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Ravenser

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Things have not been going particularly well for Mercia Wagon Repair recently. As a result I've become rather disheartened and I've been wondering whether I should in fact pull the plug on the project.

 

Issue number one can be seen here:

DSCN1605web.jpg.7aed8dc16e86eca56786866a21a7bf73.jpg

 

A key point, buried fairly deep in the track plan has broken up at the tie bar.

 

This is the second point to break up at the tie bar out of 7 points I've bought so far (The first large radius point disintegrated at the tie bar before I even laid it.). That is within 9 months of starting work on this project. This particular one failed a few weeks ago during use. It uses a Peco motor fitted to the designed-in attachment holes: in other words I'm using a proprietary product exactly as it is designed to be used.  I've never had such failures in forty years in 4mm.

 

At this stage there seem to be two possible approaches:

 

- Extract the plastic tiebar, somehow, and try to wiggle a replacement PCB tiebar  under the rails and also over the actuating pin of the point motor. Not a nice or easy job  

- Buy a replacement point. Cut out and extract the old point, wire and lay the new one. Reconnect wires ...

 

Then there is the matter of frog switching

 

The Peco leaflet with the Code 55 N gauge points makes no mention at all about connecting the frog to a switch to supply it with power. I've read the thing 4 or 5 times carefully through, and  such a reference to frog switching simply isn't there (though from memory such instructions do appear with 16.5mm electrofrog points). All that the leaflet says is "Turnouts are ready for immediate use - seperate levers are not necessary ."

 

On 4mm electrofrog points there is a wire run to the side , for the purpose of feeding the frog off a switch. There is a linkage wire under Code 55 N gauge points , connecting the swtich rails and the frog - but there is no "loose" wire to link to a  polarity switch     

 

There is every sign that Peco expect purchasers simply to lay their Code 55 N gauge points as they come, and rely on contact of the switchblades with the stockrail. That is an unreliable contact, and risks leaving the entire switchblade /frog assembly dead - about 3" of track.

 

(Not a theoretical comment . I've seen this on the wagon works fan , and it is a serious issue for a layout designed around shunting wagons with an 0-6-0 diesel shunter. You should get away with it when running a bogie diesel with all wheel pickup, especially a long one like a Class 66, but wagons are supposed to be shunted around the Works by 0-6-0s)

 

I tried to tweak the tips of the switchblades on the offending point to ensure contact. I think it may have been the point I had to tweak for switchblade contact - which may have ultimately led to the failure. You can understand why I'm less than impressed with this product...

 

Having recounted this in a thread elsewhere , someone (with whom I've previously crossed swords several times) appears to state that you can in fact lift the linkage wire "frog jumper" underneath Peco Code 55 points and attach a wire to this "jumper" in order to connect the frog to a polarity switch on the point motor , thus providing a switched power feed to the frog and switch blades. (Which is the best way to wire a live frog) . But -

 

I've already laid the points. To get at that wire connection and solder on a feed wire to a polarity switch I'd have to lift the points. 

 

The track is laid and wired and running. Lifting it all and replacing the cork  would amount to "scrap and start again"

 

It might - to a 4mm mind - seem possible just to accept the issue and carry on. But over the past few months I've picked up disturbing vibes that shunting and shunting/operational layouts are "not what N gauge is about" :

 

Quote

I'd put forward "it depends what you want" from modelling. I model N because I want longer more prototypical trains. N isn't for shunting or constant loco swapping.  [my added emphasis]

 

It may be unfair to seize on a single comment, but it crystallizes a vibe I feel in the air.

 

Shunting in N using the "standard" Arnold coupling seems to be regarded as pretty iffy. I have gone for the replacement Dapol Easi-Shunt knuckle couplers - effectively NEM Kadees in N. But they are costing me over £5 a vehicle. They frequently require packing of the NEM pocket to limit or remove drooping , which results in the tail fouling pointwork . And my impression after 3-4 operating sessions is that they are rather less certain and reliable in coupling  than the Kadees I use in 4mm on Blacklade. They uncouple over the fixed Dapol uncouplers, not always conveniently. As usual, successful delayed action is rather elusive.

 

Put another way - can you remember seeing many "shunting planks" in N? (Either at shows or in the magazines.) Many branch line termini?  An N gauge Minories?  Micros or Boxfiles using N? N gauge inglenooks and other shunting puzzles?

 

On reflection, the typical N gauge layout seems to be a longish continous run. Commonly on a 2'6" deep solid board , with 12" return curves at each end, and the fiddle yard hidden behind a backscene set 2/3rds of the way back. Operation consists of firing a train out of the fiddle yard, sending it round the the circuit and back into a road in the fiddle yard.

 

"Cavalcade" layouts do not interest me. I don't want to build one, I don't have the space for one. That is not what Mercia Wagon Repair is about.

 

Am I trying to do something in N that everyone knows cannot and should not be done in N? A project that cannot and should not be?

 

When I've raised the issue of shunting in N - apart from the implications of trolling and being offensive - I've been assured that the NGS Hunslet is the very bee's-knees in N gauge running. There can be no question of things being possible in 4mm that are not possible in N.

 

So I bought one, and here it is:

 

DSCN1607web.jpg.85518834b605dbea4af249ecfbe12548.jpg

 

It is indeed a very small locomotive. It cost me £82 which in this day and age is a remarkably keen price (I stuck a wagon kit for a TTA in with the order to bulk it up). The finish and printing is admirable. It does indeed run very slowly, being heavily geared down. But it does not run as sweetly or quite as reliably as my Farish 04.

 

What it reminds me of is many a kitbuilt small locomotive on 4mm finescale layouts. It waddles a little. It runs slow, and it keeps going , but it waddles. Not quite a even movement. It's a decent locomotive and it will do a job of work on the layout. I'm not the "toys out of pram" type who returns things in a huff because they do not meet his exacting standards 100%... But it's not as sweet and smooth running as the 04.

 

And it will  be obvious from the photo just how short the wheel base is and just how long the switchblades and frog are on the adjacent point. Any hesitation in contact - they're dead. And the Hunslet will stop. 

 

Dare I blaze ahead with this project with electrically compromised "live frogs"?? Do I dare spend £145 on a Farish Class 14 in British Oak orange as an additional shunter??? Nobody has mentioned that one as an outstanding shunter. In 4mm I'd have not a shadow of a doubt that a modern RTR 0-6-0T would run shunt very happily over live frog points, smoothly, slowly, reliably all day. But in N??

 

Disposable income is a little tight at the moment. My savings may be ample - but I'm not necessarily prepared to dip into them to buy a loco that turns out not to be capable of the job required

 

I started the Chivers N gauge SSA kit. The Peco chassis used is wrong - leaf spring suspension not pedestal. In 4mm  that would be a show-stopper. But in N - nothing can be done.

 

Then I read this in the current NGS Journal:

Quote

... assembling an appropriate mix of stock for a modern image layout is no easy feat. This is particularly the case if you subscribe to the philosophy of a former Journal editor that "Everything that is placed on the layout must be to the same (high) standard." As this rules out the use of modified stock for all but the select few who possess the skills to bash and finish a model to the same standard as the products which our manufacturers are producing today

 

That's me told then - the Chivers SSA kit and the NGS chemical TTA kit I'm currently working on can never be good enough to sit alongside a Dapol or RevolutioN wagon with any credibility......  not unless my name's Tim Watson

 

I painted the main sprues in the TTA kit white - the suggestion in the instructions that they could be left as self-coloured plastic took me aback. Then the bag with the rest of the kit disappeared . Could I find it? I could not.

 

DSCN1603.jpg.62b36eb1a68979c430117cbee6a6dc07.jpg

 

The cars are some cheap plastic ones I managed to find in a model shop's box, which I'm trying to paint up and make passable. Modern cars are quite difficult to find in N . I've got boxes of the things in 4mm/HO needing a good home...

 

How many more points will fail at the tie bar, and how soon???

 

At this stage there seem a number of options:

 

- Press on and hope. Try to fix the tie bar and leave other pointwork as is.

- Replace the bust point . Maybe try to fit frog feed wires to one or two others.

- Rip up most of the points and trackwork , and replace them, fitting point feedwires to the replacements. This would mean major reconstruction and rewiring

- Pull the plug. Decide this project can't be made to work satisfactorily and get out of N. Dispose of the N gauge stock and bits for whatever I can recover before I sink more money time and effort into a quicksand  (I spent over £150 at Warley on a new loco, wagons and bits for this project)

 

Since two of the locos were given to me and have personal connections, I couldn't dispose of the lot. 

 

If I scrapped it , what would I do? 

 

- I think the plan could be done in TT120. There would be some loss of train length, but with mostly 4 wheel wagons it could be manageable. Width might be a more serious issue in a larger scale. 66s and an 08 are promised in TT:120, and in some respects the project might be better done in BR days , with a 37 and 47 as the main line power. But the 66 is 10-12 months away in TT, and I'd have to buy every single item from scratch. This was a project to use a core of existing stock....

 

- If we're talking about stuff I already have, that points towards either 3mm, (where I have a bag of wagon kits, some second hand Triang and half a dozen Peco points in stock), or OO9. But I have no serviceable 3mm loco, and no design. I have two OO9 Baldwins and some stock, but the design I came up with is 18" wide , not 11" , although I have more length than I drew out. 

 

- I suppose I could try to come up with an LCC tram scheme in 4mm

 

- Even Son of Boxfile in OO ????

 

Or I could box the whole lot up, and put away all N gauge modelling until at least September . When I would re-assess what is to be done about this , in a more cheerful frame of mind.  All my modelling time has been going into N recently - I haven't done any 4mm for about 9 month's let alone had Blacklade up. I know 4mm works, and even more importantly I know I can make it work , within reason. Time to do what will work, instead of plunging deeper into the swamps of N?

 

 

Edited by Ravenser
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On a more cheerful note: closer inspection has revealed that it is possible to get a frog feedwire onto the Vee of the frog of the points either side of the broken point.

 

This I've done, using some fine green wire stripped out of a bit of ribbon cable salvaged from an old computer. While it doesn't exactly improve the look of the points, it's no disaster and not much worse than any other feedwire.

 

I've now fitted and wired up a Peco polarity switch on the most distant point in the first picture. The point in front of the camera will follow - that's got a SEEP motor and I need to find the wiring diagram. 

 

The plan is now to cut out, lift and replace the broken point and to provide a buried frog feed on the replacement . That will mean the first 3 of the 4 points in the works siding fan will have proper frog wiring , and I should be able to shunt with a degree of confidence.

 

The three points on the left hand board are another matter: here a mixture of SEEP motors without switches and awkward locations may rule out retrofitting feed wires. But these points are somewhat less critical.

 

This should be sufficient of a fix to justify carrying on with the N gauge layout. I will keep the replacement tiebar I fabricated from PCB in reserve, in case any more points fail. Some of the other points could be got at for replacement in the event of a failure, but a further point failure that can't readily be resolved might well signal the end of the layout....

 

While I'm about it , I might as well finish my N gauge Bill of Complaint with the saga of the Farish 57. This was bought years ago in the local model shop's closing down sale. When I tried running it on this layout it derailed at every point. Further investigation revealed that something was fouling on the tiebar lugs on the points, and these had to be clipped away. (I'm trying to imagine a RTR Class 47 or 57 fouling on Peco Streamline points in OO: I think there'd be a firestorm about the issue. But this is N - people seem just to accept it without comment)  The loco then ran. 

 

But it doesn't have NEM pockets . I have a hazy recollection I might have been warned about that when I bought it, but now I've been driven into Dapol Easi-Shunts this is a serious problem. I don't know how to convert it for Easi-Shunts , so I can't use it....

Edited by Ravenser
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