treggyman Posted June 7, 2018 Share Posted June 7, 2018 Hi Good idea regarding the wheelsets on Co-Co loco's...... I've certainly had issues with the wheels pivoting on the centre axle......(My poor tracklaying) I can see where you're coming from regarding the CDA's..... I thought it was just me.... The other problemI feel with the CDA's seems to be the wheel flanges are too 'sharp' ie pointed..... This seems to enable them to find the slightest gap between the stock rail & switch rail...... Filing the flange helped a bit as did rewheeling but continually readjusting the point seemed to be the only solution that worked...... I shall follow your progress with interest. Cheers Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted June 7, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted June 7, 2018 Hi Good idea regarding the wheelsets on Co-Co loco's...... I've certainly had issues with the wheels pivoting on the centre axle......(My poor tracklaying) I can see where you're coming from regarding the CDA's..... I thought it was just me.... The other problemI feel with the CDA's seems to be the wheel flanges are too 'sharp' ie pointed..... This seems to enable them to find the slightest gap between the stock rail & switch rail...... Filing the flange helped a bit as did rewheeling but continually readjusting the point seemed to be the only solution that worked...... I shall follow your progress with interest. Cheers Bill I will keep an eye on those flanges, I have reused a lot of the OO CDA wheels in 1940s GW coaches which are running on hand built OO track My CDAs never ran on my last layout, partly because of how bad the roofs looked but mostly because I couldnt get them to run. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted June 8, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted June 8, 2018 (edited) After picking up more filler during the week, I have now applied two more coats to the track. The end effect is starting to come together, although there is still two more areas which need to be completed before I can get on with painting. The first is a simple fill of the gaps either side of the track for one section, this cant be completed until the glue holding the black foam in place has dried. The other area needing attention is around the switching mechanism of the left hand point. The key thing here is to avoid clogging up the tie bar, in order to achieve this I have used two sections of 10 thou plasticard either side of the track which will be covered with filler once dry. for the infill between the rails I have cut a plasticard former which will be glued into position (and then blended into the filler either side). I have also been doing some more testing with CDAs, I have found the one good wagon and it was fine on the lower two lines. The top line however (ie the most important given its the actual loading line), it would constantly derail. Careful work with knife and file has cleared it up and it will now run into and out of the dries. Edited June 8, 2018 by The Fatadder 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted June 10, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted June 10, 2018 Another day and yet more filler added to the concrete track, this is taking forever to get a decent finish, not helped by being restricted as to when I can do ‘noisy’ work on the layout. Unfortunately the noise from sanding seems to wake the 20 month old in the next room. Hopefully will get another coat on this evening... I have also glued together the core of the bridge, so this is now ready to start cladding in plasticard. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mark Forrest Posted June 10, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 10, 2018 Are the CDAs rigid or sprung? Do they have a pivoting axleguard assembly? Keep going with the filler, it'll be worth it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted June 10, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted June 10, 2018 Are the CDAs rigid or sprung? Do they have a pivoting axleguard assembly? Keep going with the filler, it'll be worth it. They are a completely rigid chassis (so no pivoting axle guards). To compound it Hornby incorrectly spaced them so they are too close together for scale wheels. Milling off a few thou from each side gets the maygib wheels in, but they still are temperamental runners. To fit black beetle wheels even more material would have to be removed... To compound things there is a fictional box along the chassis centreline which means getting a truck turner in there to drill out the axles is too tight. I am currently looking at springing options... It shouldn’t be needed (a TTA for example is similar wheelbase and runs perfectly) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mark Forrest Posted June 10, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 10, 2018 I am currently looking at springing options... It shouldn’t be needed (a TTA for example is similar wheelbase and runs perfectly) I'd agree, shouldn't be necessary, I have TTAs and HEAs that don't need it, but tend to think that once your into the realms of removing material from the rear of axle guards and drilling into axle boxes then it's the time to think about springing as you run the risk of things not being as square afterwards as they were when you started. Funnily enough, the last two HEAs I bought seem to have a bit of a wobble and run a bit three-legged so had been thinking I might need to try spring them. Think the chassis has pulled slightly twisted when being fixed to the hopper body. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted June 10, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted June 10, 2018 The other annoyance with the HAA/CDA is the fictional box for the weight, without which replacement with etched w irons would be easy if someone made the springs (which they don’t). But is that because it’s so difficult to fit etched W irons.... In the past I have resorted to Bill Bedford units under Bachmann TTA as it was quicker to chop off and replace than it was to carve off the incorrect springs and replace. I have been shown a way forward which I am looking into, so will see how that goes. Else it’s a case of needing to cast or 3D print a new set of springs and do some major surgery. As I really want to get them working on black beetle wheels (more forgiving), it may end up the only viable option. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted June 11, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted June 11, 2018 (edited) I did get another coat of filler applied last night, but it still has a number of areas which are looking a bit rough so there are still a few more applications needed until I get to a finish that I am happy with. One thing that is changing is the plan for just how much of the scene will be covered with concrete, and where the overgrown scrub will start, with the latter progressing closer to the works. I am planning to add a low wall between the slurry siding and the river retaining wall (3 foot or so from the track), other than a path to the loader the rest of the area between yard and river will be very over grown. Once again I have been testing sight lines and operational moves, hence the amount of stock present. It would certainly be very implausible for there to be two Class 37s in the yard at the same time, so this must have been a very urgent need by a key customer for a couple of extra tanks of slurry! The 153 is ideal for a bit of structure clearance testing on the Newquay branch. The main reason for which was to test fit an old Woodland Scenic's tree frame which will be used over hanging part of the track at the left hand exit to hide the hole. It will need a little more tweaking once covered with foliage and finally glued in place. Edited June 11, 2018 by The Fatadder 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted June 11, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted June 11, 2018 (edited) No chance to sand the filler down tonight, but another coat has been applied. I have also cut and test fitted the final infil section covering the point mechanism. (An under board tiebar would have been very sensible here! It’s clear that at least one more coat of filler is needed. Edited June 11, 2018 by The Fatadder Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted June 12, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted June 12, 2018 The photo of the Peak shows up an issue with the original design of the layout, the track in front of the switch is too short to take a Peak (it will “just” fit a 50 but that is because the outer wheel is further inboard on a 50 so the headstock is overhanging the switch). The solution was simple, cutting a hole into the backscene on the left hand side (which in turn is hidden by the covered loading area). One the fiddle yard is added this will give an additional 2ft of length to the works sidings allowing a loco to over run off scene to get sufficient clearance for the switch (as the Peak has in last nights photo). It also allows for a longer rake of wagons to be loaded (with wagons disappearing through off scene) As I have mentioned previously my planning is that the layout could eventually be expanded in the future. The initial plan was that you could add 4ft or so to the right hand side (adding the point work connecting the works to the Newquay branch). However I am now thinking about an option to expand to the other direction, extending the works and potentially adding another crossover allowing a full run-around on scene and increasing capacity to load 10+ CDA (thus significantly increasing the realism.) Another addition which could be incorporated would be a cleaning plant for the slurry wagons… While this is a long term ambition (and may never happen), I do think it helps to understand what is happening off scene in order to get what is on scene to look right. Getting back to today it all links in with the left hand side of the dries, as mentioned previously there is a poor fit between the backscene and the dries. The rear extent of which will be fixed by adding the flashing to the top of the roof. This still leaves a triangular gap against the backscene on the left hand side. My intention is to add the first side of the next building, here I return to the Ponts Mill concept with a change in building height and style. The next building will be more modern in construction (ribbed sheet), and about 3 inchs taller than the dries. It will come in two parts, a triangle roughly 10mm in max width, 6 inches in height and the same depth as the existing dries). A second part circa 3 – 6 inches in width will continue the front into the fiddleyard (an idea shamelessly pinched from Mark Forrest’s Fryers Lane), which should help mask the hole in the wall. There is unlikely to be much progress on this until the bridge is built and the concrete inlayed track is finally finished, as I need to have the dries glued into place before measuring the gap I need to fill… 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted June 13, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted June 13, 2018 After another coat of filler and a good sanding the concrete inset track is nearing completion, so this evening's main task was to cover the whole lot in a coat of white paint. For this I have used a tin of Phoenix NSE white (because it was a) to hand and b) looking in a poor state with a thick dried layer on top so I was unlikely to use for spraying.) The first aim of this was to blend in the under side of the rail, partially to avoid rust and partly to blend in the black foam underlay with the white weathered concrete. I decided to continue this white coat across the whole area to help show up areas still needing attention. The majority of the defects remaining are going to stay in place and be incorporated into the weathering. I am to manage this in 3 ways, areas where weeds/grass is growing through, areas with darkened earth for damaged concrete, and finally applying some gloss varnish to form puddles. 13/6/18 by The Fatadder, on Flickr The layout is set in early October, and while it is intended to be a dry day (so the majority of the ground cover is dry) there must have been heavy rain fairly recently to explain the high water level in the river. Why early October? I need to use the same materials for both this and Brent, for Brent I have a Modified Hall with Hawksworth tender which wasn't built until October 1947, which in turn sets the minimum date.... Other work has continued on the easier bits for the road bridge, having now made up a new pair of Wills Varigurders ready to install. I have also installed the underside from the Blackcombe Torr road bridge to add the support beams under the road bed. Later this week the plan will be to get on with adding the first layer of plastic to the outer edge of the bridge, a job that is somewhat delayed due to a lack of glue that is suitable to use on the foam board... 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
treggyman Posted June 14, 2018 Share Posted June 14, 2018 Hi I like the look of your slurry loader..... Any chance of front/side views...... The reason I ask is that I'm building a couple of slurry tanks as a view blocker to the entrance to my traverser fiddle yard.... To hide the gap I was going to put in an office type building but your loader would probably be more appropriate..... Is it based on the one at Burngullow as the previous ones I've built have been of the one at Par Docks & although I've seen a pic or two of the Burngullow one I can't find them at the moment........ Really enjoying your progress & finding your description of how you've done things very useful as a comparison to how I do things....... Cheers Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted June 14, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted June 14, 2018 Hi I like the look of your slurry loader..... Any chance of front/side views...... The reason I ask is that I'm building a couple of slurry tanks as a view blocker to the entrance to my traverser fiddle yard.... To hide the gap I was going to put in an office type building but your loader would probably be more appropriate..... Is it based on the one at Burngullow as the previous ones I've built have been of the one at Par Docks & although I've seen a pic or two of the Burngullow one I can't find them at the moment........ Really enjoying your progress & finding your description of how you've done things very useful as a comparison to how I do things....... Cheers Bill Yes it is based upon the original loader at Burngullow, although I have modified it somewhat to modernise the structure (mostly work around enclosing the lower half and adding a more modern walkway). I will try and get a few more photos this evening. in the mean time, there are a few photos on Flickr (including this collection) https://www.flickr.com/photos/59432339@N03/14368437301/in/photostream/ and another on rmweb http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/56771-silos-and-slurry-loaders-at-clay-works/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
treggyman Posted June 14, 2018 Share Posted June 14, 2018 Hi Thanks for that...... I'd not seen the Flicker pics before but the first two on the second link are the ones I took.... DOH.... The Par Dock ones I can find but not the fleeting view of the Burngullow loader...... There were more I think...... At least I now know roughly where to look in my disorganised photo filing system........ But pics of your structure would be welcome as it's not quite the same & is probably more what I'm after modelling...... Thanks for the reply.... Cheers Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted June 14, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted June 14, 2018 Here’s a couple more photos of my attempt (Weathering is still in progress and the ladder still needs finishing, as does the loading platform walkways). A repair is also needed to the roof 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
treggyman Posted June 14, 2018 Share Posted June 14, 2018 Hi Thanks for the pics....... Very useful....... I've just been searching for my original picture of the one at Burngullow...... Can't find it anywhere so must have accidentally deleted it.... The beauty of posting on RMweb...... At least it's not lost !!!!!! Cheers Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted June 14, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted June 14, 2018 (edited) One more photo for the evening, not a lot to show progress wise as I have spent what little time I had working on track defects (thanks to the imbecile who was trespassing on the GWML between Didcot and Swindon causing me to miss my connection home!) I am having point issues with the concrete infill / paint causing an obstruction on the left hand point. The answer is probably to beef up the wire grade (as it just uses the standard tortoise wire) The problem is getting hold of some without paying ott for postage. I miss the old (reliable) C&L! I have also been testing more stock, in particular the clay hoods. I have lots of them, most of which will stay in the stock box as a “may be useful some day). I do keep thinking about backdating a bunch to the original GwR diagram... The 12 good ones are already P4 and have scale couplings, the roofs were converted by Darren Sherwood in an old Model Rail. They need some remedial work, fixing a couple of roofs and sorting out some stuff wheelsets. Add in a VAA awaiting loading, and a couple of STS slurry TTAs (that still need walkways) and you have a good picture of the early 80s running. There is a part of me that wants to sell off all the 80s stock and focus on two periods: 1947 steam and 1998’diesel, it’s views like this that make me want to continue to have some 1980s stock Edited June 14, 2018 by The Fatadder 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium St Enodoc Posted June 14, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 14, 2018 I am having point issues with the concrete infill / paint causing an obstruction on the left hand point. The answer is probably to beef up the wire grade (as it just uses the standard tortoise wire) The problem is getting hold of some without paying ott for postage. I miss the old (reliable) C&L! Rich, standard Tortoise wire (0.6 mm diameter) is definitely too thin. Try 0.8 mm (1/32") which you should be able to get at most model shops. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted June 15, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted June 15, 2018 What's a model shop? Not had one of those in a few years, when C&L shut up shop that was the last source of bits and pieces close to me... I will have a look on eBay later today and see what I can find, I have used 0.8 and 1mm wire on Brent (the latter purely because a bunch of second hand Tortoise were already fitted with 1mm wire). It certainly works a lot better, although a fair few of the fiddleyard points on Brent have the standard 0.6mm wire and work fine. Hopefully replacing the wire to get a bit more strength in the pin will sort it out... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Siberian Snooper Posted June 15, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 15, 2018 What's a model shop? Not had one of those in a few years, when C&L shut up shop that was the last source of bits and pieces close to me... I will have a look on eBay later today and see what I can find, I have used 0.8 and 1mm wire on Brent (the latter purely because a bunch of second hand Tortoise were already fitted with 1mm wire). It certainly works a lot better, although a fair few of the fiddleyard points on Brent have the standard 0.6mm wire and work fine. Hopefully replacing the wire to get a bit more strength in the pin will sort it out... Can you not, swap one of the Tortoise motors on Brent that has a larger wire, with a standard Tortoise from Wheel Imogen? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted June 15, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted June 15, 2018 Can you not, swap one of the Tortoise motors on Brent that has a larger wire, with a standard Tortoise from Wheel Imogen? I could, but that just transfers the problem from one layout to the other. Most (all) of the points on Brent needed the thicker rod to work reliably. I think I have found a suitable grade of rod on Eileen's website, so I think I will get some ordered... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mark Forrest Posted June 15, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 15, 2018 Stiffer wire is readily available on eBay, search for piano wire. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted June 23, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted June 23, 2018 (edited) I have been experimenting with the backscene, the intention (shamelessly pinched from Fryers Lane) is to have the backscene painted in a solid colour. Trying to get something which looks like a drizzley Cornish day. I think there is a little too much pink, I will let it dry and see how it comes out. At the very least it’s nice to see something other than plywood Really I think I need to get the lighting rig built and give it a test with it’s own lighting rather than the rooms lights. Edited June 23, 2018 by The Fatadder 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted July 13, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted July 13, 2018 Tonight I finally got round to doing some more work on Wheal Imogen. The first task was to sort out the backscene as i wasn't happy with the pinkish colour. The replacement used a mixture of white emulsion and blue children's paint roughly mixed. As I was repainting I aimed for a mixture of colour with hints of the original, white and blue. Again the photo doesn't really do it justice (I really need to improve the lighting in that room). I will try and retake the photo tomorrow in daylight... The next job was the pouring the river on both Brent and Wheal Imogen, unfortunately it hasn't gone fully to plan. While on Brent I was little short on volume to properly fill the river, on Wheal Imogen it was more the opposite problem. The plan was always to only pour a very thin (circa 1mm) layer of the water. I had expected the water to be quite a dark tint, and to be fair on Brent it is, however as a thin coat it is not that dense a pigment. As a result you can see the poorly painted base coat (especially the area by the backscene). Even worse somehow it has ended up on the wall, its not visible to the eye but shows up shiny on photos. I have a plan though, adding reeds along either side and some algae, just need to find some suitable photos to work from (and more importantly for the algae I need to work out how to model it. Backscene repainted and the river has been poured by The Fatadder, on Flickr 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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