JZ Posted July 10, 2010 Share Posted July 10, 2010 Has anyone built a wagon lift for their coal tower yet? Pictures please if you have. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JZ Posted July 13, 2010 Author Share Posted July 13, 2010 A few questions regarding coaling towers. Firstly, did the all have adjacent ash towers ? Secondly, I want to build a wagon lift/hoist for mine, but I cannot find any photo's. If anyone knows where I could find one, I would be grateful. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonB Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 A few questions out of ignorance more than help, .. Do you know of a prototype of a wagon lift at a coaling stage / tower? Would this be a straight lift to tender height, or a wagon tipping unit. If the latter, for side or end tipping? My impression is that the norm was wagons were delivered up a ramped siding for manual discharge. I have photos of a GWR tower at Wolverhampton and a distant shot of Bescot. Neither of these two appears to have an ash disposal facility alongside / adjacent. Sorry to not be more help. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bike2steam Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 I have been trying to scratchbuild a LMS type 2 coaler for a few years now, a long protracted affair, luckily non essential as yet. But the over head side tippling is a ###### to get right, my first attempt has been scrapped as it just wasn't working right - I will have another go again, when I get the time. I would suggest to anyone seriously interested in this kind of project to get the Wild Swan Publications series on LMS Engine Sheds - invaluable, the types, and variations too complicated to set out here. Just suffice to say Bescot's 'Welman Bucket' was unique, wagons lifted, and side tippled into a coal hopper at low level where the coal was then lifted again into the loco tender/bunker. And yes there was an ash plant there, a big one - right next to the coal hopper, with two metal frame gantries.I remember it well, as I watched it working many times. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free At Last Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 Here are a few pics of the wagon hoist from the tower at Carnforth. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 Not a drawing but (a usually reasonably reliable) artist's impression from the dear old Eagle of fond memory. http://www.freewebs....Locomotives.pdf Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JZ Posted July 13, 2010 Author Share Posted July 13, 2010 Is the wagon held solely with it's brake ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free At Last Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 Is the wagon held solely with it's brake ? I am assuming also, by looking at this drawing and the way the platform is pivoted, that when the hoist is lifted the wagon leans into the cradle, like here. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
70022Tornado Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 Warning - Attn the "Mods" I regret to say that when I linked in to 34theletterbetweenB&D ULR to the old Eagle drawing above my Virus Catcher reacted, flashing up "potentialy unsafe site" and refused access. 70022 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Y Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 Seems OK at this end; it links through to a pdf (a very useful one). The virus catcher may have freewebs.com blacklisted due to other freewebs sites' contents. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JZ Posted July 13, 2010 Author Share Posted July 13, 2010 All useful stuff. Thanks for it so far. Does not look as if it will be that difficult to to knock up something out of plastrut. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonB Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 The photos above are of plant a bit more recent than the one in Ned Williams' Wolverhampton book which I have, and in my Bescot photo taken in the 1950's. The latter scanned from a battered print. (attached below, it did appear in RMweb2 [it seems] ages ago!). The negative must be in my "filing system" somewhere........ 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
barrowroad Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 These photos are excellent.... do you have any more especially of the top section of the hoist mechanism? I have a type II coaling tower on my embryonic Barrow Road layout which I intend to make part operational but am finding photos of this area difficult to obtain. BTW when were they taken? Robin Here are a few pics of the wagon hoist from the tower at Carnforth. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free At Last Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 These photos are excellent.... do you have any more especially of the top section of the hoist mechanism? I have a type II coaling tower on my embryonic Barrow Road layout which I intend to make part operational but am finding photos of this area difficult to obtain. BTW when were they taken? Robin This is the only one I have of up top. I think I took them sometime circa 1990. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
barrowroad Posted July 14, 2010 Share Posted July 14, 2010 Thanks for this one, I will now see if I can work out how the tipping mechanism works. I was in Carnforth last year but unfortunately the site is no longer accessible to the public. I understand the Coaling Tower and Ash Plant have concrete cancer. I think I need to contact the owner and seek permission to view and photograph the tower. If you have any other shots of the Coaling Tower and Ash Plant I would appreciate looking at them This is the Barrow Road Coaling Tower - photo courtesy of Terry Nichols Robin This is the only one I have of up top. I think I took them sometime circa 1990. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free At Last Posted July 14, 2010 Share Posted July 14, 2010 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
barrowroad Posted July 14, 2010 Share Posted July 14, 2010 Many thanks - much appreciated. Robin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bike2steam Posted July 15, 2010 Share Posted July 15, 2010 The photos above are of plant a bit more recent than the one in Ned Williams' Wolverhampton book which I have, and in my Bescot photo taken in the 1950's. The latter scanned from a battered print. One of the best printed examples of a pic of Bescot shed is that in Michael Hales small paperback 'Steam In The Black Country' plate 18. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JZ Posted July 17, 2010 Author Share Posted July 17, 2010 All of these photo's have been extremely useful. I can now start building a hoist to fit the Hornby tower and while it won't be a copy, it will follow the principal. Again, I would like to thank those who have contributed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JZ Posted July 17, 2010 Author Share Posted July 17, 2010 This is what I have come up with, using Plastrut, Evergreen strip and Will's sheets. Obviously not in it's intended location, but when there, I will build a pit for it to drop into. Still needed are cables to haul it up the ramp. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jamie92208 Posted July 18, 2010 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 18, 2010 That looks good. I'm not sure how the wagon was secured when it tippled but it must have gone past the horizontal and be going on towards vertical. There was a barge lift at Ferrybridge Power station that worked on exactly the same priciple but with 200 ton capacity barges. At the top there was a counterweight that the barge came into contact with as it started to swing past the horizontal. This then acted as a clamp to keep the barge in position as it tippled. Very simple with few moving parts. The counerweight was housed within the top of the mechanism and didn't travel up and down. I was able to photogrpah it when it was working from inside the building. (Quite scary when you see a barge that large being upended just in front of you.) If youa re interested I'll try and find the negatives and scan them and post them. The bargbe lift is no longer in use. Jamie Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted July 18, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 18, 2010 That looks good. I'm not sure how the wagon was secured when it tippled but it must have gone past the horizontal and be going on towards vertical. There was a barge lift at Ferrybridge Power station that worked on exactly the same priciple but with 200 ton capacity barges. At the top there was a counterweight that the barge came into contact with as it started to swing past the horizontal. This then acted as a clamp to keep the barge in position as it tippled. Very simple with few moving parts. The counerweight was housed within the top of the mechanism and didn't travel up and down. I was able to photogrpah it when it was working from inside the building. (Quite scary when you see a barge that large being upended just in front of you.) If youa re interested I'll try and find the negatives and scan them and post them. The bargbe lift is no longer in use. Jamie Strange to relate I have just been reading about a model (7mm scale) of a coaling tower in the modelling section of a wartime edition of 'Railways' magazine. I'm not sure if it is prototypical but what the builder of that tower did was incorporate a bar in the tippling part of the mechanism. When the wagon reached the top of the lift the bar lay along its centreline and prevented the wagon from going right over as the tower's tippler mechanism operated. In other respects - judging by the drawings used to make the model - the tippler mecjanism was little different from that used in ground level tipplers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
spackz Posted January 1, 2011 Share Posted January 1, 2011 That looks very good, i've just brought the Hornby coaling tower with a view to detail it, sorry to bring up this thread again but does any one know where in respect to the coaling tower would the ash plant be. Would the ash plant be situated over the same line as which the wagons were loaded onto the coaling tower? ie basically using the same line to unload coal but to load the ash. Cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted January 1, 2011 Share Posted January 1, 2011 Would the ash plant be situated over the same line as which the wagons were loaded onto the coaling tower? ie basically using the same line to unload coal but to load the ash. Possibly (there is always going to be one!) but the arrangement of shed yards were more often based on the process. To minimise conflicting actions. The process of fire drop/ash removal/cleaning was usually undertaken when the loco was first brought on shed (following turning). It then being sheded or stored under power of residual steam. Engines would then be cleaned again and watered and fired before coaling and sent on duty. (generally) A quick look through a few yard layouts deems to have the ash plant on a separate road from the coaling plant. Though there may well have been examples where the constrictions of the site and access may have resulted in different arrangements. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johntur Posted March 7, 2011 Share Posted March 7, 2011 That looks good. I'm not sure how the wagon was secured when it tippled but it must have gone past the horizontal and be going on towards vertical. There was a barge lift at Ferrybridge Power station that worked on exactly the same priciple but with 200 ton capacity barges. At the top there was a counterweight that the barge came into contact with as it started to swing past the horizontal. This then acted as a clamp to keep the barge in position as it tippled. Very simple with few moving parts. The counerweight was housed within the top of the mechanism and didn't travel up and down. I was able to photogrpah it when it was working from inside the building. (Quite scary when you see a barge that large being upended just in front of you.) If youa re interested I'll try and find the negatives and scan them and post them. The bargbe lift is no longer in use. Jamie Hi Jamie Could you help please i am building a coaling tower for my model rail lay out, and i am stuck with the securing of the wagon at the top of the tower when it tips, look forward to hearing from you regards john Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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