The Triang wagon that is in the current Bachmann range

[roythebus]

On 03/09/2020 at 18:12, BernardTPM said:

If anything is significantly out on the Triang Hornby version it is likley to be the buffer height as the model dates from their era of raised buffer height.

Triang have always had raised buffer height from the days of Rovex.

 

[roythebus]

So, apart from the small dimensional errors, presumably the prototype would have been built by different builders, hence the detail differences in body style/detail and different underframes? From memory the Lima version seems to have pedestal suspension.

 

What is the general opinion of the "most accurate" model?

[Enterprisingwestern]

2 hours ago, roythebus said:

What is the general opinion of the "most accurate" model?

 

Hornby for the first two batches.

Lima for the second two batches.

Both need some work, but scrub up quite well.

The Trix, Bachmann and early Triang are non starters IMHO.

I thought there was already a thread on the modelling aspects of these wagons, I'll have a delve.

 

Found one!

https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/149215-whisky-grain-hoppers/page/3/

 

Mike.

Edited September 6, 2020 by Enterprisingwestern

[BernardTPM]

4 hours ago, roythebus said:

Triang have always had raised buffer height from the days of Rovex.

Except that the cast metal chassis inherited from Pyramid had correct height buffers and lasted even past the introduction of the Mk.3 coupling.

[Ruffnut Thorston]

20 hours ago, roythebus said:

Triang have always had raised buffer height from the days of Rovex.

 

Apparently, this was mainly to allow for the movement of a locomotive front bogie (Princess) on a the start of a standard Incline, using the Tri-ang Railways pier sets.
 

I think this was the reason put forward in one of the many books, possibly one of the Book of Trains issues, possibly the 1979? Issue...the one with the list of R numbers in the back.

 

Logically therefore, it should date from the introduction of the Incline piers for Universal / Standard Track?

[Il Grifone]

It would be about then. I can't remember if my new R.226 Utility Van (1957 with Mk II couplings) suffered from over height buffers. (I think they do. I didn't notice it then, but I would have been only 10 at the time.) The vehicle in question has long since lost her original bogies in favour of something more accurate. For a (long) time they were Farish 8 foot die-cast (SR pattern from an ill-fated 60s coach kit), but I have acquired some CCW (I think -  they have the characteristic screws which hold the things together and provide equalisation) Fox bogies and a pair are allocated.

Some bodging would have been necessary to allow clearance under the floor for the deep flanges in any case. Undersize wheels helped but not enough.

Somewhere I have an untouched (maroon) example, but which box????

 

Very early Princesses have small wheels, as befits their H0 scale (If you can discuss scale with these things), but I think the fitting of larger wheels also occurred about the same time and could well have caused problems (and would have lifted the buffers). Perhaps the piers were just an excuse?. On the other hand, an abrupt change from level to 1 in 20, especially if sharp curves are involved,could well cause problems. (Dublo didn't seem to have problems with their inclined piers, but perhaps the high cost and late introduction meant they didn't sell enough of them for any to show up.)

 

I can't be more precise on dates etc. as I am back in Sardinia and my Tri-ang 'bible' has gone walkabout anyway. (SERIOUS! but I only realised the day before I returned and had even more pressing matters like clearing away a room full of train boxes....)

 

[Ruffnut Thorston]

Yes, the Hornby inclines were only introduced late on, and they were the Hornby Acho ones from France.

 

Though Hornby Dublo never made incline or high level piers For 3- rail track, they did make that girder bridge.

 

The original Tri-ang Railways piers for Standard track should work with Hornby Dublo 3-Rail track, as they have retaining strips to suit the Standard track base.

 

It is worth noting that Tri-ang Railways never made any piers for Series 3 track. 
 

It was expected that any elevated  track would make use of the existing Standard track, with the piers and sidewalls.

 

 

 

Edited September 8, 2020 by Sarahagain
Typo

[Il Grifone]

I have two almost complete sets of Tri-ang piers, plus most of a girder bridge* and the hopper loading/unloading set - the British version, though I do have a T.C. hopper car - in bright orange!

Calculating  a gradient of roughly 1 in 20, rather put me off setting them up.

 

* The wooden base has warped badly and needs replacing - not a great problem as it's 1/8" plywood . More serious is that one of the trusses across the top is broken and the other is missing completely. I could always use a Dublo one of course. It was in the Tri-ang range for a while (in plastic IIRC).

Edited September 9, 2020 by Il Grifone

[Ruffnut Thorston]

The Tri-ang girder bridges we have have proper wooden bases, not plywood.
 

The top cross girders do crop up in amongst various bits and bobs on eBay, and at fairs, when they are running....
 

The last of the Dublo Girder bridges were plastic. I wonder if there were any of the metal versions sold in rebadged, Tri-ang Hornby labelled, boxes?

 

 

[Il Grifone]

Perhaps mine was already a replacement or possibly it was solid wood and I don't remember correctly. Anyway it was warped lengthwise and got thrown out. Had I been clever, I would have taken the measurements for its replacement!

 

I have been looking for the cross girders for ages , but no luck so far. The one I have has the little clip missing from one end. It's quite delicate, so I imagine the fault is common.

 

There's a complete set here (less the sidewalls - these are uncommon, I suppose pocket money didn't run that far. IIRC the complete set up was quite expensive.)  https://www.ebay.co.uk/c/22003646669

Edited September 10, 2020 by Il Grifone

[Ruffnut Thorston]

Dimensions of the base timber for the Tri-ang Railways Girder Bridge.

 

Length 13 inches (380 mm)

 

Width 3 inches (75-76 mm)

 

Thickness 1/4 inch (6 mm)

 

Red Cedar type stain.

 

(Tri-ang found out that Creosote attacks polystyrene plastic, after trying that out on the first production bridges! 
So, a reddish brown stain was used instead...)
 

Planed smooth Softwood.

 

I took these measurements from an unassembled bridge in our collection some  time ago now.

 

At some point I need to source a base timber for the set of sides in our collection. 
 

I haven’t done it yet! 
 

The clip part of the cross girders does snap off pretty easily when disassembling the bridge, or if something drops onto the top...or the complete bridge is dropped upside down...

 

That bridge on eBay is 3 screws short!

 

There should be eight screws.

 

That’s an interesting set of separate boxes. 
 

The sidewalls would be another box, or maybe two...I think they came in trade boxes of 6 walls, three pairs. It’s been a while since I looked at ours...
 

There was also the “presentation set”, a BIG box set, which did also include straight sidewalls.

 

This was also made using the Super 4 track piers and Straight sidewalls, with the centre infill strips.

 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2020 by Sarahagain
More added

[Il Grifone]

It's been a while since mine had a base. I do recall that it was plain wood with no trace of stain, so perhaps it wasn't the original ?

 

From the January 1962 PRICE LIST

 

R.77 Bridge supports (2)               4/1
R.78 Girder bridge                       12/5
R.89 Straight side walls (2)           2/6
R.90 Curved Side Walls (2)           2/6
R.179 Curved Side Walls LR (2)   2/11

 

These are marked 3 for Series 3 track, but presumably also fit Standard (as shown in the instructions. The R.79 Inclined Piers have disappeared, to be replaced with Super 4 components later in the year. Embankment sections were available however (Rubber IIRC)  at various prices around 10/- or so.

 

That 14 sets of walls are required, at 2/6d a shot, explains their rarity today. (A 1962  shilling is about a pound today.)

[Ruffnut Thorston]

Yes, those sidewalls are the ones introduced, in grey, for Standard/ Universal track.
 

The sides have a recessed panelled effect.

 

Originally the panels were smooth, later versions have a “concrete” grain effect to the panels, with the edging remaining smooth.
 

 

[Enterprisingwestern]

 

As per the original title of the thread, I didn't realise that Bachmann had inherited the inclined pier system from Triang and were currently selling it!!

 

Mike.

[roythebus]

Somebody's taken a wrong 'un here mate.

[Ruffnut Thorston]

The traditional Thread drift...or mission creep? 
 

From buffer height, to incline, to Incline piers, to girder bridge....

 

I suppose we are guilty as charged m,lud...

[Il Grifone]

I've said before It wouldn't be RMweb without going off topic.

I always treat it as a discussion/conversation between friends....

 

Re the over height buffers, I've just replaced the wheels on a Tri-ang R.52 3F 0-6-0T with the later Hornby ones (correct number of spokes and much finer tyres) and this has has enabled me to lower her body a bit on the chassis. An enormous improvement!

 

[andyman7]

As the OP I'm impressed it's still going!

[PatB]

On 11/09/2020 at 04:52, Sarahagain said:

 

(Tri-ang found out that Creosote attacks polystyrene plastic, after trying that out on the first production bridges! 
So, a reddish brown stain was used instead...

The fact that it had a similar effect on 8 year olds was, of course, of no consequence in 1950whatsit . 

[Enterprisingwestern]

9 hours ago, Sarahagain said:

The traditional Thread drift...or mission creep? 
 

From buffer height, to incline, to Incline piers, to girder bridge....

 

I suppose we are guilty as charged m,lud...

 

It was just a tongue in cheek observation, long may they continue!

On a serious note, the interesting information on inclined piers etc is somewhat hidden in the "wrong" thread.

 

Mike.

 

 

[Ruffnut Thorston]

The incline piers information is now un hidden...