ActiveDrive Sounds from Digitrains

[Digitrainer]

Apologies all for the lack of updating! Exhibition season has had us all on our toes for a while. But Tony Molyneux has been busy creating new Loksound sounds for some GWR locos. Here is our first sample of his new Collett goods in action. All new and genuine sounds were used in it's production. Our sound code is DS025 and can be loaded onto any new Loksound V4 decoder type from us (micro to XL) or reblown onto your own V4 chip.
 

 

I hope you all enjoy the video
 

Georgia 

[boxbrownie]

 

 

I've got new recordings of all the type 2 Sulzer engined classes, just need 48 hours in a day now to compile the sound projects.

 

 

I find not winding my watch up makes the days a lot longer.............try it...........we need those projects! 

[Digitrainer]

This video features a quick run featuring the MX649N direct fit decoder in a new Farish 66 we've taken straight off the shelf. Installation in this roomy little loco took just half an hour start to finish. ((Hopefully this caption is with the right video this time! Oops!   ))

 

 

Thanks for watching!

[Guest G567281]

Hi Alan,

 

Thanks for you interest.

 

Send me a PM, please.

 

Kind regards,

 

Paul

Hi Paul,

 

I appreciate all you do for us with regards to Zimo decoders. I am not sure if there has been any newsletters since August but having PM"d you I have not had any info or feedback as far as I am aware.

 

Kindest regards

 

Alan

[pauliebanger]

Hi Paul,

 

I appreciate all you do for us with regards to Zimo decoders. I am not sure if there has been any newsletters since August but having PM"d you I have not had any info or feedback as far as I am aware.

 

Kindest regards

 

Alan

 

Alan,

 

There have been no recent Newsletters, though I am planning one towards the end of this month. I can confirm that you are on my newsletter email list, so you will receive it as soon as it is published.

 

Kind regards,

 

Paull

[Guest G567281]

Alan,

 

There have been no recent Newsletters, though I am planning one towards the end of this month. I can confirm that you are on my newsletter email list, so you will receive it as soon as it is published.

 

Kind regards,

 

Paull

Wonderful, many thanks.

 

I am looking forward to your Terrier article in HM this coming Thursday.

 

Kindest regards

 

Alan

[leopardml2341]

Alan,

 

There have been no recent Newsletters, though I am planning one towards the end of this month. I can confirm that you are on my newsletter email list, so you will receive it as soon as it is published.

 

Kind regards,

 

Paull

Am I on your list too?

 

ps, my name is not 'Pike'

[Mark Forrest]

I've recently installed an ActiveDrive decoder in a pair of class 20s which we run on Black Country Blues. Takes a little getting used to the stopping distances but overall I'm very impressed, really does add to the realism of driving.

Only thing I find a little odd is that up to about half way up the speed steps the engine noise increases but the loco doesn't move off. Above half throttle it accelerates smoothly, but can be a bit rapid.

Is that how it should behave or is it worth tweaking a few settings?

[pauliebanger]

Am I on your list too?

 

ps, my name is not 'Pike'

 

Yes you are, Corporal Jones, don't panic, don't panic.

 

Paul

[pauliebanger]

I've recently installed an ActiveDrive decoder in a pair of class 20s which we run on Black Country Blues. Takes a little getting used to the stopping distances but overall I'm very impressed, really does add to the realism of driving.

Only thing I find a little odd is that up to about half way up the speed steps the engine noise increases but the loco doesn't move off. Above half throttle it accelerates smoothly, but can be a bit rapid.

Is that how it should behave or is it worth tweaking a few settings?

 

Mark,

 

Thank you.

 

Please have a look at my suggestions below before changing any parameters. The settings have been carefully selected to produce optimum results, but the ActiveDrive package brings a whole load of new features to the table which need some explanation to fully understand their significant advance on anything which has gone before. 

 

 

Stopping distances should be reasonable, especially if you hold the Brake Key down. This gives emergency braking (like a real loco, not the 'STOP' button on your controller).

 

You can also get a more rapid response still if you use F5 before braking.

 

Zimo decoders do not require large amounts of inertia to initiate sound changes, so you will not have to 'whack the throttle open' to get the sounds to progress as is common with other brands. If you are used to decoders or projects which require that techique to get the sounds progressing, then you might find thatyou are applying too much power too quickly. That could produce the effects you are experiencing.

 

There is also a short 'Start Delay' built in to allow the straight brake release sound to finish before movement.

 

Assuming that this are no other factors in play(eg. interaction between the two motors if indeed both locos are powered), it may simply require a slightly different driving technique, perhaps more closely resembling how a real loco would be driven.

 

If you open the throttle up to somewhere in the range 10-15 speed steps (out of 128), the engine sound should increase in power and after the start delay is completed, the loco will move off slowly. There is a reasonable amount of inertia set in CV3, but this is to simulate a heavy train, not to create sound change. (Try temporarily setting CV3  = 0 and you will see what I mean).

 

Depending on how quickly you open the throttle, will depend on how hard the engine works, even if to these low speed step numbers, though the effect will be greater and of longer duration at higher SSs.

 

A quick flick to 15 will cause a rise in engine power which will drop back when road speed stops increasing (end of acceleration), whereas slowly 'rolling on the speed steps' to 15 will just move the engine into the first power band at which it will remain until fresh instructions are received.

 

Although the throttle control can be used to produce a typical linear progression easily used straight from the box, there are some different effects available with subtle variations of 'throttle action' which will give greater control over both the sound and the acceleraton rate.

 

For example, ActiveDrive comes with 'Ballistic Inertia' as a standard feature. I said earlier that ZIMO decoders do not rely on large values of inertia (and momentum) to affect sound changes, and that is correct. But the way the throttle is opened can be used to effect other changes. If the throttle is opened fully in a single quick movement, (and reduced immediately to a lower speed if desired) the inertia set in CV3 is automatically reduced to 1/3 of its normal setting. Thus the loco will accelerate 3 times more quickly than if the throttle is gradually opened to the same final speed step value.

 

This means that it is possible to dynamically adjust the inertia in real time by the way the throttle is used. No other decoder does this.

 

It may take a little practice, but once mastered ActiveDrive brings a new dimension to model train 'Driving'.

 

And that's just the throttle control. 

 

Check out the cool features on F5, F6 and F7 and the absolute control over engine sounds that individually or in combinations they can put under you finger tips.

 

F5 (Light Engine Mode) alters the sound change thresholds, reduces inertia and momentum automatically to suit a light loco so that it will accelerate and decelerate more rapidly (as a real one would) and other changes depending upon the loco type.

 

F6 can be used to 'hold' the engine sound in idle, irrespective of the throttle position. Great for pottering about the yard when you don't want increased engin sounds. Also forces the sound to spool down to idle if already moving for the most controllable coasting effect around.

 

F7 This will increase the engine power sound to maximum, even at standing. So you can put your loco on a 'Load Bank' for testing or just give maximum power to lift a heavy train, or to boost exsiting powerat any time without touching the throttle. (If not already at max). This works seamlessly and is fully integrated with normal throttle change operation.

 

Let us know how you get on, please.

 

Kind regards,

 

Paul

[Mark Forrest]

Thanks for taking the time to give such a detailed and comprehensive reply Paul. It does sound as though what I'm seeing the 20s do could be a combination of driver impatience and a tendency to whack the throttle open (only one is powered, the other is just a speaker on wheels). I'll have a play later to see how I get on. I'm always reluctant to start messing with CVs on sound decoders knowing that whoever has set them up has spent a lot of time optimising the settings!

[ChrisB]

Thanks for taking the time to give such a detailed and comprehensive reply Paul. It does sound as though what I'm seeing the 20s do could be a combination of driver impatience and a tendency to whack the throttle open (only one is powered, the other is just a speaker on wheels). I'll have a play later to see how I get on. I'm always reluctant to start messing with CVs on sound decoders knowing that whoever has set them up has spent a lot of time optimising the settings!

Not wishing to hijack the thread but my current layout is twice the length of the old one and all my sound equipped locos needed tweaking. Yes, a lot of time. thought and effort goes into the original settings but only you can tailor them to your own layout and your operating preferences. Also, the same chip in a Heljan 47 (for example) may not suit a Vitrains 47 but you have to buy the same chip for both. So........don't feel bad. Experiment till your heart's content.

[pauliebanger]

Not wishing to hijack the thread but my current layout is twice the length of the old one and all my sound equipped locos needed tweaking. Yes, a lot of time. thought and effort goes into the original settings but only you can tailor them to your own layout and your operating preferences. Also, the same chip in a Heljan 47 (for example) may not suit a Vitrains 47 but you have to buy the same chip for both. So........don't feel bad. Experiment till your heart's content.

 

Could you give an example of a tweak you made and what it was designed to achieve, please? I am not challenging what you say, and with some decoder/project combinations I can appreciate exactly what you mean.

 

I would, however, be interested to compare this with what can be done within an unchanged ActiveDrive project.

 

The whole point of ActiveDrive for ZIMO decoders is to avoid the need to change the settings whilst continuing to work correctly on any layout, be it short or long, flat or with inclines, roundy roundy or end to end as the various controls allow you to change the way that movement and sounds interact, enabling the operator to simulate any eventuality, at will and independently of layout parameters.

 

There is, of course, no bar to to experimentation. Goodness knows there are plenty of CVs to play with. I feel that getting to know thoroughly what you already have is a logical basis for experimentation. No doubt you had a thorough grasp of the capabilities your decoder and locomotives on which to base your tweaks.  

 

 

Your statement that only one decoder project is available whatever the model manufacturer is just not correct. There are several variations available for a growing number of 'popular' classes, 5 or 6 different class 37s and several others recorded awaiting project completion, 3 or 4 Class 47s, 3 class 20s including an 'A' and 'B' unit for operating as a coupled pair, with different engine sounds and different horns and of course programmed to run in opposite directions. 

 

Where there are significant performance characteristic variations between models of similar classes from different manufacturers, or different features (eg, cab lights standard or not), there is already or will be as these projects are rolled out, specific projects for individual manufacturers. The Class 47 is a good example where a version each for ViTrains and Bachmann are available. Not yet been asked for 00 Heljan 47, but there is a specific version for the Heljan 0 Gauge 47.

 

These custom sound projects are not the same as the sort of thing often included in R-T-R sound fitted locos.

 

Kind regards,

 

Paul.

[coachmann]

I am so chuffed with the Digitrains 'Hall' sound file on the Zimo. It's in a 'Grange' and when shunting, the loco can be 'driven' to sound like the real thing with a few loud puffs to set it going followed by coasting with steam off to the other side of the points. I throw the LH90 switch into reverse without cutting off power and the loco draws slowly to a halt with brakes squeal right at the last minute, then as power overcomes inertia the loco slowly starts to move back. It is close to resembling the way we moved real locos on shed, although I don't think I will go into details on that !

 

I have standardized on that same sound file for a 38XX 2-8-0 and a Dukedog 4-4-0. Why a Dukedog? Well I listened to the real one on Youtube first, but the dedicated sound chip sample did not do it for me. The City of Truro sound was slightly deeper but I decided to play safe and stick with the chip I know. Some locos do have a characteristic exhaust and other things such as clanking rods even when under steam. But all of today cine-to-video programs have dubbed-on sound and goodness knows what producers have used, when at its worst it gives us 3-cylinder B1's and 2-cylinder 'Jubilee's' ha ha. I've found something that suits and I'm sticking with it, but experimentation will start again when it comes to sound chipping my few LMS locos.

[ChrisB]

Could you give an example of a tweak you made and what it was designed to achieve, please? I am not challenging what you say, and with some decoder/project combinations I can appreciate exactly what you mean.

 

I would, however, be interested to compare this with what can be done within an unchanged ActiveDrive project.

 

The whole point of ActiveDrive for ZIMO decoders is to avoid the need to change the settings whilst continuing to work correctly on any layout, be it short or long, flat or with inclines, roundy roundy or end to end as the various controls allow you to change the way that movement and sounds interact, enabling the operator to simulate any eventuality, at will and independently of layout parameters.

 

There is, of course, no bar to to experimentation. Goodness knows there are plenty of CVs to play with. I feel that getting to know thoroughly what you already have is a logical basis for experimentation. No doubt you had a thorough grasp of the capabilities your decoder and locomotives on which to base your tweaks.  

 

 

Your statement that only one decoder project is available whatever the model manufacturer is just not correct. There are several variations available for a growing number of 'popular' classes, 5 or 6 different class 37s and several others recorded awaiting project completion, 3 or 4 Class 47s, 3 class 20s including an 'A' and 'B' unit for operating as a coupled pair, with different engine sounds and different horns and of course programmed to run in opposite directions. 

 

Where there are significant performance characteristic variations between models of similar classes from different manufacturers, or different features (eg, cab lights standard or not), there is already or will be as these projects are rolled out, specific projects for individual manufacturers. The Class 47 is a good example where a version each for ViTrains and Bachmann are available. Not yet been asked for 00 Heljan 47, but there is a specific version for the Heljan 0 Gauge 47.

 

These custom sound projects are not the same as the sort of thing often included in R-T-R sound fitted locos.

 

Kind regards,

 

Paul.

 

Hi Paul

 

The first thing I've done with most Loksound chips is reduce CVs 5 and 6. With a lot of available sound projects, some of the sounds aren't accessible unless your train is doing what sometimes appears to be a scale 200mph ! 

I use an NCE Powercab and, whilst I just used to use the momentum button, it's always been a bit crude and, since reading what you have had to say on the subject, I tend to alter CVs 3 and 4 to tailor the acceleration and deceleration rates so that trains don't take off like a rabbit and then stop on a sixpence. My old layout had a 6ft scenic area and the newer one is double that.Broadly,what I've ended up doing is raising CVs 5 and 6 a smidgeon because I don't want to cram all that "action" , however unrealistic, into such a small space.

 

Regarding the 47 chips, perhaps I wasn't very clear. I am aware of most of the different types available. I used these two examples because they both have an 8 pin socket and someone with one of each could conceivably and quite naturally order two identical sound chips only to find that their performance is not identical (but probably similar). 

 

I've only recently (ish) acquired my first Zimo chips with your Multi drive projects and have been very impressed. More recently, I have bought one of your class 50 projects and am even more impressed. When ordering this from Digitrains, I asked if this was a Multidrive and was quite surprised to be told that this was now effectively obsolete. As I said though, I am more than happy with it and will be ordering some more.

 

I have been following your latest developments with interest and, on the face of it. your new projects would seem to deal nearly all of the issues I've had over the years. I have found that, depending on my mood, I use the different "driving modes" on the Multidrive chips at different times but this invariably involves a search to find that data sheet to find which CVs to change, Your new projects would seem to make all of this available much more easily and, together with the braking, represent a significant step forward. Can I get the new projects put on to my existing Zimo Multidrive chips?

 

Like many modellers I suspect, I tend to be a bit of a meddler. With sound chips, it has sometimes been in order to achieve a specific goal but also just to gain a better understanding of what's going on and what effect certain changes have. I don't presume to know better and have been down plenty of blind alleys. If I change a CV and don't get an improvement, I can always change it back again.

[pauliebanger]

Hi Paul

 

The first thing I've done with most Loksound chips is reduce CVs 5 and 6. With a lot of available sound projects, some of the sounds aren't accessible unless your train is doing what sometimes appears to be a scale 200mph ! 

 

Yes, I undertand that. To be fair to some aftermarket ESU sound providers, Legomanbiffo for example, their custom projects would be better set up than these strictly linear projects.

With ActiveDrive, it is possible to have any engine sound sample in the decoder's memory playing at any road speed. No need to tinker to get this effect, just use the controls provided. I'm not fixated with getting everything on the throttle control, that's not how it is in real locos, only models are typically driven with a single 'knob'. Most people who give feedback on the sound control in my projects highlight the ease and certainty of getting the desired result when there is an F key set up to do it.

 

I use an NCE Powercab and, whilst I just used to use the momentum button, it's always been a bit crude and, since reading what you have had to say on the subject, I tend to alter CVs 3 and 4 to tailor the acceleration and deceleration rates so that trains don't take off like a rabbit and then stop on a sixpence. My old layout had a 6ft scenic area and the newer one is double that.Broadly,what I've ended up doing is raising CVs 5 and 6 a smidgeon because I don't want to cram all that "action" , however unrealistic, into such a small space.

 

Values in CV3 and 4 are much higher in ActiveDrive projects as the default state is 'Heavy Train' mode. F5 gives 'Light Engine' mode which automatically reduces CV3 and CV4 values temporarily so no need for the 'insideous' NCE Momentum button with these projects. (Glad you took notice of my dire warnings, Lol. Ironically, since a ZIMO sound project does not need high inertia to get the sounds going, the NCE momentum key had little adverse affect on ZIMO decoders).

 

Regarding the 47 chips, perhaps I wasn't very clear. I am aware of most of the different types available. I used these two examples because they both have an 8 pin socket and someone with one of each could conceivably and quite naturally order two identical sound chips only to find that their performance is not identical (but probably similar). 

 

OK, but I wasn't refering to different interfaces.

 

I've only recently (ish) acquired my first Zimo chips with your Multi drive projects and have been very impressed. More recently, I have bought one of your class 50 projects and am even more impressed. When ordering this from Digitrains, I asked if this was a Multidrive and was quite surprised to be told that this was now effectively obsolete. As I said though, I am more than happy with it and will be ordering some more.

 

The Multi-Drive projects are still available and updated from time to time to add any new ZIMO features which will be useful. But thy are a different approach which I took to get better responses from the old software whilst I tried (somewhat successfully) to gradually persuade ZIMO to improve the software to achieve what I thought was needed for UK diesels.

 

I have been following your latest developments with interest and, on the face of it. your new projects would seem to deal nearly all of the issues I've had over the years. I have found that, depending on my mood, I use the different "driving modes" on the Multidrive chips at different times but this invariably involves a search to find that data sheet to find which CVs to change, Your new projects would seem to make all of this available much more easily and, together with the braking, represent a significant step forward.

 

You're right, that's what I've been aiming for. The Multi-Drive experience without the drawbacks eg having to switch to different sound sets with a CV change. The idea is that all is available with a touch of an F key.

I'm really pleased with the Brake Key. It's been a top priority for me for several years as it allows high momentum for 'real feel' whilst still allowing the model to be controllable. After all, real locos have brakes (well, most anyway).

I had the first working Brake Key in development software from ZIMO in July 2014,.The Brake Key made its first public appearance in RAIL EXCLUSIVE's Northern Belle Class 47s about this time last year.

I noticed that ESU have let it be known in the last day or so that they have decided to develop a brake function for Loksound. Good for them; I wonder where they got the idea?

 

Like many modellers I suspect, I tend to be a bit of a meddler. With sound chips, it has sometimes been in order to achieve a specific goal but also just to gain a better understanding of what's going on and what effect certain changes have. I don't presume to know better and have been down plenty of blind alleys. If I change a CV and don't get an improvement, I can always change it back again.

 

Nowt wrong with meddling if there's a purpose. As you say, it can always be reversed (or re-set).

 

 

Can I get the new projects put on to my existing Zimo Multidrive chips?

 

Yes, PM me, please.

 

 

[pauliebanger]

I am so chuffed with the Digitrains 'Hall' sound file on the Zimo. It's in a 'Grange' and when shunting, the loco can be 'driven' to sound like the real thing with a few loud puffs to set it going followed by coasting with steam off to the other side of the points. I throw the LH90 switch into reverse without cutting off power and the loco draws slowly to a halt with brakes squeal right at the last minute, then as power overcomes inertia the loco slowly starts to move back. It is close to resembling the way we moved real locos on shed, although I don't think I will go into details on that !

 

I have standardized on that same sound file for a 38XX 2-8-0 and a Dukedog 4-4-0. Why a Dukedog? Well I listened to the real one on Youtube first, but the dedicated sound chip sample did not do it for me. The City of Truro sound was slightly deeper but I decided to play safe and stick with the chip I know. Some locos do have a characteristic exhaust and other things such as clanking rods even when under steam. But all of today cine-to-video programs have dubbed-on sound and goodness knows what producers have used, when at its worst it gives us 3-cylinder B1's and 2-cylinder 'Jubilee's' ha ha. I've found something that suits and I'm sticking with it, but experimentation will start again when it comes to sound chipping my few LMS locos.

 

Many of the features I've described for diesel projects, including the Brake Key, Heavy and Light modes, automatically adjusted inertia and momentum, are also available in my ZIMO ActiveDrive Steam sound projects from Digitrains.

 

The first one of these was for the Beyer-Garratt, released early January this year. (Though it was not labelled as ActiveDrive at that time).

 

Since you mention brake squeal, with ActiveDrive projects, if you do not use the Brake Key there will be no squeal sound. Reason? If the brakes aren't applied, how can they squeal?

 

Kind regards,

 

Paul

[Nigelcliffe]

I noticed that ESU have let it be known in the last day or so that they have decided to develop a brake function for Loksound. Good for them; I wonder where they got the idea?

Probably Soundtraxx :-).   A brake key has been a feature of the Soundtraxx range for as long as I can remember.

 

- Nigel

[clickertyclack]

I noticed that ESU have let it be known in the last day or so that they have decided to develop a brake function for Loksound. Good for them; I wonder where they got the idea?

 

Mr Soundguy! He first demonstrated this idea in Jan of this year I believe prior to that of Zimo. LOL!!  LOL!!!

CC

[Shropshire Lad]

I noticed that ESU have let it be known in the last day or so that they have decided to develop a brake function for Loksound. Good for them; I wonder where they got the idea?

 

Mr Soundguy! He first demonstrated this idea in Jan of this year I believe prior to that of Zimo. LOL!!  LOL!!!

CC

The first Zimo sound project with a brake button was delivered to customers in December last year, which unless I'm missing something was before January this year!

[rushdenx1]

I have a Class 37 fitted with Digitrainsound Multi-Drive Version 2.0.  Is there a Class 37 ActiveDrive version available? Thanks Kevin.

[wiggy1]

I've had Mr Soundguy's 'RealDrive' as he calls it for over 2 years.

Here is a link to a video I posted last November.

I'm assuming its the same thing as it is on Zimo.

Shows you how to drive it or how I drive it.            

 

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/92738-irish-class-201-sound-by-mr-soundguys-realdrive-system/

[Torper]

Paul, as far as I can see, Digitrains currently offer six ActiveDrive sound files - Southern 2-cylinder steam, and diesels 08, 20, 26, 47 and Hymek.  Are there any more than that available from yourself?

 

DT

[MR PJ]

I have a Class 37 fitted with Digitrainsound Multi-Drive Version 2.0.  Is there a Class 37 ActiveDrive version available? Thanks Kevin.

 

A 37 active-drive would be nice - although I always wondered if they needed brakes as they are all noise and no movement - i.e. all that sound energy doesn't get converted into traction!

I would have thought that Paul Chetter has this on his radar, along with a million and one other projects!

Regards,

Paul

[pauliebanger]

Probably Soundtraxx :-).   A brake key has been a feature of the Soundtraxx range for as long as I can remember.

 

- Nigel

 

Nigel,

 

That's correct. But that probably rules it out as the driver for ESU deciding now, doesn't it?

 

No, I think it must be a more recent development.

 

Knd regards,

 

Paul