have ordered a pack of Parkside's PA34 Mounting Blocks For Bachmann NEM Coupling Pockets but the pockets only seem to be supplied with Bachmann's DMU couplings or narrow tension locks (I have an Airfix RTR wagon with narrow tension locks and these seem rather unrealiable) - can I get them with wider tension locks (my best guess is that I need an uncranked version of the tension locks Hornby supplied on my RailRoad Blue & Grey IC125 power cars)?

For the IC125, I think the DMU couplings would be better than the tension locks supplied (on the basis that they provide great close coupling between the vehicles of my Bachmann 158s (old tooling)). However, I can only find the DMU couplings cranked down, whereas the Railroad power cars have couplings which are cranked up. Maybe Hornby have something suitable since recent batches of their slam-door mark 3s appear to have (from internet photos) a version of the Bachmann DMU couplings.

9 hours ago, wombatofludham said:

Whatever they announce, I suspect there will be nothing for me.

There, I've said it.

One thing that I do wonder, given the way the Skaledale range suddenly annexed Oxford's buildings, is if Hornby might have been secretly working on Oxford's plans for the IC125 Mk3 trailers (no, I don't mean the slidey doorey thingies, I mean the original slam door Mk3 trailers) to overcome the loco hauled Mk3 stock fragility and make them more robust, and release them to complement their full fat power cars?  Oxford have gone very quiet on the rail range, and it seems bizarre that the chance to deliver a complete range of nicely tooled, but robust, IC125 Mk3s hasn't been pushed a bit harder.  Part of that might have been down to the luke-warm reception the Oxford loco-hauled Mk3s got due to their gimcrack coupling and footboard design and of course greygate, but I wonder if the planned Oxford IC125 trailers are quietly being brought into the Hornby main range, with the existing models going into Railroad?  It seems an open goal:  lovely main range power cars, still selling at a premium price, but without the same quality passenger vehicles for them to sandwich.

The "annexation" of the Oxford range of buildings by the Skaledale brand seemed to fly under the radar of most commentators, but I wonder if some realpolitik has broken out about the stated intent for Oxford and Hornby to remain separate and the rail range might slowly be merged, leaving Eloise to concentrate on the die-casts?

So - I wouldn't be surprised to see a new range of HST Mk3 trailers, even though the current ones seem to sell well despite their deficiencies, using Oxford's design and research.

6 hours ago, MGR Hooper! said:

 

I would also like to see the Oxford Rail Mk3 stock absorbed into the Hornby range.

 

They will certainly benefit from the better production standards that Hornby has. Yes I know Hornby faces QC issues every now and then and I know they also have had their fair share of problems with colours, but overall they've done a better job of such things. 

 

I really do hope that a majority of the Oxford Rail range is also brought under the Hornby brand. Oxford Rail have gone a little quiet lately. 

It's hard to tell from internet photos, without having seen either model in the flesh, but from what I've read and the photos I've seen on the internet Hornby's updated mark 3s (the sliding door ones) seem to be a better product overall than the Oxford ones. In particular, the underframe skirt/box on the Oxford model appears much too boxy in one or two pictures (again, it is really hard to tell from internet photos whether Hornby's model also suffers from this) but I think a new mark 3 range based on Hornby's CADs for the sliding door model would probably be the better bet. They have both the slam door and the LHCS-style roof vent detail in the sliding door CADs already; the only thing I can think of that might be missing is the toilet windows. I would like to see a consistent range of IC125 trailers, whether that is done by making an all-new range, making a new TGS and 4-window buffet to match the existing Hornby TSO and 3-window buffet or reviving the Lima tooling of the TSO and 3-window buffet to provide a full range of Limby mark 3s. But, with the underframe on the Oxford model being the wrong shape, I hope they don't go down that route. I have both a Lima train pack and the recent Hornby GWR train set (which I believe is a pure Hornby mark 3 despite the Limby power cars) and both the Lima and Hornby mark 3s look like a mark 3 to me, I'm just not sure they would sit well together if you mix them in a rake.

If they do take the all-new range approach, the one problem that seemed to be flagged up on the Hornby sliding door mark 3 topic was the cast wheels with oversized flanges which were a problem (perhaps only on code 75 track). Do the Oxford mark 3s have better wheels? If so, perhaps the solution is a range based on (and including) the Hornby sliding door mark 3s but using the wheels from the Oxford model.

On 08/12/2020 at 01:26, nathan70000 said:

91111 looks incredible.

 

I'm not a fan of those lights, they look completely wrong but the rest of the model looks excellent so far. I wonder if they'll do a TTS chip with the characteristic "hum".

 

I grew up with the 91s so I'd definitely consider pre-ordering one, but ONLY if they announce some MK4s to go with them...no point in just buying the loco by itself. The old MK4s aren't actually that bad, there's very little detail they'd need to add, NEM couplings, tinted windows, and lights in the DVT and job's a good'un. Obviously they'd need to tool up a TOE and modify the windows on the buffet for the post-GNER sets but it shouldn't be too much outlay for them.

If they do 91110 in Battle Of Britain guise I might order that (without mark 4s) for a display shelf. Other than that I agree; not much point in a 91 without mark 4s to go with it (which is why, if on the full size railway the 125 group branches out into mark 4s I'd almost certainly donate).

6 hours ago, MGR Hooper! said:

 

Well Hornby may have a lot of trouble getting basic colours right (GWR green, BR green, Caledonian Teal, GBRf blue etc etc.)... But they sure can get complex liveries spot on. And we've see that so many times (Hitachi IEP Test cars, Battle of Britain Class 91 and now this!) 

Battle of Britain class 91? Have I missed it or are you referring to the Model Rail limited edition done with the old tooling (which I was tempted by, but the fakeness of the lights on the old tooling is such a let down - that and the pantograph are the only things I want to upgrade on my 1990s Swallow liveried train set (plus perhaps adding cantrail lining on the TSOs to match the buffet and sold-separately TSO)).

I understand that Hornby only tooled two versions of their scale-length mark 3 coaches (excluding the new sliding-door ones):

• 3-window buffet (TRUB/TRFB)
• First Open / Standard Open (same bodyshell for both as per the real thing)

Lima produced at least the following:

• TGS
• First Open / Standard Open
• SLE / SLEP (are these the same or different, and if the latter did Lima produce both?)

Did Lima also produce multiple types of buffet? When looking on Ebay for Merlin coaches, I've found some 3-window buffets (TRUB/TRFB) which are captioned as Lima products. However, when Hornby obtained Lima's tooling they started to produce 4-window RFM/TRSB/TRB mrk3 buffets. Did Lima produce these or did Hornby modify Lima's TRUB/TRFB tooling?

The reason I'm asking is that I'd like a 4-window buffet (TRB I think) and was wondering what liveries they have been produced in.

On 14/09/2020 at 15:26, Steamport Southport said:

If by HM 2000 controller you mean this I don't think it's a feedback controller. Never seen it on any list saying avoid.

 

https://www.Hornby.com/uk-en/hm2000-power-controller.html

 

If the R965 is this one I would be a bit more hesitant using it. But I don't think it would cause any damage. 

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Hornby-R965-Controller-Systems-Control/dp/B0000AFQ3E

 

I don't think train set controllers have been feedback for the last thirty odd years. The Chinese made ones certainly aren't feedback.

 

Jason

Both are listed as feedback on the page I linked to earlier:

On 08/09/2020 at 14:10, Rhydgaled said:

both the HM2000 and the Hornby R965 (which I think are the Hornby train set controllers I have - they certainly look like that) are listed as feedback controllers here.

The relevant sections of that article read as follows:

The Hornby R965 controller: "is a feedback type that uses a thyristor (or SCR) as an electronic element switching a rectified but unfiltered source of dc, at line frequency."

The HM2000 controller: "It is clear from observing the output waveforms below that it is a thyristor-feedback design, like the Hornby basic R965 or Gaugemaster feedback designs." and "It exhibits some of the heating characteristic of a PWM design. It has a modest degree of feedback"

On 11/08/2020 at 18:40, Hilux5972 said:

As I said earlier in the thread, it was reported from Simon Kohler by someone that questioned him, these wheels are cast to give the brake disc detail, rather than being turned. They could be replaced and have brake disc inserts added. Why they couldn’t have cast them and then turned down the flanges is beyond me though. Seems pretty simple enough to do. 

Are these cast wheels the same as those used on the RailRoad class 395, which also has brake disc detail? For some reason there are three different sets of class 395 wheels listed by Hornby as spares, two of which (this one and this one) look the same to me but have different prices (the third set is the motor-bogie wheels).

If the class 395 wheels are better than the ones fitted on the mark 3s, would the 395 wheels be suitable for use on future mark 3 releases?