robmcg

Presumably if all these models are being shown at exhibitions, the production versions do actually exist ... ? Has anyone heard anything about things being 'on the boat' or something a little more definite than 'hoped for'...?

Without meaning to cause problems Jeff, are you going to give super elevation to the curves on the viaducts? Shoud be about a scale 1-2" higher on outside curve, or a wedge of cardboard under outer rail. I say this because I glued track down on my tabletop railway in 2005 and regretted not being able to add a 'cant' or super elevation to curves. You understand that it is spring down here, and the garden is full of busy birds, plants are growing madly, and anything is possible... Rob (NZ)

Thanks Jeff, it's great to be able to exchange ideas, especially when you do all the work! Sunny early Spring evening here, sun just setting, beautiful... I'll keep in touch with more mad ideas if I have any. Usually I model something or photograph it, and then invent a prototype situation. Rob

Hi Jeff, Thanks for the reply. As I understand it, odd things happen in England at the equinox, dogs howl, things go funny all round. On looking at your layout plan in post 585 my first reaction is that I would put a three-road engine shed in the foreground of the station, a very rough idea for which I show below. This is mostly because I like collecting engines and would never be constrained by S&C limits... the existence of a shed servicing mainly helpers for grades would be plausible, coaling and turning and associated palava entirely optional either near the shed or at the signal box end, and the old shed from the branch line service days is also very BR ... variable choices. The layout would be my setting for any number of lovely engine portraits! Of course it's probably too late now so all I've done is give you a headache. Robbie

For what it's worth Jeff the photos of your track are excellent, it all looks very good, and I await with interest to see how things progress. My own efforts in constructing some C&L track are delayed while the local agent threads the chairs onto rails for me, meanwhile I 'paint' track in current pictures with photo editing. Some day I will have decent code 75 bullhead track ion my photos and it will make all my old stuff look very poor! Best, Robbie

Hattons appear to have very modest delivery costs on pre-orders. I think the pre-production pictures are excellent! Anyone care to bet on whether the fixed bunker or rotary bunker will be first on the shelves? I have ordered two rotary versions, one heavily weathered, one lightly weathered, and wait expectantly. Rob

Actually wind blowing off or along the flank of a sloping hillside could easily push one end of a turning engine if the engine was side-on, on a turntable set flat into the hillside with one half 'exposed' and one half sheltered. It does not take a huge force to turn a well-balanced loco on a well-lubricated turntable. An 80mph gust could easily set it off, and the point where the engine was 'end-on' to the wind, well, there is inertia to keep it spinning, so long as one side of the turntable is exposed to wind and the other not exposed, an engine could spin all day.... Wind commonly blew trains off tracks around here over the years, and strong side winds were the very worst feeling for crews, sometimes reducing to about 15mph... for safety as much as anything. In any event it would be highly plausible on the S&C to have an unattended locomotive left spinning on a turntable. I fully expect Jeff to incorporate a powered turntable into his layout to this end. Local colour, as they say. Rob

Some degree of image processing would be a pleasure, but no green BR diesels please. Here is Hornby's lovely weathered Black Five... just needs nice track and well-drawn background really. and maybe a better photo to begin with, as I might do sometime soon. Always a learning curve for me, this photo business! I took this one some years ago on a 6ft long diorama..

A most enjoyable read, is this thread, thankyou Jeff. I particularly enjoy the opportunities for thread drift, as in the wind-blown nature of parts or all of the S&C., the references to sheep, I feel entirely at home! You mentioned that your father was a joiner, and this makes me think of the building of the viaducts on the line, as well as in most other parts of Britain, where stonework was done via timber supports and scaffolding, spectacular edifices in their own right and in the case of the S&C in very unfriendly locations.. and ne'er a mention in Thomas Hardy's novels. Oops, they probably built viaducts in Wessex and left out the stonework! As to high wind, and in the spirit of complete thread drift I offer a video taken about a week ago of a New Zealand Railways 'J' class 4-8-2, the kind which was designed in 1938-9 and built by North British of Glasgow (almost S&C country really) and then after WW2 by our own workshops, No.1271 being built in 1955 ..steam reverser, fully roller-bearing, capable of 70mph on the Canterbury Plains with unaided 16-total express trains, all on 3' 6" and quite tight loading guage rather like the SR Hastings line. I travelled on the cab engines like this in the 1960s when I was 15 or so and had an 8mm movie camera or a 6x6 twin-lens reflex still camera and rolls of FP3. It gives an idea of the inspiration I have for my pictures. The video shows exactly where I grew up and spent much of my time watching trains. And apologies to the forum moderators for my tangental offerings.. it's too much time in the cold wind waiting to photograph trains you know. And yes, the turntable stockade would have been a windbreak, even though it's possible for crosswind to vary from one end of an engine to another, so I fully believe the story! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXsq6dEl_7o&feature=plcp

I too have always liked the atmosphere of the Settle and Carlisle, the land is similar to some parts of NZ. I have never been to the UK except by reading such as O S Nock .. evoking images of the trains from Carlisle to Yorkshire, and having had untoward influences upon my innocent self by anglophilic teachers.... a tradition which is quite strong in NZ. Although not so many kids learn Latin these days. My mother was born in Guildford in 1921 as I have quite probably mentioned before somewhere or other, so I am bound to favour the southern part of England. On the other hand her father was the son of a Great Northern Railway director who traces his roots to Westmoreland. In any event I have always lived and breathed such as Meccano, Hornby, motorbikes I owned and rode for years, BSA AJS Norton and Triumph, then Jaguars and other British cars... the cars in particular I took pride in dismantling and assembling properly after export from the UK! Well, some 1970s cars were, shall we say, imaginatively assembled. It's once again entirely off-topic but in view of my Southern Region 'thing' I recently read a book about SR driver Bert Hooker, and he made reference to an unrebuilt Bulleid Pacific 'going missing' somewhere west of Exeter. I like the idea of complete Southern Region express trains going missing, and I think the culprit may have been valve gear oil bath leakage and slipping. So I photographed my latest folly, a Kitmaster/Dapol exercise which cost 9 Pounds and was a good test of my very average kit-building skills. I put the engine on a grade somewhere, certainly not shy of steam even with a 250lb boiler. Bert preferred the unrebuilt Bulleids to the rebuilds. I look forward to photos of your expanding railway, and wish you well with it as winter approaches. or, as Bert would have driven it, with an equally skilled fireman... 11-on for 390 tons... and I had to get some proper steam engineering into a Settle and Carlisle thread!

You gentlemen do realise that your conversation is being observered by an antipodean. 15C ? Luxury! Sounds as if the planned railways are good and sometimes perhaps even enjoyable. Remember, I expect sacrifice in the quest for perfection. A bit of freezing weather would be good for you both! Robbie (NZ lower North Island where there is snow on the hills today) (and why model S&C when we both know that Southern Region BR is civil, dignified, and post-card-like? ... none of these windswept moorlands with the ghosts of 1870s navvies...)

In general appreciation of the Hornby B1 and the inimitable pleasures of the 1950s BR travel experience, here is a somewhat messed-around version of an unmodified 61138 presumably after a visit to the paintshop.... What a lovely model!

I kno how you feel! They are really nice models. I looked back through some old photos I took, showing the older tooling with Crimson Lake LMS 'Jutland' and an early BR 'Hong Kong' with the different (shorter?) firebox. I would like to buy the Irwell Press 'The Book of the Jubilees' but it appears to be out of print, or very expensive. I wonder if Bachmann will produce another in LMS livery ...? to match the Crab, of course! Rob

Maybe because the Jubilee model, outstanding though it is, has been around for a few years now, and most people who want one now have one (or several). At the prices you mention, it certainly is tempting to buy extra and maybe re-number or modify one. They were graceful locomotives, and always look good in model form with those large drivers a valve gear... Rob

A rather old postcard style of the clean-paint Tintagel... Hornby have a lovely engine. or, in cigarette-card colour...! Presumably around 1934... Rob

Ack! I'm so jealous. Mine cost a lot more... and it took two attempts to get one with good paint!

Replacement Tintagel arrived this morning, looks superb. The more GWR-era Castles the better. Photos show the replacement model from 2 angles, a third pic shows my weakness for modifying photos which the case of Castles means shadow where front cylinders are, and slightly more 'scale' wheel flanges on front wheels. Hornby have done a lovely job and a shame about the faulty paint on my first purchase... the shop only had two. All of my Castles (five at last count) have run perfectly. Rob liberties with computer image around front wheels below...

Clearly there are few RTR coaches to suit Great (crest) Western locos, but the post war G W R Castle will look nice with the currently available chocolate and cream Hawksworths. Thanks for the advice. Rob

I share your anguish... the recent Hornby Castle and Bachmann City do rather celebrate some fine steam engineering and fine modelling. Not to mention the Robinson GWR ex-ROD... Rob

Having received my Tintagel Castle this morning I was pleased that it had the correct smokebox and no obvious paint issues at a first glance in good daylight, but closer inspection revealed some damaged surfaces on the smokebox, then I noticed feathering on the r/h firebox area, as well as r/h cabside, see photos. Not very bad, but since I often photograph these models and re-sell them, I have asked for a replacement from the dealer, who is happy to do so. (Acorn Models, Christchurch NZ). I consider it a lovely model, regardless of the slight paint imperfections. They aren't very different from prototypical cleaning marks..I feel rather sorry for the manufacturers and retailer, as I doubt it was an easy fault to detect during production. Should have another one by Friday. Just to show that the issue of paint finishing faults is not confined to Tintagel Castle, I show below also the same problem on the smokebox and firebox-side of Beverston Castle, although in this case perhaps within acceptable limits? I have had similar issues with weathered rebuilt West Countries too, but overall very rare problems.

With costs rising for the planning and production of new models, one wonders if if a 28XX cab, tender and some suitable Swindon boiler without external steam pipes might not be a possible way to produce a 'Star'. Sounds quite simple on the surface.... but I'll bet it's not!

Oh dear, I didn't realize the Bachmann Collett 3rds and Brake 1st/3rds were of such late production... might I ask if the prototypes ever carried the words 'Great Western' separated by a coat-of-arms, as in some of their models? 34-052A and 34-076A... which two which I have bought. Rob

Many thanks, the disscussion of details is very interesting. For me the main thing is correct shape steam pipes and no mechanical lubricator, plus the front cylinder housing. I shall have to try to overlook the incorrect cab fitting for a mechanical lubricator gauge. As someone further along the thread mentioned, I wonder if a King or Star will every be produced to the standard of the new version Castle? Also, I should have read further back into April 2011 to discover the original posts about damaged models. My apologies. Also I apologise for not making it clear that I meant Bachmann Collett carriages to go with 5011... not 0-6-0s. Rob (who has bought a Tintagel and will see it arrive here by parcel post probably next Tuesday, can't wait!)

Thankyou Paul and others who replied. Regardless of the faltering start of production and eventual truncated sale of 5011 'Tintagel Castle' the earlier 'Great Western' livery, (which would not suit the marvellous Hawksworth carriages), there does seem to be a preponderance of double-chimney versions currently on sale. I have a couple of early BR single chimney versions, and one 'Ince Castle' with double chimney. I think I have found a Tintagel but shock horror it is at normal retail price. Good grief does anyone ever pay normal retail anymore? I will keep you informed and perhaps load a picture after I buy it, ..might match it with some early livery Bachmann GWR Colletts. Am I right that the Collett versions with lining would be more suitable than those without? Could someone suggest what time line would suit each style? Also I would be interested in small details like lubricators and steam pipes on 5011 and if they are correct. One thing I like to do on my Castles is to put a rectangle of vertical black card replicating front cylinders between the frames, or at least paint shadow in photos, as the amount of daylight showing through the frames in this area is my 'pet fussy detail issue'... In any event the pre-1935 version Castle does seem to be a rather rare model. And before I forget, they really are superb models of what my father considered the finest of British steam engineering ever, all things considered. Ah! but first, a Bachmann weathered ex-ROD 2-8-0 has just arrived on my doorstep! First things first! Rob

Ah! This, in view of my above question, seems to be the best guess.... that the incorrect smokebox detail was fitted to Tintagel Castle and Hornby didn't continue with a substantial production run? Apart from other possible quality control issues. But I am still just guessing... edit; found a photo on Olivia's Trains website and smokebox looked fine to me (no number) but site didn't say if it was in stock... further edit, found this photo from Hattons (slightly shaded by me) and I'm not sure what the errors were or may be on this model... it looks good to me, but as far as I know Hattons didn't list it in normal searches. Rob